Aby The Liberal

795 Responses to “India vs Pakistan - Evaluation on Military Strengths”

1. # Aby on 12 Dec 2008 at 1:48 pm

   I regret to announce that we’ve had to delete all previous comments in this post because of a few technical issues. The number of comments (at 622) have become so large that several readers have been reporting an inability to view or load this page. Hence, we have had to undergo this sacrifice, to keep the page and its discussion alive.

    

   For anyone who wishing to have view of the past comments, Google has an older cache of this page. Click the link here to view that page.

2. # ujjawal on 13 Dec 2008 at 3:42 pm

   nice data coolection

3. # Imran on 14 Dec 2008 at 2:21 pm

   Being a Pakistani I know how much strong our Army Airforce & Navy is. But it always disappoints us when we see our country is run by corrupt government. Who has nothing to do with our country. One thing I do like Indian Gov may be corrupt but they dont let their country down.

4. # nikhil on 14 Dec 2008 at 6:14 pm

   hi i would like to add to the comment made by imran….. its nt abt da gov…..its al abt the citizens of both country who can make country a lively n peacfull place…
   military power is jst to show bt da unity is da real power…..
   i wud like to ask u sumthng mr imran…..y pakistani people nt taking any action against gov or dis terrorism who even targetting pakistani soil……hope u dont mind…

5. # Indian on 14 Dec 2008 at 9:54 pm

   There is no doubt on the stark military imbalance in favor of India. Whereas India has let-be the situation in Kashmir and focussed overwhelmingly towards development, there is hardly any development that Pakistan can boast of. It is sad to know that the once rich cultures of places like Karachi, Lahore and Rawalpindi are fast disintegrating due to utter economic neglect. Not because Pakistan cannot do anything, but because they do not want to do anything. Pakistan is a victim of suspicion by its own accord - and to counter this, whatever little money it has / gets, it feeds to its ever increasing army hardware needs. As there has not been any major war ( in military sense) between India and Pakistan since 1971 - it only goes to say that the money spent on hardwares since 1971 -last 35 odd years, is purely down the drain. Of course same applies to India too, but being a larger country, its focus on development has reaped rich dividends. India today counts, in many a fields. Software, Bio-Technology, Nano-technology, Space Technology & Automobiles being just some of the key areas. And all we get to hear about Pakistan is terror, terror and terror. As an NRI, the only thing I hear about Pakistan in foreign media is about its nuclear threat. In such difficult times, both nations have top most priority - to fight poverty existing in both the nations; more so in Pakistan. Unless Pak is looking forward to being a dishonorable example of failed state down the lanes of history, it needs to wake up - real fast - and re prioritise its spendings and objectives of being a nation. It has some really good natural resources, and key location between the west and east Asian nations - it needs to harness these good points and work towards a developed future for its own children’s and sake.Hope sense prevails on both sides, so far as war is concerned. Good Luck. Indian.

6. # adeel wali on 15 Dec 2008 at 2:13 am

   I have would tell nikhil something, look man i dont like those people who cuss at each other for countries cause that gets you nowhere, im sure we can be open with each other and discuss the matters. I agree to Imran how our government is corrupt, but 1st, the people of pakistan dont have the power to take the politicians down because they pay and earn alot. 2nd why we dont take action against politicians is because our politicians have no power, you might belive Mr. President Asif Ali Zardari is in power but let me assure you He’s not. General Perveiz Musharraf is still camoflauged behind the army and still under control for the army and Our army runs the nation, the politicians are just there to show! 3rd point, why we dont take action against terrorism is because WE are not the terrorists, WE are blamed as terrorist just like IRAQ because its a leading muslim nation, these federal agencies like CIA, MI5 etc cannot allow a muslim nation in power and these people make the attacks, if you go search videos on youtube you will find so many mistakes, example: Bush lied about 9/11 LIVE and got caught and confessed! It is total bullshit and we do try to prevent terrorism as much as we can, tell me something if Osama bin ladin was in pakistan, wouldnt we take the 2 indian air force aircrafts down already and start a war or purpose when they entered pakistani airspace by so called ‘technical difficulty’? But at the same time im sorry we cannot allow any other nation to come into our house and kill people by the name of cleaning the terrorism because same thing happened with iraq on the name of terrorism they came into iraq killed so many people to find so called ‘weapons of mass destruction’ then apologized saying there wasnt any? Im sorry but i dont think u would let them kill your mom or sisters or brothers for this.

7. # jitu on 15 Dec 2008 at 4:47 pm

   quoting madeline albright(fmr sec.of state os U.S)…….” pakistan is an international migraine”……..is absolutely correct…..but it’s not the fault of the pak government…bcoz it’s not even calling the shots……it’s the ISI and the army that’s behind this dastardly act……and i think that although both the armies are very powerful….but a war would certainly be disastrous……what we should follow is coercive diplomacy…….bcoz the pak economy is very fragile…….we should give the pakistani government and the people atleast one chance to prove themselves and by going to war we would be playing into the hands of the militants…….and the end i just want to say that it’s so ironical that two contries with so much in common and so close is yet so far and so different…………

8. # Hammad on 16 Dec 2008 at 9:11 am

   Dear All,

   Why don’t we just learn to live in peace. The only thing that comes into our mind lokking at Pakistan & india is War or tense terms moving towards the brink of another warfare.
   Indians should forget about the day dreams of destroying Pakistan ,while Pakistan should also focus upon buidling relationship with neighbours, look what we have given to our people —- We are talking about Soft Ware, Bio technology etc but at the same time look at the misery of the people looking well below the poverty lines in the same cities, Can we deny that ?

   Time to think !!!!

9. # ABHIMANYU PESHKAR on 16 Dec 2008 at 11:29 am

   I read the above comments. With those my opinion is that our country has been a big power from history (a golden sparrow before mughal empire) and now also after bieng ruined by two foreign rules, we have developed ourselves very significantly .This development is not only due to our politicians but is mainly due to by our own majority of people and our zest to see ourselves on our old status of a super power country .And this is the main difference between my country and Pakistan.

   Though we all are aware of the today’s fact that our standing is far behind U.S. and Great Britain but I would like to assure all my people that one day we will definetly at zenith .And this has been proved by our development from last 60 years (inspite of facing big and tiny wars with China and Pakistan).

   Along with these we have several problems in our country like over population ,terrorism, riots etc. And we all know that there exist a single main reason behind all these problem which is responsible for that and those are some people who dont want peace in our country .Here I should say that India can beat international terrorism alone but it is very difficult for us to arrest those who are responsible for our domestic terror . Unfortunetly they are also called Indian citizens like us .Though we also dont want to live with those people but few of our politicians are supporting them just for their vote bank.This shows that political condition is very pathetic in India .But I assure all my people that definetly some day we will kick those people out and save our country from being ruined again.

   Now by discussing the main picture of our topic, our Defence in one of the big defence in world and let me clear the fact that our one soldier is stronger than 10 soldiers of enemy. So I can proudly say that we are afraid of none .This may be also due to our acheivement that we have friends and allies every where in this globe (unlike those people who have fought atleast one time with each and every community on this world) and for rest(i.e. our foes) they cant even dream to be aggressive towards India as they all are aware with the strategic power of we Indians .And this is the fact that we can be proved victorious on our enemy in just one week.

   I am regret if I hurt feelings of few gentlemen.

10. # G.VINOD on 16 Dec 2008 at 12:51 pm

    Degrees in Pakistan:

    B.E - Bomb Engineering
    B.Tech - Blasting Techniques
    M.B.B.S - Member of Bomb Blasting Society
    I.I.T - Islamabad Institute of Terrorism
    N.I.I.T - National Institute of Insurgency and Terrorism
    B.Litt - Bin Laden Institute of Terrorism
    C.A.T - Career in Al queda and Taliban

    If the Government of Pakistan is not willing to act strongly on terror then
    they can offer courses in their universities such as the above.
    I think they might have already started doing it since there is a doubt on their
    credibility on the issue of terrorism.

11. # Monis on 16 Dec 2008 at 2:32 pm

    @ ABHIMANYU PESHKAR and G.VINOD

    Keep Day Dreaming you little head big mouth People and we always slapping on your mouths lolllz…….

    have a good day………!

12. # M.Robinson on 16 Dec 2008 at 2:44 pm

    At the onset of independence India inherited an existing running bureaucracy, an armed forces setup b the British and over seventeen ordinance factories. Pakistan was created with no running bureucracy, army had to be created from military personnel that emigrated to Pakistan. There were no major educational institutions pre - partition in the Pakistani provinces. India recieved major backing fom the USSSR as well as the British. For a ‘democratic’ state it carries out extra judicial killings on a massive scale(see Amnesty international reports). 500 million Indians live below the povert line, the evil caste system still exists, reports of lower caste women being gang raped by upper caste men are brushed aside under the parlour of ‘ we are the worlds largest democracy and we shall learn and deal with these abuses’. These abuses existed before partition and 60 years on from independence are still in existent. The concept of Sati, whereby a childless widow would throw herself on the burning pyre of her dead husband is making a comeback with the backing of Hindu fundamentalist groups.
    The amount of propaganda in the world one would assume that India is a land of milk and honey and Pakistan is ruled by fundamentalists. The truth is more bitter because it was a hindu fundamentalist party(the BJP) brought into power in India by the majority of Indians, whereas no religious party has ever held power in Pakistan. The problems in Pakistan are many, one is that people vote for idiots, who are incapable as politicians ( most are feudal landlords), their assumption being that because they have attended a western educational institution, thereby they know better.Do not be the monkey, rather the organ grinder.
    India calls itself democratic, but in reality ‘its the abused who has allowed itself to become an abuser’ i.e Kashmir, Assam, Nagaland.
    In Britain the union has lasted for 300 hundred years, but in the end the Scots and Welsh will move to absolute self rule. India should learn from this, you cannot have a forced marriage because it ends in acrimony and hatred. The Kashmiri’s on the whole do notwant to be a part of India, and the majority of Indians know this to be true, yet you still stick your heads in the sand thinking that its a lie perpetuated by Pakistan. The granting of independence to Kashmir by BOTH India and Pakistan, will not mean disintegration of either country, rather it will pave a new path on cooperation, primarily in socio-economic, as both need to provide justice, peace,education, jobs and food for their respective populations. This can only be done by tackling the issue that is at the heart, Kashmir. A policy whereby an independent Kashmir would remain neutral and not have any strategic partnership(militarily) with a single player, but rather Pakistan and India would be guarantors of Kashmiri inpendence. The only way of dealing with ones problems is to deal with them in sensible manner. Look at Europe, plagued by wars, but the last sixty years has brought prosperity to its citizens.

13. # ALLAH 768 on 16 Dec 2008 at 5:31 pm

    Islamic terrorism will never die until it destorys the whole world. Amin.

14. # nofal on 16 Dec 2008 at 7:31 pm

    @ G.VINOD

    Pakistan does act on terrorism.I think that India needs to act on terrorism because the terrorist acts that where done were carried out in India.

    @ M.Robinson

    nice work I totally agree with you.

15. # hamza on 16 Dec 2008 at 7:48 pm

    In the name of Allah one person, he named himself Allah768, make a false comment. I think, he is not a muslim because a muslim never call themselves Allah. He numbered 768 instead of 786. Poor ignorent person!!!
    U r requested pls Dont mislead people!

16. # Rajesh on 16 Dec 2008 at 8:53 pm

    Pakistan needs to do a lot on terrorism. Pakistan has been facing political crisis for the past 15 years. There is no one person in pakistan who takes moral responsiblity of what is happening. Where is Pervez Musharraff? Where is Nawaz Sheriff. It is hard to believe on Pakistani leadership. According to me only thing that Pakistan can overcome terrorism is stop religious teachings in Schools and colleges and bring a good leader who can work towards maintaining peace in the subcontinent.

17. # M.Robinson on 17 Dec 2008 at 3:26 am

    Jingoism is fine tuned to fool the masses.All those at the top of the power base use certain events to bring in draconian measures , while the masses are being scared out of their wits. In Britain the government is thinking of bringing in I.D cards. Its being touted as a panacea against terrorism. We already hold passports, the latest ones with biological data. So why create two systems?. In India TADA rules were brought into effect, the primary target of these laws were and are muslims. What people need to understand is when mine or your government makes up rules, we should think of the consequences. Our Government(British) was training Taleban members 6 months prior to Afghan invasion!
    With reference to morality, which Indian politician has got up and spoke against the extra-judicial killings by the Indian armed forces in Kashmir, Punjab, Assam etc. In China the Tibetans and East Turkmens(Xianjiang province) are becoming miorities in their own lands, they are denied the right of free speech, their cries for freedom are drowned by the crackle of gunfire from the military. This is no different from what India is doing in Kashmir,Assam.
    People hark about islamic terrorism, yes there are certain people who use religion as a tool for their own ends, A example close to home is Northern Ireland(Catholics and Protestants). Much of the Buddhists of India were wiped out or forcibly converted to Hinduism. The U.S and Canada are ‘democratic’ but are built on the murder and destruction of the native Americans, as is Latin america, and australia. Was it muslims who murdered Native American women and children, was it muslims who wiped out the Aborigines of Tasmania. There was a time you could fool some of the people for some of the time but not all the people. In modern media the select few are making fools of us, and when they fire up the drums of war, it will be mine and your children that will be sacrificed not theirs.

18. # Adn on 17 Dec 2008 at 9:00 am

    Vinod

    Normally our words are reflection of our minds. You wrote which you saw in India about the Degrees.
    I don’t know why you always said that “Pakistan have terrorists” .

    Let Me tell you about your innocent terrorism …..

    - What are you doing in KASHMIER since last 50 years. And independent survey declared that there are more then 89% People in Kashmir want to get lost India from their land. And till now you have killed more then 10 lakhs innocent peoples. It is very simple to understand that people of KASHMIR don’t want you to come in. This is the only reason you are facing resistance from the peoples since start, until you have a lot of Army over there. Now you are arranging a fake Election. In which less then 4 % people didn’t use their vote rights. Please try to saw the real pictures.
    - In India more then 80 Freedom movements are operating. Why you don’t control that? And you can not. This is only due to your biased and narrow mind attitude..
    - I am strange about you when talk about “terrorism”, What you did in “Gujarat” in your own country? Was that a game?
    - Your involvement in “FATA” and “Baluchistan” areas? This Is’ not a terror campaign……….
    - You killed a lot of Christians and Sikh Communities some time ago? What was it?
    - Yesterday Your Defense Minister “Mukherjee” I think stated that, there is no involvement of any Pakistani in this terrorist attack. I don’t how fool your media is creating a disturbance among countries relations. Without proof and evidence you were blaming. It was ridiculous. Our public in Pakistan was complete ready for War, due to this media propaganda.

    I don’t want to led down you. This site is really good plate forum. I think that WAR and TERRIORISM is not in favor for both of us.
    I agree with you Unfortunately since a long time we are facing very drastic problem of a insecure Politicians / leaderships. Hope it will be ended by a revolution formed by Public of Pakistan soon.

19. # Amy on 17 Dec 2008 at 10:35 am

    Kashmir has been historically independent. Despite its independence from both Pakistan and India, Pakistan not only attacked Kashmir, it asked for British military assistance to ward off an impending Indian counterattack. Kashmir’s ruler was Hindu who signed an agreement to accede Kashmir to India in return for Indian military assistance against the attack from Pakistan. Pakistan also attacked East Pakistan. Whatever the motives, what [West] Pakistan did in its own country–East was still Pakistan–was reprehensible. Pakistan has no moral authority over claims of independence from Kashmir quite frankly, it can’t be trusted with any form of governance of Kashmir; the simple fact is that Kashmir wants nothing to do with Pakistan anymore than they like India–and given their relative weakness and proximity to both India and Pakistan, their survival as an independent nation state is extremely unlikely. The entire argument by Pakistan rests on the premise that Kashmir’s majority is Muslim. That’s fallacious.

    Pakistan has no central government, but in fact, three: the intelligence community, the military, and the occasional civilians.

    Sure, India has problems–Pakistan has more. India is economically stable. Pakistan is almost a failed state. India has terrorism problems, mostly from abroad, and some misguided Muslims that are home-grown terrorists. Pakistan has helped create them using covert ISI networks to be used in proxy wars because India outranks Pakistan in every military aspect. Now that Pakistan is allied with us since 9/11, the very monsters it helped to create are attacking it. Quite ironic.

    The nuclear option is a lose-lose scenario for both India and Pakistan, but more so for Pakistan, given its small size. Ultimately, Pakistan needs to focus on economic and infrastructural development. There is no reason why the two nations can’t live peacefully together–and I say this even when I know that’s not going to happen.

20. # G.VINOD on 17 Dec 2008 at 11:10 am

    My comments was not to offend and I regret if it had hurt any one.

    Monis
    I din’t day dream but just feared that Pakistan will go into the control of
    the terrorists if it did not act strongly. Remember you are a nuclear power
    and it will be a disaster if those weapons go into the hands of terrorists.
    A recent report say that Bin Laden had tried to contact your Nuclear
    scientist Mr.Khan for getting the weapons.

    Adn
    When India got Independence there were 90% Hindus in Kashmir and
    do you know what is their percentage today? May be 2 or 3%!! Do you
    know what happened to the remaining?? They are driven away from
    Kashmir by infiltrators/other terrorists/ those who call themselves as Muslims
    (but they are not) and the Hindus are living as refugees in other states of
    India. Many terrorists/infiltrators from Pakistan were killed by our army and
    in that process innocent civilians are also killed, which happens during an
    army operation. There were 15% Hindus when Pakistan got Independence
    and now there are only 2%. Do you know that the population of Muslims in
    India is rising by 1% each year? Can you show one Islamic country
    in the world which provides Haj subsidy for Muslims? India, though
    which has 85% Hindus, provides Haj subsidy. Hindus don’t get any
    such subsidy for their pilgrimage. Can a Hindu ever become
    a President/Prime Minister in Pakistan?? We had great Muslims as our
    president in the past and we are proud to say that.
    The violence in Gujarat and other parts of India are carried out by
    some senseless political elements and don’t think that India supresses
    the minorities. Muslims/Christians and all other minorities enjoy more benefits
    than the majority Hindus in India.
    The terrorist who was captured in Mumbai has said that he belongs to
    Pakistan and has given his address. Some independent journalists have
    confirmed meeting his parents in the same address and his parents also
    have confirmed that the misguided youth is their son.
    By saying all this Iam not giving any religious angle (I don’t believe in religion)
    but want you to understand that we are tolerant. India is also ready for a war but
    war will serve no purpose and there wont be any winners in a nuclear
    war.

21. # ABHIMANYU PESHKAR on 17 Dec 2008 at 1:01 pm

    ohhh!!! I am sorry if I hurt people!!!My meaning was not to blame particular!!!!
    But with the coment of Mr Monis I can advice only one thing that you should compare your country and my India by independent sources but not by your own made prejudices!!!

    After that you will come to know “who are little head big mouth people…..”

22. # Adn on 17 Dec 2008 at 1:46 pm

    Mr. Vinod

    - Forget about our Nuclear Weapons. Its none of your concern. For you kind info Our Nuclear weapons and technologies are in absolute safe hand rather then you. You should take care of your own and try to avoid to provide your extremist Hindus organizations.
    - Its strange to know that when India got independence, there was 90%Hindus. Would you please tell me from where you got this completely fake facts. Please refer. I think it should better go to Kashmir if you visited. Right now 79% of all peoples are Muslim which is being decreased by 91 % which was before independence. And till first day of unauthorized capture of Indian in KASHMIR, how is it possible to evacuate Hindus from there? Tell Me
    - As I said earlier that 10 Lakh Innocent people is killed by your Army in Kashmir till now. These figures are those which are countable and uncounted you can not imagine. If 90% were Hindus then how is it possible that people will fight for their freedom. I don’t why you don’t want to accept the reality. And always try to defend the wrong. I think its by default. No body want to leave their homeland. And they will not. You can better have example of your drama election in KASHMIR.
    - Well I know that how much you prefer to Muslims and other communities in India. Your Media is totally reflecting against of your image. What you are doing with Muslims and other communities in India. Every body knows that. This is the only reason right now there are more then 80 Freedom organization are working in your areas.
    - You are talking about the Hajj Subsidies, do you have idea about the criteria of Hajj policies in Iran , Malaysia, and in Pakistan and other countries? If you want to know I will tell you…. You are protecting Muslims. What happened with “Babari Mosque”?
    - If Muslims population is increasing 1 % yearly. Then what about your average increase which is more then 2% yearly. So you want to take it in your credit. Strange……..

    Finally facts which are true, we have to accept. Otherwise History is too cruel and big learner.
    No doubt war is not in favor for both of us. We have to face some more extra challenges which are increasing day by day interim “Hot Water war” between the world Giants. Obviously we south Asian will suffer.
    Personally we have lot of clashes, which can not be resolved. If we live in our limits and patternize our working in friendly environment. ….

23. # Hammad on 17 Dec 2008 at 2:01 pm

    Friends & Foes from India,

    I know we have very few friends now and lots on the other side—

    I just ask you all, Can we afford to take our countries into the battlefields again —

    Our friends indians think that they will take on Pakistan thus taking the revenge of the sub-continent partition, where india was divided into smaller peices —
    Pakistanis feel that thay have to seek revenge of 1971 ,where they lost their eastern wing, resulting into bangladesh !!!

    Can both these nations afford further disintegration- - - It is inevitable for our friends in india where they really need to learn a lesson from their former friends the once mighty U.S.S.R — the socialist rich culture which was proudly depicted by the mighty U.S.S.R shattered into pieces in less than a decade— What was the base , the dividing factor of RELIGION , LANGUAGE, CULTURAL NORMS . My friends are we looking for another disintegration in the future, remember india is also depicting a similar model state like the mighty U.S.S.R , the amulgum of LANGUAGE, RELIGION, CULTURAL NORMS will be finding it’s way if not today than in the coming future ———-

    Remember, the ONE which can disintegrate once can be disintegrated again and again that too on the similar or different grounds——–
    Time to wake up before it’s too late —

24. # Well-Wisher on 17 Dec 2008 at 6:31 pm

    I am Hindu and I have got lot of good muslim friends in India and overseas. As far I know them, they are all Gem in characters and attitudes. I also had read some level of Koran as well to my knowledge. I saw there are plenty of good doctrines and philosophies written there. Somehow in history, even from Prophet Mohamad (pbuh) era there are many fights and hardship methods had been used to spread the religion, subsequently terrorism also stick onto it in recent centuries. If your God Allah the Almighty can answer all your prayers, please pray harder to wipe off this terrorism from your religion. It will bring good name to your people & religion, and rest of the world will start trusting & respecting all Muslims in the world. And Indo-Pak conflict also will disappear automatically. God Bless all of you.

25. # Rajesh on 17 Dec 2008 at 8:15 pm

    Adn
    Why not talk about religion when it comes to Pakistan. Pakistan was created out of hatred when some muslims wanted a seperate state. For your information muslims living in India are more than Pakistan. About 89% people whom you say want India out they are all muslims. Please put your mouth shut when it comes to seperatism. You say we killed Sikhs . You dont know anything about post independence history. Pakistan provided arms to Sikhs in the 80s. We emerged victorious eradicating terrrorism in punjab. Today it is the most peaceful state in India. Pakistan favours China not knowing that one day they would get a severe thrasing . Pakistan gave away 100s of sq kms to china just because they can have enemity with India. I cant believe how anyone can compromise on their motherland. This happens only in Pakistan.
    You people killed Million in Bangladesh just because you could’nt govern the country. You blame us on this. If India would not have intervened you would have killed the entire country. India was in a very powerfull position and still is . It could have accessed Bangladesh to it. But no we did’nt take even an inch of land. We are facing problems from Bangladesh as well and why again Islamic terrorism. I hope you have any answers to this.

    Long live India(from 5000 years and still booming)

26. # Prashan on 17 Dec 2008 at 9:08 pm

    @adn
    Today i saw a news and was shocked hearing that Pakistan top the list of “Exporters”. I was wondering how it would be possible, so again i read the news and finally understood that Pakistan started exporting thing called terrorists and now they even became no 1. All pakistan want is to be a proud nation no matter what you people do. You better layoff Kashmir issue. Its none of your business. If you really caring for genocide then why the hell are you supporting America who is killing more muslims than any other country could do(all u need is bloody money). You people are not really muslims, u just pretending to be muslims. All Pakistanis thinking that kashmir is the only muslim state struggling from other religions brutality. You must look at baluchistan and see how people are turning against Pakistan. If you people looking for liberty of Kashmir valley. Then do it first to Baluchistan. The whole world knows that Pakistan is the worst and the most dangerous country in the world who is manufacturing terrorism. If world need to be peace then Pakistan should be wiped off from the map, then we will give full autonomy to Kashmir. Because there will be no more threat of terrorism in the world after the end of Pakistan. You are just beggars, begging to all muslim nations for money to feed your people but then use the money to buy destructive weapons and boost terrorism to fight against India. Feel sorry for the innocent people dying of hunger. Nobody wants pakistan. see no cricket playing country wants to tour pakistan. You people must feel shame for calling you pakistani until you put an end to terrorism.

27. # M.Robinson on 17 Dec 2008 at 9:25 pm

    If an individual takes time out and asseses what happened in a historical context, then one could come to a reasonably sound conclusion. In relation to the creation of Pakistan, one has to go back in history, ideally 1857. In what we the British refer to the Indian mutiny(or war of independence to others), the overwhelming soldiers and instigators who took part were muslim. Upon putting the mutiny down, the colonial power went about destroying islamic infleunce within the muslim community(over a period of 60+ years). The British Indian army was not allowed to have units consisting of mainly muslims. There were mainly Hindu regiments, or Sikh regiments but there was no muslim regiments, muslims could only be part of mixed regiments. The British knew that to allow single muslim regiments would mean an uprising against British rule. Well before partition, there were many meetings to try and leave India as a single unit. It was agreed that the India would be a union of states, where each state would have its governing authority, rules and regulation. This the Muslim league agreed upon, but as Mr Jinnah and Mr Nehru stepped outside to meet reporters, Mr Nehru said ‘things can be changed after independence’. Its at this late hour that
    the muslim league became suspiscious of Mr Nehru and congress’s real intentions.
    The case where Pakistan ceded land to China has to be reffered to history. The Indian Chinese border was drawn up by us the British, at a time when China was weak. The Chinese approached the Indian goverment in the late 1950’s to correct as what they saw as an injustice(and rightly so), the Indians reacted hastily and inappropriately, by setting up border posts and getting their military ready for a showdown, then ofcourse we had 1962 indo-sino war, where India was humiliated with losing over 6 Thousand square miles and a similar number of soldiers. Pakistan on the other hand had very few friends, was under US sanctions. Pakistan was therefore more sensible in sitting down with China, and yes they ceded some territory to China but received terrritory as well(but not on same scale).
    India as we Know today was the creation of us the British, It has never existed as a single entity, not even under the Moghuls. Thats why there are so many languages and different cultures in the Indian subcontinent. If India had been a single entity then would not be these major differences in language and culture. We the British were in India for 200 years and introduced English , now English is prominent and more Indians are Learning the Language.
    I recall when India during the 1970’s was meddling in the internal affairs of Pakistan(primarily in the Sindh province), a reporter asked Mrs Indira Ghandhi, why India was interferring in the affairs of a sovereign state(Pakistan), Mrs Indira replied that Sindh was an internal matter of India! As Malcolm X said on the assasination of JF Kennedey, ‘The chickens have come home to roost’. The Indians have been interferring in the affairs of Pakistan. Like it or not the Pakistani’s are returning the gesture.
    If it were not for Afghanistan, Pakistan could have become quite well off economically.

28. # G.VINOD on 18 Dec 2008 at 8:10 am

    M.Robinson
    Instead of trying to put all the blame on India (in India-Pakistan conflicts)
    it would be better if you just accept that your country was responsible
    for all the problems which the sub-continent faced in the past 200 years
    and still losing thousands of innocent lives. It’s all because of your divide
    and rule policy which has put us in such a sad situation in the sub-continent.
    We are also seeing your country’s good support for the U.S in its mindless war
    in Iraq which killed millions of innocent people.

29. # Monis on 18 Dec 2008 at 8:44 am

    @ M. Robinson

    Nice Working on history…..

    @ G. Vinod

    Be Brave Man Face the Truth…….

30. # prem on 18 Dec 2008 at 9:24 am

    M. Robinson,

    The recent blast a few years ago in London was done by whom? The britains have tracked them to be muslim terrorist. Now tell me do you accept this claim from your government that the terrorist were muslims? They also have the identities of those terrorists and also have the information that they were trained in Pakistan.

    * If you accept, then it becomes quite evident that muslim terrorist were involved and were linked to pakistan. Then why do you defend pakistanis in saying that India is baselessly blaiming pakistan?

    * If you don’t, then I am afraid my ignorant friend that you do not have faith in your own judicial and investigation system. In such a situation you are considered as a traitor for your nation.

    Do you know that there are many muslims fundamentalist in UK whose aim to make UK an islamic country?

31. # G.VINOD on 18 Dec 2008 at 10:27 am

    Monis
    What you mean by facing the truth? Is it to face the coward terrorists coming from
    Pakistan and killing civilians in India in the name of Jihad?

32. # G.VINOD on 18 Dec 2008 at 10:43 am

    Adn
    The problem of terrorism in Kashmir started in the year 1989 and I referred
    the population of Hindus until tht time only. After 1989 they were kicked out
    of Kashmir by the mindless terrorists who infiltrated from Pakistan. Fearing
    the bullets, the Hindus had no option but to take refuge in other Indian states.
    There is no report on the number of people killed in Kashmir and I don’t know
    from where you get these fake details (Pakistani media?).
    Do you know that the particular state government was dismissed after the
    Babri Masjid incident? All the organisations which participated in that
    incident were banned for several years. I can say with confidence that
    hundreds of temples were destroyed in Pakistan after 1947. Has any action
    been taken against such incident/outfits which destroyed them?
    Don’t give wrong information about Kashmir if you don’t know it properly.

33. # Adn on 18 Dec 2008 at 12:58 pm

    G. Vinod

    Whatever i quoted fact and figures before that was true and based on authentic reports.
    So you are talking about 1989? What about last 40 year from 1989? …. So strange…Well this is your fake Indian media telling you .. like “Chacha Rehman” .. etc ..

    Its looks funny your media propaganda even they should some since make a strong background if you they to
    I don’t know why you cannot understand and i think don’t want to understand and realize the fact about KASHMIR. If the people want to live with India then why they always resist to Indian Army? And how rudely your coward army killing Kashmiries local innocent peoples.
    You can not even release a small part of Kashmir with your Large army / weapons etc. The reason is only people really hates you. And you should realize that.
    You are saying that Pakistan is a by production by the British. ha lolz
    What about past 800 Years when you were living here without any reason / identity. and living here being a poor nation. what you say about it?
    You are talking about the terrorist coming from India? I think more then 20 days has been passed. Did you even provide a single evidence?
    You are talking about the strong Economy.. let me tell you some thing about your conditions.

    - 30 % of your people living below then the poverty line.
    - About 3 Million people has HIV.
    - 3rd bigger World Corrupted country.
    - You talk about your strong Democracy. Let me tell you about your democratic behavior. Gujarat incident was one of most deadliest incident due to high number of peoples killing among all the democratic countries. You have killed rudely Sikh and Christian communities.
    - And you said you product to say that your president was Muslim. And Why don’t you feel shame on above incidents. And for your kind info In Pakistan Mr. Bhagwan Das was Chief Justice of Pakistan in 2007. And did you ever heard that Hindu community is being killed in Pakistan?

    Dear its natural phenomenon that people always defend their self. Most important is that defend always what is right. What I have in mind since my birth that India is our Enemy. We have to fight with them.
    Otherwise we both don’t have not any benefit form each other. There is not any particular reason of war between us rather then Superiority complex and the conflict which I got in heritage …………….. Further I really don’t mean to hurt any body…. But I want to skip it out….

34. # Monis on 18 Dec 2008 at 3:09 pm

    @ Adn

    GREAT JOB BUDDY………………………….:)

    @ G. Vinod

    What can I do for you my janu…….?? I really feeling odd for your kind self, sorry to say but you Indians really living in a dreams paradise without a single genuine reason…….. Some time I feel strange that what kind of education is being provided to the Indian youth about their history… India (as today) was never ever exist since the past 5000 years, there was hundred of different states in this part of the world where today is Pakistan, India & Bangladesh.. The first time united India was formed after the Muslims conquered the sub-continent. So, don’t forget to your past as your ancestors were thirsty of each others blood.

    Please Please Please…. learn from your history.

    Best Regards

35. # Intennsive on 18 Dec 2008 at 3:13 pm

    mr Britisher

    Your history is much too distorted. Britishers were/ARE those cowards who came to the subcontinent for “trading”. And all the works that they did in order to expend were to help them and not help India by any stretch of imagination.

    What do you mean when you say : “The British Indian army was not allowed to have units consisting of mainly muslims. There were mainly Hindu regiments, or Sikh regiments but there was no muslim regiments, muslims could only be part of mixed regiments. The British knew that to allow single muslim regiments would mean an uprising against British rule.”

    Not allowed to have Muslims? What does this mean?
    I’ll tell you what it means. It means that the British asses were so smart that they quickly realized that in order to not to lose control over India it has to divide and rule. And what better way to divide people than religion?

36. # Rajesh on 18 Dec 2008 at 3:41 pm

    Adn , Monis
    Sorry to say you that you are kept in dark . You are either not following the latest development or you want to ignore it. Right from day one Ajmal Kasav that pakistani idiot from Faridkot in pakistan we have been telling you about it. Your media does not want to provide you with that info. As i said in my earlier comment that we have a history or 5000 years if you want to explore it go to Mohenjodaro in pakistan now and explore the books on Indus valley civilization and you will come to know how rich and famous were the people. We still are .

37. # Jack on 18 Dec 2008 at 4:17 pm

    I think when talking about injustice in Kashmir Pakistan should look into its own history
    and see how they butchered bangladeshi men,women and children and raped their own muslim people. Cowards could only kill innocent people as they are doing till now and when brave indian army came they quickley surrendered. i have only one word for them Cowards.

38. # Jack on 18 Dec 2008 at 4:30 pm

    well i really laughed when i read pakistanis stating that any war against Pakistan would be against china. First of all they should learn to protect themselves and not run cowardly towards their illegitimate daddy china. secondly even china cannot do so openly just to help Pakistan because India has similar treaties with Russia and Israel. So Pakistan should look to defend themselves first from bigger inner threat of extremists and than look to challenge mighty India.

39. # M.Robinson on 18 Dec 2008 at 4:35 pm

    Ofcourse Britain ruled India and did some very mischvevous things, but that is the nature of all powers, if India had the economic and military power then I can say with great certainty that it too would do likewise. The concept of power is to have it and not to relinquish it, at the same time trying to make sure others cannot reach your level. We the British did, so did the French, Dutch, Russians etc.
    During the 15th century, we(British) used to attack Spanish ships laden with gold from Latin America, this was state sponsored.
    Some may call this piracy or an act of terrorism. So England ended up with a war with Spain(the Spanish armada), ordinary people do not know but it was the Ottoman Turks who helped England against the Spanish!
    The reference to 5000 year history does not belong just to Hindu’s as some would suggest, but rather to Jains, Sikhs,Muslims but especially the Buddhists. Mohenjodaro was a Buddhist city, not Hindu. The Sikhs and Muslim are the offspring of Hindu’s who converted. They are not some foreign element who took land from Hindu’s. The Pakistani’s irrespective of which religion they belong to are indigenous to the lands, in no way did they steal or usurp the land as is regularly suggested.
    The current state of problems in Afghanistan are due to the short sighted policies of the US and Europe during the days of USSR occupation( India supported USSR Occupation). Pakistan was left in the lurch, with 3 million refugees, warlords fighting on its border, which led to more refugees. Pakistan took upon itself to either accept the situation or do something about it for its preservation. The Indians did not like that as Pakistan could rest easy with its back to Afghanistan.I take no pleasure in seeing civilians die. I would like our(British) government to recall our Forces from Afghanistan.

40. # Rajesh on 18 Dec 2008 at 4:57 pm

    Robinson
    My Friend your comments
    The reference to 5000 year history does not belong just to Hindu’s as some would suggest, but rather to Jains, Sikhs,Muslims but especially the Buddhists. Mohenjodaro was a Buddhist city, not Hindu. The Sikhs and Muslim are the offspring of Hindu’s who converted.

    Sorry you have an incorrect idea about it. Mohenjodaro is not a buddhist City. I am very sorry. You are very much wrong on that. Buddhism is less then 2000 year old . Lord Buddha did not preach anything he followed way of life(Way of Non violence and peace). Many kingdoms followed his way of living and it had a different identity. Ashoka the great had control over entire Persia (now Iran and Iraq) and also afghanistan as well . Sikhism was again not discovered it was a way of life that Guru gobind singh led about 1000 years back. Some Hindus and Muslims started following it.

    To conclude Hinduism is not a religion for your information it is a way of living. And its a living with peace and harmony.

41. # ABVHIMANYU PESHKAR on 18 Dec 2008 at 5:28 pm

    M.ROBINSON
    I am sorry but I feel that you are speaking in not the language of Britain; are you really British or your ancestors belongs to some other countries!!!!

    Again I am sorry if I hurts you!!!!

42. # Well-Wisher on 18 Dec 2008 at 5:52 pm

    In India Hindu & Muslims were living as brothers, during British rule they slowly put poison into us and promoted the split. Indian Islamic leaders were adament to go separate even so many pacific attempts made by Congress people at that time. In the ecstsy of eaten British poison, they went separate as per their own wishes. What they they achieved until today after separation? Put fire everywhere while separation and made a permanent Hatred, spent billions of money to procure weapons, produced nukes, made few wars, allowed terrorism to grow, introduce unrest in Kashmir, being permanent headache for its neighbor, etc, etc, etc. Nothing constructive, but all destructive things.

    As far no one has seen the God, religion is just only a belief and its level changes from person to person, we no need to give so much importance to that. If India never split during 1947 and we don’t take religion as a big issue, the benefit of unity will be ours. We no need to spend so much money on war game. Both side people would have reap the benefit and would’ve came up long time ago. What problem in living together? Allah, the almighty God is there for Muslims, and Lord Krishna & Supreme God Shiva are there for Hindus, Jesus is there for Christians. The world also comprises of different religion, races and doing all kind of business together and while all can run smoothly, why we Pakistanis and Indian can’t live together and furthermore even belong to same race? Why keeps on talking bad and developing hatred? Rejoining India+Pakistan+Bangladesh+Nepal+SriLanka as one country is give more advantage for us in many ways. We can achieve more things than what currently getting now. More we split, more we lose our strength, and other countries will take advantage of that. How America formed, different states came and join together to form big and strong country. Why we don’t learn from them. Why are we always talking about splitting, fighting, religion, nukes, terrorism, etc and why don’t think of rejoining? We can make our own history. GOD BLESS ALL OF YOU!

43. # Monis on 18 Dec 2008 at 5:56 pm

    @ Rajesh

    Ah…….. only the Indians are Right and Rest of the world are wrong… how fool you are Rajesh infact I really did not find the level to argue with you and your fellows.

    Sorry Buddy….. oops sorry if mind the word ‘Buddy’.

44. # Rajesh on 18 Dec 2008 at 6:32 pm

    Monis
    I was just trying to tell the fact to the world. Iam not trying to justify myself . M Robinson may be just the world for you people but not for India. British are gone. We cannot get them involved. They can’t solve our problems. We need to work on it. You know why the coalition forces are in Iraq and Afganistan ? Because they are quite far from them. You are our neighbour and its very difficult to fight a neighbour. When neighbours fight the entire region is affected. What do you think fighting in Iraq and Afghanistan Americans and British and loosing anything . Not at all. They are fighting a easy battle. Just find yourself how difficult it was to fight Ireland for British and how difficult it is to fight Mexicans for Americans. Tons of Narcotic trade take place on southern US borders. Why cant they bomb them . No they cant because of few people they cannnot initiate a armed conflict the neighbouring country.

    In addition to this Bring that fellow Jaish e Mohammed chief Maulana Masood Azhar to justice. What do you have to say on that.

    We had every nonsense from you people right from sending terrorists into India , Hijacking, attacking places of worship every nonsense. Time for you to improve and show results .

45. # nofal on 18 Dec 2008 at 10:05 pm

    I know that the people who attacked Mumbai are Muslims but I’m not sure if they are Pakistani.

    Most Muslims in India are discriminated against.
    Hindu nationalists kill and TERRORISE Muslims and Christians in India.

46. # Hammad on 19 Dec 2008 at 8:55 am

    This to Mr Well Wisher ———-

    I believe that all your well rather ILL wishes to be confined to supreme lord krishna and supreme god krishna —– i find it so cheap — You have yourself created a sharp niche by enforcing words to a specific religion , the rest of the religions are GREAT too —- this indicates nothing but a shrewd sick hindu mentality of propogating their own religion and degrading rest of the religions ————
    No wonder the biggest conversion from one religion to another was hinduisam to islam and christianity and others ——–
    No wonder all the rest of the religions in india face discrimination be that Islam , Christianity or even Sikhism ——

    Kindly decide by yourself ——————————–

47. # G.VINOD on 19 Dec 2008 at 9:02 am

    After the terror attack in Mumbai India had requested Pakistan to send its ISI chief
    to India for a joint investigation and the President of Pakistan accepted to send him.
    The next day the Pakistani government took an U turn and said that the ISI chief
    won’t be sent to India but instead an official from the ISI will be sent. Why did
    they went away from their word??? If they are not helping the terrorists and
    innocent why can’t they co-operate with India?? Instead they just sit there
    and ask for evidence.
    Recently (4/5 days back) the Pakistan Military had said that their air space was
    violated by the Indian air force but the President of Pakistan said that it’s common
    and only a technical incursion and can’t be termed as an incursion. But yesterday
    the Indian ambassador to Pakistan was summoned by Pakistan government and
    they had made a protest on the same incident.
    In another incident the Pakistani government said that Mazood Azar, a notorious
    criminal and chief of Lashkar E Toiba was under house arrest and yesterday the
    same government says that his whereabout is unknown (they have released him).
    So from the above incident we can understand that the government of Pakistan
    fears the terrorists and ISI and so they act as jokers. We can only pity them.
    It’s strange when the whole world(including the Pakistan ally the U.S and Briton)
    says with proof that the terrorists who killed the Indians in Mumbai were from Pakistan,
    the latter wants evidence!!!

    M.Robinson
    Buddha was born 500 years before Christ (He was born before 2000 years) and so
    Buddhism could not have existed before Buddha was born. You can support someone
    but that does not mean that you can manipulate history to your convenience
    to make them happy.
    Sorry to say that you are only doing what your ancestors did when they ruled
    India (spreading hatred among two communities). Do you know that even after
    partition India helped Pakistan by giving Rs.100 Crores as an aid in 1948? With
    that money Pakistan waged a war against India in the same year.

    Monis
    We are not here to compare who is good in history. You don’t have to do anything
    for me but do something for some of your misguided and uneducated youth in your
    country who take the path of terrorism in the name of Jihad.

    Adn
    It took 50 years for a Hindu to become the Chief Justice in Pakistan since independence!!

48. # nofal on 19 Dec 2008 at 10:16 am

    @G.VINOD

    ISI chief was not sent well because India was angry at Pakistan and was blaming them, i don’t think they are going to send a top chief of the ISI to a country they with which they have unstable peace.Pakistan is not behind this because it too is a victim of terrorism and please give me some solid evidence if there is any that Pakistan was behind the terrorist attacks in Mumbai.
    200 people die in India the world turns upside down but that much every week in Pakistan and nothing.
    so please stop about the stupid attacks on Mumbai.

49. # G.VINOD on 19 Dec 2008 at 10:54 am

    Hammad
    I think you din’t understand what Well Wisher had stated.
    What he had stated was,” Allah, the almighty God is there for Muslims,
    and Lord Krishna & Supreme God Shiva are there for Hindus, Jesus is there
    for Christians”
    By saying the above he only stated that Supreme God Siva is there for
    Hindus, because Hindus consider Him as their Supreme God. What is
    wrong in it? You really din’t understand or you can’t tolerate others
    saying that their God is supreme to them? See the words you have used
    to target other religion. Islam preaches to respect other religions and
    it’s regarded as a great sin if you curse them.

50. # Rajesh on 19 Dec 2008 at 1:09 pm

    To All here
    Check the latest developments in Pakistan . Ex prime minister of pakistan Nawaz Sharief as admitted that the journalists are not allowed to enter the village where that surviving idot terrorist Ajmal Kasav’s parents are staying. Pressure still on pakistan. Lets wait they say now. Early that fellow Jaish e Mohammed leader Masood Azhar was said is in custody but now it is said is not in the country. Probably Indian army has to search and find out that person in pakistan.

    I dont understand why these islamic terrorists hide and fight. Why do they dont come up in open.
    1) Idiot Osama bin laden
    2) Idiot Masood Azhar
    3) Idiot Al Zawahiri
    Many More ———-

51. # Adn on 19 Dec 2008 at 1:19 pm

    G. Vinod

    A)- You are talking about to send ISI Chief in India. Why should Pakistan send him to India? Once you have no evidence about the Pakistan involvement in these attacks.
    Pakistan is sovereign state. First you should provide proof then demand. Which have been declared by your own media in 9th December 2009. Your Media have double standards. Your Defense Minister and your Foreign Minister statements always differ to each others (See the statements of Both representative in Hindu Times in 11 December) .
    More importantly you should seriously think about your intelligence smartness. What he want to do with your internal Politics. As well as We have a strong proof your RAW & MAUSAD involvement in FATA areas. And your concerned authorities accept it
    There is no doubt right now we are being ruled by a corrupt and un fair leadership. And you people are taking credit of this un fair leadership. Due to this, others countries are thinking about to attacks in Pakistan. It funny to know that and really feel sad on our leaders. No matter it will be resolved very soon.

    B)- Your are talking about Air violation of Indian Air Force, first of all you should seriously asked once again your non technical forces. Either they don have idea about their limits.
    You said Indian Minister is being Called by Pakistani Authorities. Its purely legal and identified. You Said “Our representative said that ,this is a technical mistake by Indian Air force”. This is what I said earlier, you are taking advantage of our un fair and dishonest leadership.

    C)- You are talking about donation of 100 Crores during independence. This is totally faked which was followed by you from British. If you have reference provide me. Normally all of countries helped to others in case of any incidents morally. Like in Turkey Earth Quake, Tsunami, small countries of other worlds assist. As well during floods in your areas we provide assistance. Its Ethical. You should especially thanks to British for totally un fair division of land, Resources, Rivers etc. If they consider the people majority and land then situation was totally different.

    D)- You have totally miss perception of “Jihad”. Let me tell you bro about “Jihad”. Jihad mean to fight against Cruel, unkind, un justice. And sacrifice yourself in way of ALLAH to protect the rights. Its basic teaching of Islam and its our obligation. “Jihad” doesn’t mean to kill innocent person, whatever its related to others religions or not. Islam really respect to others religions. Its part of our faith to provide security and shelter to our Non Muslim peoples same as Muslims..

    E)- Its take 50 year to become Chief justice in Pakistan”. Sad to know about your state of mind. Mr. Abdul Kalam was the only person to become you Atomic Power. Was he elected president after 1948?. No.. This was his right. Which he driven from you.
    Once you ignore the peoples, not even give them their original and basic rights. Then moments are begin.
    You often talk about the terrorism. You really want to see terror. Then please go to GAZA and KASHMIR. In Mumbai just 130 People is being killed. And In Kashmir its routine practice and you didn’t take attention over there. Then your sense of terrorism keep quiet. Why you don’t respect to the peoples rights and majority, views etc.

52. # puneet malikon 19 Dec 2008 at 3:06 pm

    Dear Vinod, Rajesh and Abhimanyu

    I do not understand one thing. Mr Robinson seems to be very intelligent person even though he is speaking in favour of pakistan. Has he forgot about the 7th july london bombings or 9/11 terrorist attacks on America. if he doesn’t know about the terrorists behind this heinous crime, i tell the name of one of the oldest among them, his name was coward Mohammad Sidique Khan.(coward because he killed innocent people). and Mr robinson for your information his origin was from Pakistan and if you want to know about others so kindly find out urself you will know the reallity. And as far as kashmir and other issues are concerned we are capable enough to deal with. And when British came to India they came by the name of east India company for doing business. that time India was ruled by small-small kings.Even though British took a lot of time to gain control by your divide and rule policy. world knows that when Alexandre came to india he was badly deafeated by a small king called porus and he had to return from the entrance of india. You take care of your own. in one comment one is saying that india is a toothless tiger. Tiger is always a tiger, and if he has got patience it doesn’t mean he is toothless and nobody can dare to open the mouth of the tiger to check the tooth . do not worry about us. and because of our patience we indians can go anywhere in the world nobody will harm us but what about you if you people go the land of your own friends you are not safe their. You are calling mumbai attacks a security failure but what about WTC attacks the terrorists got training in America and hit back. what about this security failure. And India is known for peace not for war. when any body will hit us directly we will return the favor.

53. # Monis on 19 Dec 2008 at 3:09 pm

    @ Rajesh

    I dont know why every time Rajesh speaks harsh words and abused whom he didn’t even see…. well I think Indians are livin with Superiority complex….. but after all it is complex….

    Have a good day my dear Rajesh…

54. # G.Vinod on 19 Dec 2008 at 3:29 pm

    Adn
    It was your government which agreed first to send the ISI chief to
    India for a joint investigation and so It’s for your government to explain
    why it did not keep up its word.

    Dr.Zakir Hussain was our third President and he remained in the office
    from 1967-69. Mr.Fakhruddin Ali Ahamed was our fifth president, who
    was in office from 1974-1977. We also had Dr.Abdul Kalam as our
    president recently. I hope you can understand after seeing
    their names from which community they belong.

    Your former Prime Minister Mr.Nawaz Sherif has accepted that the
    arrested terrorist who killed many innocents was a Pakistani National.
    He has also said that his parents are not allowed to meet any outsiders
    or the media. We know that instead of checking into it you will say that
    he is a corrupt politicians and ask for more proof.

55. # Well-Wisher on 19 Dec 2008 at 5:38 pm

    @Hammad
    I didn’t expect you will take the meaning of my words so differently. Hindus got lot Gods & Godesses, and Lord Shiva is Supreme & Ultimate to all of them, that’s the reason I put the word like that. It doesn’t relate to other religions. I just gave some example of major religions in India, it doesn’t mean that we ignore others. India is the one of the historical country which gave full religious freedom to its people to think, follow and develop it, that was the reason subcontinent developed very rich cultures and indepth knowledge on religions & Gods and allowed other religions to come in to grow easily here. What about all Islamic countries, please think about it.

    Every religion has got its own values and given Golden doctrines & philosophies to mankind. A wonderful Holybook Koran came out to this world through your Prophet Mohamad (pbuh), and world’s most mercyful man who lived on the earth to whom Christians called Son of God Jesus Christ who showed the salvation for human sin, and 7 steps to reach Nirvana in Buddhism established by Great Gautam Buddha, Abraham’s Great God YHWH on whom Israelites built their beliefs, many wonderful Sages in Hinduism found a solid and indepth knowledge about God, and Monks & Philosophers from other religions came to this world to show the ways to live good & meaningful life and how to realize God.

    Arguing on religion is equivalent to banging head against hard rock.

    Whole world knows that Islam & Christianity always grab people from other religions for its expansion and contending with very poor religious tolerence. But Hinduism was built by our own and followers are also our own, we didn’t go and grab people from other religion & countries to expand it.

    Over the time everything will come to the light and natually the world will change accordingly and no one can control on it. We just live a natural life with what currently we have around us in this world, no need to fight or argue.

    GOD BLESS YOU.

56. # Indian on 19 Dec 2008 at 10:23 pm

    Hi all, message for Pak, Please do invest your money in Industry, Food, health, Education, Green planet, Anti-Global warming etc.,

    Don’t just waste your effort on spending money for fake elections. Yes pakistan didnt have any strong diplomat strategical structure for country’s development.

    and Please dont take any U-Turns as International society know the fact about Pakistan well.

    For Indians : Please dont waste your time to argue with pakistan friends about the history, culture, science, technology because they dont know what it is…

57. # Nadeem on 20 Dec 2008 at 2:58 am

    HI

    I would like to comment about a muslim behaviour even after war. When Mohammad (PBUH) started awaring people about Islam and Allah, he was strongly opposed, mistreated, hurted with stones, abused too much and even had to exile from his homeland and spent 14 years in a valley like prison in one place. He never said a bad word for anybody.

    When he got his objective with delivering God’s message to the human kind and came back with more people and more power to his homeland. He announced,

    “Do not hurt old people, ladies and kids and those who do not wish to fight”.

    After this what should I say, just one thing. These suiciders, and people killing innocent people whether in Pakistan, india or anywhere in the world, they are not muslims. Or they don’t wanna understand what Islam is. They are just being used by the people who does not want peace in the world.

    May God guide us with peace and prosperity all over the world, Amen..

58. # nofal on 20 Dec 2008 at 5:21 pm

    @ Well-Wisher

    Hinduism doesn’t grab people to convert i know that because some of them are racists and they prefer to kill them or terrorise them.

59. # nofal on 20 Dec 2008 at 5:31 pm

    @ Indian
    I could say the same about India but I choose not to because that is your opinion about Pakistan and not a fact so keep your opinions to your self and if you want to share your opinion so much tell it to someone who cares.

    @ Nadeem

    I totally agree.

    @ all Indians
    if you don’t like other Indians to debate with others then you then why don’t you just leave this site now, and your telling others that they are wasting their time then you are wasting your time trying to tell them because they obviously want to debate.

    So keep the discussion on the topic please.

60. # Well-Wisher on 20 Dec 2008 at 6:30 pm

    @Nadeem
    I agree Prophet Mohamad (pbuh) was a wonderful personality in the human history and he is the first exemplary man for every Muslim. But it is very difficult to say that every Muslim is equivalent to your Prophet in characters, attitude, and behaviours. It can be very little percentage of Muslim people trying to carry out their life same as him, the rest may be only a nominal Muslims. Now-a-days number of pseudo-muslims (clergymen, radicals, extremists, terrorists) are increasing, they abuse Islam principles and spoils your Almighty God’s name. Muslim community has to think about it and plan to root out such unwanted poisonous things and eradicate when it is smaller in size. Once you allow it to grow to some extend, then it will become out of your control, later in history there will be a permanent bad name will stick onto your religion forever.

    @nofal
    I never came across such incidents what you are referring to (racism, killing, terrorize, etc in Hinduism). Basically, Hinduism neither put conversion as mandatory nor promote it unlike Islam & Christianity does.

    GOD BLESS BOTH OF YOU.

61. # Mike on 21 Dec 2008 at 2:32 pm

    I don’t understand why Pakistanis are denying the fact that they have bigger threat from extremists than from india. they must act honestly against terrorists before its too late and before whole world acts against pakistan. Pakistan authorities please act now because even your politicians are saying now that pakistan is becoming a failed state.

62. # Mohamed Naveedh on 21 Dec 2008 at 4:09 pm

    Dear ADN,

    Mohamed Naveedh with you from India.

    What is the point in providing Proof now …. Does any thief say he stole-NO. That is what Pakistan is denying its role … Kab tak Jhoot Bolte Rahoge .. Jhoot Bole Kawwa Kaate …… We know your Tricks, Dear …. Contradictions are in your Camp. APNE GHAR KO THEEN KARNA PEHLE. Your House is/was not in order.A small Example-Why is Adnaan Sami becoming Indian Citizen, he does not want to be a Pakistani …. Did you not see What Geo TV showed about captured Terrorist or what Nawaz Sharif said …… Earlier, on many occassions, when India gave Proof, What your Govt.did !!!!! When matter got cold and focus shifted elsewhere, your Govt.quitely freed the wanted Terrorists from ‘ so called detention ‘. Even during Kargil War, your Army did not bother to take back your Soldiers to give them a proper Janaaza. No doubt,your Memory power is very weak … You should eat BAADAM, Theek Hai.

63. # Well-Wisher on 21 Dec 2008 at 5:06 pm

    @Abhimany Peshkar
    You are right, M.Robinson who is writing in this blog seems to be most probably a Pakistani settled or working in UK (or probable from China but less probable).

64. # Jack on 21 Dec 2008 at 10:02 pm

    Dont go by name M robinson is pakistani and probably jihadi supporter

65. # Vijay on 21 Dec 2008 at 10:57 pm

    China supporting Pakistan, because it is trying to suppress india and want to be equated against Pakistan and don’t want it to be treated at par with India…..

    Just like US, when time runs out and China feels there is no use of Pakistan, it will will be left alone…

    I am not against all Pakistan people…They are fellow brothers belong to this great sub continent…
    Only 10 to 20% of misguided, hatred people want to bleed India with 1000 cuts…That definitely not going to succeed…Justice will Prevail… (I strongly believe in Gita / Quran / Bible)

    1947 - Pakistan sponsored Tribal people invaded Kashmir and raped, tortured and killed 1000’s of kashmiri women…
    Kashmir Maharaja left with no option except to seek help from Indian Govt to intervene by signing ‘Acceptance to Annexure’

    1971 - Pakistan Administration killed lakhs and lakhs of people in East Bengal…which resulted in lakhs of immigrants flooding India’s West Bengal..which makes Indira Gandhi to step in for stopping the huge immigration crisis and also to stop atrocities of East Pakistan Generals…
    Lakhs of Pakistan Army men were captured PoW… one of the biggest in history…

    1999 - Whole word know who is behind this…When PM Nawaz Sherif handshaking with PM Vajpayee, General Musharaf staged Kargil Invasion with Army men dressed like ‘Militants’…And went upto ‘pressing’ nuclear button..which eventually stopped by Clinton…
    when those so called ‘militant’/'army’ men dead bodies lying, Pakistan not even accepted those dead bodies…disowning their own Citizens..which eventually burried with all religious rights by the Indian Gov.

    Since Independence, Pakistan Military Establishment (Especially ISI) concentrated only on India destabilising activities…In the process they never worked towards upliftment of their own country…And that is the reason why it is almost looking like a ‘failed state’….It has great potential to become a good and wonderful country..but very sad to see..that it is taking a completely different and wrong path…

    If both of us live in peace, we will grow sooner and result in upliftment of crores of people out of poverty…if not India will have to deal with Pakistan which is going to be a disaster for both…

    When some of you ask about Muslim rights in India…I laughed at some Pakistan brother’s concern on Indian Muslims…
    1. Most of our Bollywood superstars are ‘Khans’
    2. Indian cricket team had so many ‘Musalmans’
    3. Our President Chair decorated by true human, wonderful proud indian ‘Abdul Kalam’ who dedicated his entire life for his motherland…
    (I belong to a different religion, but for me, my true mentor and role model is Dr.APJ Abdul Kalaam)
    4. We have so many muslim crorepatis in Corporate world
    5. We have numerous Muslim politicians who got elected from Hindu majority constituencies..

    Minority ‘Indian Muslims’ have more rights than Minority ‘Pakistani Hindus’

66. # G.VINOD on 22 Dec 2008 at 7:46 am

    No Pakistani here had commented on their Ex.Prime Minister, Nawaz Sherif’s statement
    that Ajmal is from Pakistan. Mr.Nawaz Sherif had even stated that Pakistan has
    become a failed state due to its inactions to contain terrorists in its soil.

67. # Thakur Shyam on 22 Dec 2008 at 1:05 pm

    If India builds the bomb, we will eat grass or leaves, even go hungry. But we will get one of our own.’ declared Zulfikar Ali Bhutto, the late prime minister of Pakistan, the man responsible for not only enlisting A Q Khan in a successful bid to steal nuclear secrets but also for pitching Pakistan along the path of Islamic fundamentalism.
    Both his wishes have come true. Pakistan has the bomb and its people are eating grass.

    The BBC’s web site reported that quake affected residents in as yet inaccessible areas have resorted to eating grass in order to survive. The quake has once again brought Pakistan to the fore of international concerns with aid spigots being rushed open.
    Pls friends think about your people , our family not to like our family

68. # kamy on 22 Dec 2008 at 1:09 pm

    i have found in several posts that G.Vinod, Rajesh and even few others have tried their hard to explain to the pakistanis with their solid, substantial proofs and facts that pakistan is sponsoring terrorism, and no minority in india is being harrassed but only the hindu community. but these pakistanis are no way to accept this undeniable reality. they stand adament to face the reality and do golmol talks. someone say islam teach only peace then why they dont follow their god and just keep moving on the path of terrorism. why do they wish only their islam to survive on the entire globe. why do they kill the innocent animals on their festivals on the name of “sacrifice” instead of sacrificing themselves or their beloved. in their family even a child learns to kill an animal and hit the first weapon to cut an animal that is what sets the life of him in the future that encourages him to move on the path of terrorism. and they say their god teach peace. hindu in indian only just burn the greeting cards, and these pakistani calls them the terrorists, if a person burning the greeting card can be given a tag of terrorist, what about the one who comes from a neighoring country and kills the innocent people. they talk about babri masjid, why dont they talk about the temples they fell down in their country and even in india. why dont they talk about the budha idol they fell down in afganistan. these pakistanis dont approach the practical approach in blogs and articles on internet, thats for sure.

69. # Abbas leghari on 22 Dec 2008 at 7:10 pm

    well its all media game, if india is true why don’t the provide Pakistan with evidance, why dont the provide western nations like Uk and USA with evidance.We can sit and talk about it.I live in pakistan and i knw how much we hav suffered due to war on Afghanistan, it was US who supported talibans against Soviet, and then later left them for us to clean. thats unfair and yes this all terrorism is due to talibans that we all are facing today.We are also victims of terrorism, and we are fighting against them but if you say we can clean them in a day then , this is not possible.
    Look such a big army is fighting in iraq against iraqis have they been able to stop iraqis from bombing, have israel been able to stop palestenians, has US and NATO stopped bombing in Afghanistan, has sirlanka stopped Tamil tigers, has Uk stopped Polish army, no its not easy to stop terrorism, because terrorist dont have the word TERRORISt written on there head.All we can do is support rather then fighting against each other.
    Beleive me , pakistanis are against terrorism, but its just few ppl who do such things, they could be from anywhere, dont u see in INDIA samhota express bombing indian EX army officer was invlolved.
    So rather then pointing fingers and threatning war, we can’t make any difference, instead of hating each other (dats wat terrorist want) we should join hands, and int he toughest condition should help each other, show them that we all are united.
    India is big country , and it is strong but u have to admit pakistan has survided 61 years having so many enemies around, so still paksitan is strng, and neither india can defeat pakistan nor pakistan can defeat india, USA failed to defeat country like afghanistan, so how could one think of india defeating pakistan.
    so dont think about war and give any suggesions you think should be followed

70. # sameer on 22 Dec 2008 at 7:55 pm

    pakinstni’s are boldy bastered persons. 1st the fires and mass killed in karanchi and then they entred in nearby countrys like afganistan and india. they are inhuman and destrictive persons.
    they think that like mumbai’s attack , they will disturb india, they forget that when they tried in bangaladesh like this india ne unko do tukede kar diya tha .
    ek baat aur kahni hai ki itihas (history) khud ko doharahta hai.

71. # M.Robinson on 23 Dec 2008 at 1:48 am

    ‘ Jack
    Dont go by name M robinson is pakistani and probably jihadi supporter’

    In relation to the above comment, would it be reasonable to summise from your argument that as i try to be truthful in reflection, that I am accused of being the above. so therefore from your comments being pro-Indian and anti Pakistani, one would assume you to be an Indian- Hindu?.
    A lot of my fellow ignorant countrymen/women take for gospel the news they receive from,Sky, BBC etc. A lot of Indians(primarily Hindi-Indians) who insult the British would in reality would like to be British. The education system, dress code and of course the English language, all copied in upper structures of Indian system.
    Fundamentalists belong to not a single religion but to all religions. The crusades carried out by fundamentalist Christians, the death and destruction, jewish, muslim, and christian inhabitants of jerusalem butchered(belonged to the wrong sects!). Do we cast all Christians into same stereotype, the answer must be No.
    the are people who are killing their co-religionists, northern Ireland, Iraq, Pakistan, and in India(upper caste Hindus against lower caste hindus). Terrorism is carried out by individuals, groups and states.

72. # kool on 23 Dec 2008 at 6:00 am

    My friends try to cool down your minds and try to live in peace these wars will not give us any thing except distruction on both side. if Pakistan capture India Or India capture Pakistan nothing is going to be good for any one b/c more than half population of both countries is already living miserable life so after such type war just think wt could happen. it is very easy to sit on laptop and make bulshits just think in war u could loose ur love once so be calm think like humanbeing just for piece.

73. # jitu on 23 Dec 2008 at 8:20 am

    robinson……u r a british and “the great indo-pak tamasha” is because of u……..so please for heaven’s sake don’t meddle in our affairs……please go and worship ur queen ……….tat’s what u all r capable of……….this is a indo-pak site….and plz do us a favour by keeping ur nose out of this site…….and to all my indo-pak brothers…plz stop fighting….we as indians should help the democracy in pakistan flourish bcoz tat’s out only option……..and the pakistanis should stand up against their generals………and plz lets keep theese “firangi chor” out of this debate….

74. # jitu on 23 Dec 2008 at 8:24 am

    oops Mr Robinson i forgot to mention that the “diamond” that ur queen has on her crown is ours(indians and pakistanis)………u gave india nothing but took everything…..so first return our diamond then talk ……..vaise bhi u talk nonsense!!!!!!!!

75. # Adn on 23 Dec 2008 at 8:38 am

    G. Vinod

    You are asking about Mr. Nawaz Sharif comments. For your kind info as ever your Media perceive hypocritically. Why don’t you consider the others representatives comments who are continuously asking to provide some evidence if you have and then willing to organize collaborate efforts to reduce terrorism.. Proofs You are trying to create since 25 days. But again sorry to say that you weak and fake propaganda Media is not capable to create truth..
    Why don’t you understand your internal political duplicity.

    What would you say about your different opinion of “Chacha Rehman” & Dakan Mujahidin” etc. As I said earlier in my previous post. Why didn’t you reply?
    You often talk about the terrorism, just saw your previous post of last months, single time you didn’t talk openhandedly and without blaming others. Similarly your concerned authorities change their statements with in day. Example and reference I quote you in my previous post if you read.

    Now situation is fully changed. Pakistan was in defensive mod since 24 days. But now due to your continuous pressures followed by Americans, we are fully prepared for war which really don’t want with you. As I said earlier we don’t have any threats from you but through bluddy Americans. Unfortunately we are badly effected by USA interference . And now you people are influencing by Americans and become puppet of their hands to realize your Superiority complex in this region.

    Further I will not blame to anyone in same topic. Including me we all are not here to accept the reality and just defending ourselves. It is useless to talk if we could not reach at any final conclusion. Once again don’t give a single chance to fckn American to involve at your region. We should save our men strength and weapons for upcoming disasters by so called super power. Which is not so far. And till if we don’t understand, then time is very cruel learner. And we sub continental peoples better knows.

76. # M.Robinson on 23 Dec 2008 at 1:35 pm

    We the British do not delve on the past but rather learn and adapt for the current and future prospeity of our nation. The Diamond in reference is the ‘Koh-i-noor’, and yes it was acquired, begged , borrowed or ’stolen’ depending upon whose version of history one looks at. The British isles do not consist of a single race, these islands have been invaded my many, celtics, saxons, romans, vikings and the Normans. All these people made Britain what it is today. India and Pakistan are capable of the same if they can work out their differences through true dialogue. Not where India just harks on about ‘composite dialogue’, whereas in actual fact this amounts to a delay tactic. The Indian political psyche is just copying the nineteenth century British colonialists. As I have said previously, Indian and Pakistani people need to realise that Kashmir needs its independence. This will go a long way to drastically reduce tensions. India,Pakistan, Bangladesh, Nepal and Sri Lanks could in essence set up an EU type framework, but this can only be possible if India does not bully or is seen as the local bully.
    I just read on a news website that the largest mosque in Kashmir was padlocked shut by the Indian security forces, now if this had been a Christian church or a hindu temple being shut by muslims, then this would have been news of the day with headlines blaring of Islamic bias against others. I have read history, and if someone truly compares the different ages of religious control, then from my educated prospective, the muslim were the most tolerant of others. Thats why christian communities a thousand years old still survive in muslim countries. The Jewish communities exiled from spain, were welcomed by the Ottoman empire(Islamic Khilafate run on Sharia law), this was 500 years ago tolerance.

77. # indian on 23 Dec 2008 at 4:12 pm

    In bombay blast 15 indians died in sathrapathi sivaji railway station.9 are muslims.but baster ajmal(terrorist) says i came here due to our muslimes are not treated very well.. some of them mention india against muslim. in pakistan how many hindues are there,all are died.i dont want anything about pakistan. dont meddle in our affairs.thats all

    if i am in leader of my country means i dont think pakistan as a enemy nation. if any one in my country say “pakistan ke gindabad” means i wll kill them through a law otherwise i should shift them to pakistan..if terrorist attack us means i should immedately destroy them where ever they are..

    we (india and pak)are lack due to the terrorists. dont spend lot of money to military. spend for education

78. # Rajesh on 23 Dec 2008 at 4:32 pm

    hello Everyone
    Now i can clearly state that M Robinson is only a name in Britan. In fact he might be a true Muslim and a good support of Jehad.

    M Robinson as you call yourself tolerance was never a accepted in Islanic society. Just calculate the amount of hatred that is prevailing in the middle east for Jews. There are hardly an Christians or Hindus in any islamic nation expect for Somalia which we see also on fire because of communal tensions.
    About your comments on the largest mosque in Kashmir. Its called the Hazratbal shrine. You know what in early 90s islamic terrorists were operating from the mosque. 1200 terrorists heavily armed with AK47 and grenade were arrested inside the mosque. Over 150 killed in the operation. Can i ask why were they holed up there. Let me tell as might not because you are true believer of Jehad. Religious places are more safe for anti social elements.
    One more reason they try to take seige is because the mosque has a hair of Prophet Mohammed. By taking this mosque under control they can get the Islamic nations focus on Kashmir.
    You keep talking about dialogue and tolerance . We had initiated and completed enough. It now that Pakistan needs to show restraint and tolerance.
    Hope your next comments would not be on religion and fanatics. We are tired and hate discussions on that . We had enough of it. Everyone has their own choice of living.

79. # A proud Aryan on 23 Dec 2008 at 5:27 pm

    It is more than evident here that an ordinary educated Pakistani(i m assuming the ones letting their audacious and extravagant voices heard here are educated, atleast from pakistani standards) has his first alphabets learnt as:HATEINDIA. I am utterly disappointed and repentent on being not only an indian but a citizen of the globe in general that had the architects of an islamic and sovereign PAKISTAN been enough far sighted and logical(which they clearly weren’t as is evident from the current state of affairs in pakistan which can be termed chaotic and even that would be an understatement given the no. of suicide attacks it faces for reasons of islamic radicalism and caste based shia shunni divide, and the dismal record it has had in dealing with terror and in turn fostering it to persue its insane intentions of breaking into the indian territory)the world would hav been a much safer place . In the present scenario, the world community has finally come to the long awaited and legitimate conclusionthat if there is a country that is a threat to global peace -it is PAKISTAN. With the diplomats of all the countries using not a suggestive but a threatening tone to let the ones calling the shots in that pathetic country know that the world can no more suffer the repercussions of their nefarious agendas .Had PAKISTAN been a positive and progressive minded state, it would have kept abreast of india in terms of its economic status and having a say in global affairs to the extent that india has had and wil hav in the years to come.
    To Mr. Robinson’s views al throughout, i would say that being an englishman (which i very much doubt), you would be aware of the fact that
    according to one of the statements given by ur PM Gordon Brown :three fourth of the terror attacks had PAKISTANI connection
    and were conducted by AL QAIDA. Now would al ur historical archives overchadow the fact that Pakistan is a muslim state and AL-QAIDA is a jehadi outfit. So should i assume that you are either not an english(assuming the english to be smart enough to have their prime minister say what they want to say) or are a traitor who does attach his interests with his nation’s because what you have said is unfairly loaded in their favour if anything , or you are not an english at all but a pakistani who has spent the entire life mugging the pages of history and still doesn’t have the prudence to accept things as they are.

80. # Monis on 23 Dec 2008 at 6:32 pm

    @ Rajesh, Jitu, G. Vinod, Well Wisher and all other Indians

    I don’t know why you people blaming Mr. Robinson as he is quite intelligent in all means as compare to you (Indians) and us (Pakistanis). He is the most sensible, tolerated and educated person.
    May God Bless him….

81. # M.Robinson on 23 Dec 2008 at 8:07 pm

    my reply to following comment made by Rajesh:
    ‘There are hardly an Christians or Hindus in any islamic nation’, ‘hatred that is prevailing in the middle east for Jews’.

    The Coptic Christians in Egypt were persecuted by the Catholic church(Not Muslims). The coptics number in the region of 5Million in Egypt( a muslim country), they have been hit by spates of intolerance my non state actors, but slowly and surely those individuals will be brought before a court of law, as many have been.
    The amount of Hindu’s living in Dubai, Kuwait, and Bahrain(all muslim countries) have done fairly well and many are multi-millionaires.There are no major Hindu communities in South America, does that mean that South Americans are prejudiced against Hindu’s?.
    The hatred in the middle east is against Zionisn, not against jews.You are either oblivious to history, or find it convenient to bracket yourself to other people to attack muslims generally. Jewish people have been living among muslims for 1400 years. The large jewish communities in Morroco(those expelled from Spain during the Catholic Spanish inquisition).The Yemeni Jews, The Egyptian Jews, The Iraqi Jews. Now you would ask wh did these communities leave for Israel if life was good? The answer is the setting up of Israel was done by Ashkenazi Jews(from Europe), They required the state to reflect all jews(rather than look like a colonialists outcrop, which it was), so certain bombings were carried on jewish arab communities to ferment a sense of fear. To say there was no animosity between certain muslims and jews would be ridiculous, but this was played upon by the Ashkenazi Jews to legitimise their cause, and get the arab jews to migrate.The cases of state sponsored anti jewish pogroms have all been carried out in Europe!
    The Palestinians have been expelled from their homes and their land taken from them.What justice is there for the Palestinians(Christians and Muslims), or does Indian cozying up to Israel(for weapons) make you forget about peoples rights.
    Rajesh, when you look at an issue try and understand its historical background, rather than that which you find appealing to your deluded self.
    In India there are spates of anti-muslim riots with many muslims dying, in most of these there is local and state collusion, I refer you to two major incidents, The destruction of the Babri mosque( members of Indian government were involved in formenting trouble) during which Saffron clad Hindu holy men were egging on the mobs to kill muslims. The other incident was when the state machinery was used in the murder of muslims my the chief minister of Gujarat Mr.Modi. No formal charges were brought against any one, and the silent majority of Hindu’s were so distraught and disgusted that they voted in Mr.Modi for another term!.I can assure you if that occured in Britain, many would be in prison , even politicians.
    Only a few years ago I read about a Christian priest and his two sons being burn’t alive by a Hindu mob.
    People should live and let live. The Pakistani’s need to get their house in order. By voting for pathetic people, the people of Pakistan are doing a disservice to themselves. Much of the landed gentry want to retain their control on Pakistan, and they are being helped by the US. This I fear is throwback to the era of the Shah in Iran.

82. # BHARAT on 23 Dec 2008 at 9:47 pm

    MR.Robinson

    Please do not support the musilms are being treated as harsh manner india..Because INDIAN media is more insight full it gives u information regarding this..wat abut the incidents in INDIA that are done by muslims to hindus they are also more insightfull dint u read it..Yes,i agree that some of the people may be there that has hatred to other religion but it doesnt mean that all r like that..BUT i can surely say that terrorist are like these…I think u have only read regarding muslims itself..please count the no of dead people who are HINDUS and are shot by MUSLIM terrorists..so wat will u say with these incidents..

    PLEASE do not defend MUSLIMS!!

83. # Naveen on 23 Dec 2008 at 10:10 pm

    I felt this thread is really waste of time.

    Nobody here knows history, u know what ur nation told you, so there is never any real history.

    Mr. Robinson - British ( Mate, r u sure u r getting ur salary in recession time, why r u instigating useless discussion on this thread. )

    Guys, act mature, u scream loud or low, none of you has power to dictate which country is superior or what religion is, reach an age of 60+, when you have blessed a few, helped a few hundreds then talk of religion.

    And then if there is fight between india and pakistan, dude whosoever wins would be better, i would say dont count ur chickens till they r hatched.

    If a few Nuclear bombs r exchanged then we all including india and pakistan would be like tandoori chickens.. LOL

    This thread is just another hatred forum. nothing else.

    and ya, let me tel you one fact. india gives a subsidy of Rs. 800 a month per person in kashmir where Bihar gets Rs. 80 @ max, all indians pay tax, kashmiris mostly don’t do that.

    Pakistan feels it would be like king of world by acquirin kashmir, LOL, they are just set of easy money making people.. nothing else.. they njoy the feud, they keep on getting incentives bcos of that whether it’s official from india or black money vi fera accoutns from pakistan.
    Leaders in Kashmir r millionaire, common people get killed, and those so called leaders r mashiyaah for common people.. How foolish..

    Anywhere and everywhere, there is shit.. so it’s better to ignore it.. and see the flowers instead.

    Merry Christmas and Happy New year to everybody

84. # Jack on 23 Dec 2008 at 10:17 pm

    Pakistan will never learn from their mistakes. Its useless to even talk with them and for India going to war is of no use because every one knows this attack was more on indian economy. Pakistan is already bankrupt and has nothing to lose on the other hand India is second fastest growing economy,regional power and future world power so India should concentrate on growth but must improve their homeland security and intelligence so these attacks should not happen again and keep pressing Pakistan diplomatically untill it is fully exposed. ( Most of the world know about paistan’s evil intentions anyway)

85. # Sid on 24 Dec 2008 at 2:18 am

    The problems between India and Pakistan is getting worse, doesn’t matter “We (India and Pakistan) will solve on our own” You MOFO UK AND US don’t come in between. UK was kicked out of India in 1947 So MR. Robinson don’t poke your nose in between.

    The problem of Kashmir could be solved if your mofo UN has no objection. World know’s bloody whites are main cause of all mess in the world.

    What is US/UK military doing in Afghanistan and Iran!! Bullshit!!

    Go ask yourself questions about your own countries, why the hell you come and provide your special comments to increase fire between India and Pakistan. Go wipe your mommies white asses.

    India & Pakistan ROCKS!!!

    Don’t forget you divided us and we’ll unite one day! Beware. Don’t worry about us.. brothers fight but blood is same and you never know if both really united then ONE THE WORLD YOU WON’T FIND UK AND US.

    Jai Hind

86. # Dhruv(Indian) on 24 Dec 2008 at 7:54 am

    Hmm… i have been reading the comments from a long time on this blog, but i never ever left any comment on it.
    I am totally agree with Mr. rajesh about what he said about Mr. Robinson.
    I just wanna say that we (indians) have tolerated enough already and its time pakistan should hand over all of the culprits to india or i Swear to God “WE WILL COME TO GET THEM”.
    As far as terririsom sponsered by Goverment or people of india is concern let me tell all of you that there is no such organisation exist operating at international level unlike there are many oraganisation in pakistan…. you know why? becuase india is very much capable of taking any action against culprits officially, without any help from other country unlike pakistan who is always going for back stabing activities like sponsoring terririsom, we are just being patient. Sooner or later the time will come when the world will watch the aggression and revenge of India…. just wait and watch!

87. # Adn on 24 Dec 2008 at 9:22 am

    Dears.

    Well i said earlier and am agreed with some of above comments about to spend money on peoples rather then Military.

    But
    if you are seeing since 30 days, how India is hypocritically manipulating the situation of “Mumbai Incident”. Which was completely well planned and directly relate to your internal politics as well as Superiority complex of your extremist peoples. It is authentic that Russian authorities has declared and predict 2 month ago about this Mumbai incident Planning.

    - UN is also declared that India has not evidence and Pakistan is doing level best effort to reduce terrorism.
    - Interpol has same views even he criticize to India about their fake an unjustified attitude.
    - If India will demand person from PAK. Then Pak will also demand persons like Bal Thakray and Moodi , which is directly support by your government to create disturbance in FATA areas.

    Its too funny to hear that “India will attack on Pakistani targeted areas” to reduce terrorism. I don’t know on which behalf, they are speaking like that. We don’t how come this miss understanding has crept in Indian mind. But due to Indian Media counterfeit and fake propaganda we especially thanks that ‘ whole Pakistani Nation got united. And now we are lacking in just one “ A true and fair leadership”.

    One thing its being decided by the so called dirtiest super power (US) to have war between Pak and Ind. The basic purpose of that to weak the strength of both countries to get more penetration in this area. And long term cause is to be more close to Russians and China.
    An idea situation which I talk about, please make a block of Russia / China / Pak / Indian / Iran to get lost Americans from this region.

    Regarding above posts I will not suggest that any countries should seriously think about their internal social evils / extremist peoples. We should better mind our own business. As I said earlier we don’t want to fight with India. We are fighting and will fight against bluddy US. Who is only terrorist in whole world.

88. # Liaquat Abbas on 24 Dec 2008 at 12:24 pm

    Dear i know abt Pakistan and Indian armed forces very well. As a comparison Pakistan Armed forces are better bcoz of their training, moral,loyalty and fighting for some cause. Indian Armed forces are coward and they can not face any challenge. It is my challenge for them.

89. # ajit on 24 Dec 2008 at 1:24 pm

    First of all as I am Indian and being a true patriot I always support my country by economically and physically . I went through all the comments by different individuals belongs to different countries and most of them r right .
    But I would like to introduce to u with the fact that we can not sure whatever we know on that matter because our source of information is limited we believe on news which r usually edited or manipulated by nation from security point of view .
    There might be numerous theory for making peace not only between Indai and Pakistan but in entire world :-
    If u think we can live together in very harmonious environment then u r absolutely wrong .The only way for that is whole world live together follow same standard of life ,no racial comparison , religious comparison ,no developed and developing and poor country ,but is this really possible I think no at least for hundreds of years .
    Now what ,what is the solution .There is one unconventional rule from hundreds of year which is whoever is more powerful and have more capabilities to survive take the charge .We all r cleaver and mindful person and easily come to the end of decision only India can do that if we talk abt only India and Pakistan
    And last but not least solution is Pakistan will have to cooperate with us and instead of making plan of dragging India in to trouble by terrorism be honest and ask his self whatever they r doing is right or wrong .

90. # M.Robinson on 24 Dec 2008 at 2:00 pm

    To talk of war is dangerous. As both parties posses nuclear weapons. There is no geographical distance, as both are neighbours.
    Neither Pakistan or India has the economic or medical facilities to deal with aftermath of a nuclear exchange, each would target the economic lifeline i.e places like Karachi, Mumbai etc. then there is the matter of radiation(remember Chernobyl, in Ukraine), which would affect areas depending upon the prevailing wind.

    A reply to to the comment by Naveen:’india gives a subsidy of Rs. 800 a month per person in kashmir where Bihar gets Rs. 80 @ max, all indians pay tax, kashmiris mostly don’t do that’.
    This is very similar to what we the British did in Northern Ireland, this was primarily a bribe to try and dissuade the Catholics from wanting amalgamation with Southern Ireland, and the rewarding the Protestants for their loyalty. So in essense Naveen you are admitting that the Kashmiri’s and Bihari’s in reality want Independence from India, and one of the inducement is Bribery, as well as the stationing of 500,000+ paramilitary, and military soldiers in Kashmir(see Amnesty International reports). I am not against people, only those who are hypocrites, when many have talked about being part of the ‘largest democracy’, or the ‘5000 year history’, and yet these same people allow the state to commit rapes and extra-judicial killings in their name, without uttering a word against such crimes makes you complicit in such crimes.

    Reply to Druv(indian)’I am totally agree with Mr. rajesh about what he said about Mr. Robinson’.
    Is your agreement based on the premise that a White Briton would be more pro-Indian and anti-muslim because of the bombings in London?. If so you are living in cuckoo land. My opinions are based on my knowledge of history and geo-politics. I do not think of India as some holy cow, but rather the reincarnation of nineteenth century Britain, we have moved away from that so should you.

91. # M.Robinson on 24 Dec 2008 at 2:26 pm

    Proud Aryan
    ‘So should i assume that you are either not an english(assuming the english to be smart enough to have their prime minister say what they want to say) or are a traitor who does attach his interests with his nation’s’
    Firstly you should be aware that gordon Brown is not just the Prime minister of England but the whole of Great Britain. Secondly I live in a DEMOCRATIC society where I do have the LIBERTY to disagree with the government of the day. The reason Gordon Brown is saying certain things is because he’s in a quagmire and can’t get out without losing face to the Americans. I for one do not approve of our governments involvement in Iraq or Afghanistan. The Americans went into Afghanistan thinking it would be easy, as they are a superpower, and a bunch ragtag afghans won’t be any bother(remember vietnam!,). It should have been noted from history that the Afghans do not like occupiers(whether muslims or otherwise). In the current situation we the British people are fed a load of propaganda. the true situation in Afghanistan is bleak, the Amerricans have control of very little, their puppet Karzai is ineffect just the Mayor of Kabul. Our troops are based in the South, Gordon Brown and his government don’t even supply enough body armour to our troops. The Pakistani’s have a 100,000 troops fighting Al-Qaeda on its western borders. What Prime ministers say behind closed doors and what they say on television (for the home crowd) is totally different.

    Only recently the DR Congo made a request for more UN troops, but they also asked that Indian troops should NOT be sent, as it was found that they were colluding in the diamond trade with the different warring factions(which is illegal).

92. # NS on 24 Dec 2008 at 2:44 pm

    @ M Robinson
    U do not have basic rights to comment on morality and humanitarism.
    Britain has been the most imperial state for centuries. It has been the west that has accumulated all the wealth from east , now living a so called luxurious life and now boasting of its standards and customs. Why the hell you always forget that it was in search of India that America was discovered.
    The cause of this economic imbalance is the imperealistic mindset of west , still the hidden hypocracy is deep rooted in West. All nations want to develop but We Indians donot want to develop at the cost of misrey of others . The basic reason for this world misery and imbalance is not the incopetencies of the regimes, but an impearlitic attitude of west. The west is on the verge of exhaustion and let us wait and see its new approach to control the world.

93. # BHARAT on 24 Dec 2008 at 2:46 pm

    Hey people of india we know our capablilities and commitments dont waste ur time with arguing with these pakistanis..and MR.ROBINSON dont teach us ok..if u look at the histroy INIDA tought everything..and INDIA will certainly be a superpower in less than 10 years..wait and watch..

94. # Well-Wisher on 24 Dec 2008 at 4:21 pm

    @Robinson
    If you are a British, you are trying to split further the Asian countries and finding the ways to increase your weapon business. Or if you are frustrated Pakistani or other country’s Muslim, you are supporting Pakistan by promoting split of Kashmir from India.

    We Hindus and Muslims were living many hundred years as brothers, please don’t put poison on our relationships. Now it is not important who killed who in the history, we youngsters should think about how to unite back. If Pakistan never split, all the billion dollors money they spent for defence would have been saved for their own civil development. Do you think Muslims and Hindus can’t live together? As far as there is no extremism/terrorism allowed in either religion, it is very possible to liver together peacefully.

    Dear Indians & Pakistanis, if we split more and do arms race, our life quality improvement will be dragged down and most of our hardwork money will be spent on weapons. If you are Muslim, read Koran, pray accordingly, and go to Mosque, who is stopping you, and same for the Hindus as well. Indo-Pak split was a stupid idea which should have been rejected at that time. Its a fate that we didn’t trust within us.

    I pray God Almighty Allah and God Parameshwar to unite us back. Longlive Indo-Pak friendship.

95. # BHARAT on 24 Dec 2008 at 4:26 pm

    I certaily and strongly agree with well-wisher!!

96. # Jack on 24 Dec 2008 at 5:11 pm

    Guys Ignore Pakistanis as i said they will never learn even going bankrupt day by day. They cant see India progressing and are jealous of it being one of the fastest growing countries. India is future world power and should think that way. They can blast pakis anytime they want.
    For Pakistanis: Please forget about fighting with India and think about returning your loan to IMF. This time they saved you from going bankrupt and will not save you again.

97. # Well-Wisher on 24 Dec 2008 at 5:15 pm

    @Vijay
    I totally agree what you wrote on 21st Dec’ 08, lot of good stuffs which can’t be denied which are fact and truth.

98. # Jack on 24 Dec 2008 at 5:49 pm

    To Liaquat Abbas

    Who says Pakistan army is better trained than indians. This is the same misconception pakis had in 1971 and result whole world knows cowardly surrender and this your so called brave soldiers were captured and than returned by india on pakistan’s plea. (90000 of them). so learn something from history.

    pakistan govt is so scared that they are rushing like headless chicken for last 1 month. Listen to your primeminister’s speech and he called the whole world leaders to tell India not to attack pakistan and President zardari said India please don’t punish Pakistan and also said to French news channel Indian have 4800 tanks we cant stop them. See the scare on your leaders faces and than talk about mighty indian army. Live in real world.

99. # Febin on 24 Dec 2008 at 10:18 pm

    Hi Guys

    I was going through this site for the past many days well actually i dont agree with the fact that no eveidence had been given to Pakistan with regard to the Mumbai attacks. It is proved beyond doubt that the slain terrorist involved in the Mumbai attacks got instructions and commands from there godfathers from Pakistan. A perusal of there satellite phone reveals phone numbers tracing to Pakistan. Moreover, the lone survivor of the terror attack, who had been grilled by the investigating agencies including the FBI from the US have stated he have admitted to be a Pakistani. Moreover, the GPS reciever recived from the boat which the Terrosrist travelled trace its GPS navigational supports and maps originating from Pakistan.

    SO WHAT MORE YOU NEED NOW ITS YOUR TURN TO ACT. SEE YOU GOT THE LEADS AND IT IS YOUR DUTY TO BOOK THE CULPRITS.

100. # sidhartha on 24 Dec 2008 at 10:28 pm

     . People are more patriotic now a days. But this patriotism is only in website. when an indian meet another indian abroad they will turn their head. pakistani will do the same. thats their patriotism. terrorist have no category like muslim or hindu. they have their own religion and belief. terrorist doesn’t know who is hindu and who is muslim and who is christian. they only know to eliminate human beings. be a good human being first!. Dear indians dont abuse pakistanis because our people has killed lot of innocents (in gujarat & mumbai) for political motivation. that is also terrorism. we dont have any rights to speak about terrorism. first we have to eliminate our terrorists (politicians). you dont have any rights to talk about paki politicians. first we have to clean our politicians. i have stayed in several states and faced lot of bad experiences even from indians. if you go to maharashtra you can hear “jai maharashtra” slogans. . bal thackeray want only maharashtrian in mumbai. If you go to tamil nadu you can hear ” Nan Tamil da ” .:-) means “I am a tamil” they say it as proudly. go to each state u can hear a lot and can experiece a lot. whats is happening in sri lanka . who provided weapon for LTTE .? even in pakistan too we are doing some wrong things. so better to shut up our mouth in this case. our public is corrupt thats y we are facing this problem.our police man will do anything for rupees 10. i have witnessed that. first we have to clean ourself and advice others or abuse others. Lot of pakistani patients are coming to india for medical help they are saying people in india are not bothered wether they are pakistani or not. last time i remember lot of indians paid a huge amount for a pakistani baby who suffered from heart problem and i heard that pakistanis are contributing a large amount for indian charities. i think these hatred is among the politicans and immatured youngsters. i was in gujarat @ the time of riots. i could save my life because of a hindu label . i know whats happened there. my brother was in mumbai when mumbai riots happened. so he told me everything .

     i have seen aggression in all minds (paki & indian guys who commented). This aggression will make u a terrorist like osama bin laden, mullah omar,modi,advani, mushraf etc.

     for robinson.. u have done a good job. at leaset it will help some interaction among these people. these youngsters are boasting about a lot of things which they haven’t seen in their life . indians haven’t seen pakistan. they dont know what is happening in pakistan and kashmir . pakistanis they haven’t seen india and dont know what is happening there. all they know certain abstract facts which certain third rate news papers gather in each country. they are gathering these news for their existence.

     for all indians & pakistanis..

     shut ur bloody mouth!

     sidhartha…….. Not a hindu Not a Muslim Not a Christian Not a Buddhist.

101. # nofal on 24 Dec 2008 at 10:55 pm

     @Jack

     That was in 1971 India won that war because West Pakistani troops had no way of getting across to East Pakistan beside only a small percentage of Pakistan’s army was in East Pakistan.Perhaps you didn’t include that in your “Careful analysis of which country’s army is best trained.”
     President Zardari is not fit to be a president so stop talking about him.

     And I am convinced that you are an angry British Indian who wants to crush Pakistan see…

     Jack on 24 Dec 2008 at 5:11 pm

     “They can blast pakis anytime they want.”

102. # nofal on 24 Dec 2008 at 11:00 pm

     Well-Wisher on 24 Dec 2008 at 4:21 pm

     Dear Indians & Pakistanis, if we split more and do arms race, our life quality improvement will be dragged down and most of our hardwork money will be spent on weapons. If you are Muslim, read Koran, pray accordingly, and go to Mosque, who is stopping you, and same for the Hindus as well. Indo-Pak split was a stupid idea which should have been rejected at that time. Its a fate that we didn’t trust within us.
     I pray God Almighty Allah and God Parameshwar to unite us back. Longlive Indo-Pak friendship.

     I don’t agree on re joining India and Pakistan but i do agree that there should be peace with India and Pakistan and i also know until the issue of the disputed territory of Kashmir is over there wont be peace and if all of Kashmir goes to one country other country wont be happy.

103. # Bijaya on 24 Dec 2008 at 11:24 pm

     Mr M.Robinson,

     You the British, if I understand were the most horrible people in the world. You created most of the problems in this continent. Ruled India for 200 years and looted it royally. You said, you draw the border between India and China and finally did not do a good Job. So 2 nations have to unnecessarily go for a war and the people who lost their life, is the result of your mistake. Now I really don’t understand, you unnecessarily commenting in this forum, where we (Indians and Pakistanis) discussing about their problems. Again interfering and creating problems. Please stop and go back and clean your house man, you still have so much a racism in your own country.

     You are talking about Indian culture? What exactly you know man, before British people invaded this country, India was one of the richest and most successful countries in all respect. Now when you left, what did you leave, a poor and looted country. But in last 60 years, what we have build, is phenomenal. Yes we have problems, and we will resolve it. We don’t need any British advice at this moment. Please keep your advice to yourself.

     If you really want to do some good, don’t instigate the people of these two countries. I think most of the sensible people of both the countries never want a War. Its the worst thing that could happen to these countries.

     All folks here…(Indians and Pakistanis) British are excused
     Lets not blame each other and try our best to help each other so that we don’t go for a war. Let’s spread this message that, war is not going to do any good to both the countries. Let’s not talk about war at all. Lot of people get killed in war and so in terrorrism. So neither war nor terrorrism is going to help.

     As an Indian, I pray that may Allah bless all pakistanis and may God bless Indians and these 2 countries come to peace soon.

104. # prashant on 25 Dec 2008 at 1:11 am

     i want to say that we must understand that every person need peacefull living.
     neither of the country want war .nor the millitary person of both country nor people
     but these the media of pakistan are not making the local people of pakistan aware wht is going on in pakistan also in india people think that pakistan supports terrist activities. but there r many reason for thinking so .

     i think pakistani people should think for their progress and the progress of their country.and a war will certainly harm both of the country in all aspect.

     we should not foget that we are the most old civilizations.we should should make efforts for our progress.
     we should compete in progress not in weapon
     we must make life of our people better and better not under threat of war
     we want our younger generation to have a better life with peace and brotherhood
     we should enjoy diwali and eid together…

     lets tell the world and all developed countries including america that we are now aware of wht we have to do….

     let no religion be blamed of killing innocent people
     may people must understand the meaning of the holy book not just byheart it
     may the all mighty bless each and every person of india and pakistan

     may all leaders who dont think of comman man go to hell soon
     may people of both countries understand the felling of one another

     may the terrist who claim them self as jehadis understand the true meaning of jehad
     may every child in pakistan be given the right kind of knowledge
     may pakistan understand the planes of america
     may the hatred in the minds of buth country men burned

     may the innocinet killing of people stop
     may pakistan government stops supporting terrist activities
     may people understand wht is the govt of pak doing

     may comman people intrest be taken care of
     may people understand the true vale of islam

     aaaaaaaaaamineeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

105. # Mike on 25 Dec 2008 at 1:27 am

     Mr nofal

     only time will tell which troops are better trained. But even pakistan knows they cant defeat india in war even in their dreams. although I too favour peace because war is no solution but a bigger problem itself.
     so i would suggest to
     Pakistan: Please make real efforts to control the menace of extremism otherwise it will finish you.
     India: please improve your intelligence and homeland security to avoid further these kinda attacks.

106. # Rocky on 25 Dec 2008 at 2:34 am

     Hey guyz,

     Just read through the posts. I think, Paskistani people and govt are at great danger. Almost whole world is saying that pakistan have to think and take proper actions against these terrorist groups. If not then in future talibans or some other terrorist entity take over it. Any way, pakistan might think that they are capable of defending a war now but when it comes to matter they r not capable of it. Its not a random statement, go and google yourself. You will find millions of links on it. If you dont wanna believe the sources i cant help you.

107. # Well-Wisher on 25 Dec 2008 at 3:49 am

     @nofal — you will ever fall
     If India-Pakistan rejoin is bad idea and you wish Kashmir to be separate (what issue you people are talking about, it is purely a nonsense and grafted by you people).
     What about Baluchistan separate from Pakistan? And remaining Sindh & Punjab will be taken by India since it was purely owned by Hindus & Punjabis before 1947 and during separation you people murdered millions and ride out most of them to India to occupy those two provinces to make it as a Muslim’s region. The same tactics you people are doing in Kashmir too.

108. # G.VINOD on 25 Dec 2008 at 7:58 am

     Yesterday the former Prime Minister of Pakistan Mr.Nawaz Sherif made a big U turn
     from his earlier statement on Kasab’s (terrorist) nationality. Earlier he had told
     Geo TV that Kasab is a Pakistani and his parents are in Pakistan. But yesterday,
     like other Pakistani politicians, he too has asked for more proof from the Indian
     Government regarding the same. We also see the statement from the Taliban
     chief that they (Talibans) will join the Pakistan Army if war breaks out between
     India and Pakistan. We all know what type of people the Talibans are and this
     only shows that the Al-Queda-Talibans-ISI-Pakistan Army work together against
     India.
     In my opinion the Pakistani President and Prime Minister work for peace with India
     but their hands are tied by their Military establishment / ISI and so they are now in
     a helpless position to act on their own.

109. # BHARAT on 25 Dec 2008 at 7:58 am

     give us sindh and punjab..is ur govt ready 2 give..if so then will think of kashmir..till then shut ur mouth..

110. # BHARAT on 25 Dec 2008 at 8:04 am

     Days earlier prime minister or president of pak answerd 2 a question..question was “ARE U ALONE 2 FIGHT” he replied “Hw cn we b alone as china is with us”…nw see wat china had 2say..a neutral position…so i dnt think pak on his own would protect frm india if war is certain.

111. # BHARAT on 25 Dec 2008 at 8:12 am

     if war is inevitable and is in the nuclear stage the whole pak will b destroyed with the power of indian nuclear missiles…and we have the technology that only inida,israel,USA,russia have “The anti balastic missiles” which can go in countering with any weapon that can hit the missile with out even entering into india region..with 99.9% accuracy..

112. # Abbas leghari on 25 Dec 2008 at 8:35 am

     hahahah 99.9 % accuracy, come on man even US can target the areas on ground from satelites 99.9 % correctly , they missed the argets many time.untill and unless, a signal from ground is provided, how could you think of your balistic missile being accurate 99.9% go and do some survey pakistan does not hav a ballistic missile but its missile techonology is better then that of indias.

113. # G.VINOD on 25 Dec 2008 at 8:57 am

     Pakistan could not prevent the U.S air strikes (on the militants) its soil which happened many times
     recently. Sadly many Pakistani civilians were also killed in those operations. The Pakistani Government
     and the Army General would say that Pakistan will give a fitting reply if the air strikes are
     repeated by the U.S. But we have seen repeated air strikes by the U.S inspite
     those warnings from Pakistan. What were they doing when the U.S attacked their citizens??
     Now they issue the same statement against India at the time when rumours are going around that
     India is planning to launch air strikes on the terrorists camps operating in Pakistan.

114. # Ashok Kumar on 25 Dec 2008 at 10:34 am

     It is very interesting to read all the comments from so many Indians and Pakistanis. Firstly let us not forget that we were one country before partition. We have also one ethnic , religious & regional heritage before the foreign invaders brought different religions and cultures to Indian sub-continent several centuries ago. At the end of the day we all belongs to oldest civilisation in the world. That is the reason we all look similar and similar culture , food habits etc . The only thing that divides us is religion. All religions have been invented by Human Kind for the welfare of human race. It is very unfortunate that the terrorists are killing innocents in the name of religion. Killing innocents is no bravery. The right word for these terrorists is COWARDS.

     The civilised society has no place for such cowards and their supporters. India is not talking of war against Pakistsan. But the war will be definitely against the Cowards hiding in Pak territory. The people of India and Pakistan will benefits if we Indians cleanse the terror infrastructure in Pakistan. We all hope this happens sooner for the benefit of the entire South East region.

115. # Jay on 25 Dec 2008 at 11:24 am

     we all know whether we admit it or not, the terriorist were from pakistan, even the pakistani government is aware of it, naturally admitting the fact would be their last mistake, as well all know that top leaders of pakistan are like puppet, their position, their words has got no values, pakistani leaders has no values even in their own country.

     we all knows what happened to nawaz sharif, bhuto, musharaf, chief justice of pakistan (all were kicked off from the most respectful position for any country), we all know that the only alive terriorist was from pakistan, but what is the use of he being pakistani, as his government, or his group is ashamed of calling him pakistani, so according to me, his efforts gone in vain, useless, what is the value of a pakistani citizen from the view point of government top officials.

     the same thing is going to happen to zardari, if he wont take action against his own countryman, one day he would die of such attack, just imagine, if a person like zardari who could not even get hold of the killer of his wife, who could not protect his family, how can he protect his nation. even our leaders were killed, like Indira Gandhi, Rajiv Gandhi but their killers were brought to justice immediately and some of them were killed on the spot, but such thing never happened in pakistan.

     i dont have any problems with pakistani ordinary citizens, i have worked with them when i was abroad, we used to help each other, share our problems, and living a very happy days. the same thing happened before independence, Hindus and Muslim sacrificed their lives in the fight of freedom, what we have gained? with that freedom, only politicians on either side gained, we never gained anything with war, its only loss and loss, even terriorist is a human, and they die, die for nothing at all,

     today those who are protecting the terriorist group will one day find themself dead like a dog on the road…………………………….

116. # Jack on 25 Dec 2008 at 12:41 pm

     Pakistanis are dumb and will never learn. Its good america is giving them a reply every day and cowards cant do anything to americans.

117. # Indhea on 25 Dec 2008 at 2:33 pm

     Hi,

     India will bite a easy win over the Pakistan, but not with China. China is stronger than India, but not against US. The world know the secret. After the US, USSR cold war, India is now alligned with US, where as Pakistan is alligned with China, these countries will be alligned with USSR. Other side India will be part of NATO. Probably they are grouping for next world war, but there is minicule World War possible in the near future. That is against terrorism, the country don’t have power and strong economy like Pakistan, they are attempting with non-conventional war. Possibly it must be Muslim vs Non-Muslims, most of the terrorists are poor people, they are ready to die for little money for the shake of their/family survival. That is only because of Country like Pakistan spending money for military without having real economical strength.

     If Pakistan started to focus on its people growth, terrorims ends. Indian military expenses will go down and focus on its economy. It will have chain reaction upto US.

     China has a great power, but its survival is no longer assured, since their people are completely controlled by Govt and they don’t have real freedom. If any break through like student revolution will bring down China’s communist party. Of course, China’s economical growth will be shattered with NATO countries influence and business. It is very difficult to cover its boundary, almost all neighbors are enemies for China.

     Most of the countries and people thinks that their phisical and armed strength is real strength, but really forget the real strength of LOVE.

118. # History on 25 Dec 2008 at 3:42 pm

     Pakistanis are not afraid of War, we never get afraid of or fear death, Muslims fear no one but only God. If Pakistan is involved in Mumbai attacks than it is one month passed, where are the proofs?

119. # Well-Wisher on 25 Dec 2008 at 5:00 pm

     @History
     God has given a valuable soul & body to everyone and if you think it is very cheap for you, it will be very difficult to enter into God’s Paradise. Not only you, everyone in this world claim the samething that they only fear for God.

120. # Jack on 25 Dec 2008 at 5:15 pm

     History

     That is the real issue you people dont have respect for human life. you rightly said you dont fear death thats why you have new employment scheme in pakistan “suicide bombers” which are cheaply available there and that is the only thing pakis know kill innocents cowardly. YOU PEOPLE WILL SURELY BURN IN HELL.

121. # Attaturk admirer on 25 Dec 2008 at 5:21 pm

     Pakistan needs an Mustafa Kamal Attaturk now. He should be from army. Ban all Madrassas and declare a secular state. Let Mullahs be hanged if they preach violence. Secularise women and ban the burqas. If anybody talks Islam in Public kill him. Put state sponsored barbers and clean shave all Mullahs and public. Convert all mosques into schools and universities and religion be kept inside the house. I think only a crude cruel general only can remake Pakistan if it has to survive. Otherwise future is bleak and we can expect a Palestine/ or Somalia in our neghbourhood. Where is the Attaturk hiding?

122. # Well-Wisher on 25 Dec 2008 at 5:22 pm

     @Bharat
     No need to give Kashmir to Pakistan, they have nothing to do with that. Baluchistan should be separated out first and India should claim Sindh & Punjab. Then, rest of the portions only has to remain as Pakistan.

123. # Paramvir on 25 Dec 2008 at 6:51 pm

     “Recognize all human races as one”.

     All the friends and foe here..listen!
     In general, cautious people of Pakistan and India don’t want war coz they know, war is not a solution to the problem, only ‘few jingoes’ of both nations want war (dogmatic, like Bal Thakre).Media (of both nations) is also responsible for creating war hysteria.
     Well, I’m from Punjab, a Sikh and I’ve seen terrorism, those gloomy days in Punjab, although wrong policies of then Indian Govt. directly or indirectly was responsible for rise of terrorism in Punjab, but it was Pak who provide all the deadly weapons or support to mislead Sikh youths during militancy 1983-94. One of the ex-militant in our village told us that he got his training in Lahore under supervision of I.S.I in 1986.In those days, many astray Sikh youths, crossed the border and got military training in Pak and inflict severe damage to Punjab’s economy and also to Sikh community.
     So; it’s clear that Pak was or still backing terrorism. ”Pak” means devoted to the service of God or religion, but Pakistan is devoted to the service of Terror or terrorism, Pakistan needs to be true to her name by taking appropriate action against terror network, which is also eating her too, like a termite. Poor Pak is under control of General Kayani (Pak Army), Pakistan’s politicians r just reduced to puppets in his hands.
     Now, peace prevails in the region of Punjab and people of Punjab don’t want war, Punjab have to bear the brunt coz Indian govt. will use Punjab as a ‘base’ to carry on military ops over Pak , in case of war.

124. # Jack on 25 Dec 2008 at 7:39 pm

     @well wisher
     Well said They must give baloch people right of self determination before asking for kashmir. Balochistan is not going to be part of pakistam much longer.
     UN must declare Balochistan disputed territory.

125. # Jack on 25 Dec 2008 at 7:41 pm

     Anyway Baloch people dont wanna be part of failed state.
     Even Nawaz sharif agrees with this that Pakistan is failed state.

126. # Thakur Shyam on 25 Dec 2008 at 9:10 pm

     I do not feel that india will attack the pak has india has acchived what they what to acchive . India in 66 years of UN History tried to put black face on the Pak . Now India Try to make the difference between civil and Milltary Govt role in the democray pak . I these is thing india wants . But in future Independent Kashimir in India part . These may be on 2012 ,where india has enough nucler wepones and protecation shield . Be hope next govt is not bjp .

127. # Jack on 26 Dec 2008 at 12:31 am

     Pakistan is an idiotic country, the world has ever seen. It’s like unwanted child born out of British mess with Indian freedom fight. Sooner it is bombed out of shape, better it is for the world peace. If Bush have not been able to do that, Obama should do it.

128. # Canuck on 26 Dec 2008 at 4:45 am

     I suspect India might soon bomb some of the camps they believe are responsible for training the terrorists who attacked Mumbai. India has allegedly violated Pakistan’s airspace during reconnaissance flights, although that might be a claim made by Pakistan’s weak government to unify the country. My question to the Indians and Pakistanis on here: If India bombs training camps in Pakistan, do you think Pakistan will retaliate? If so, would they retaliate by bombing targets in India?

129. # Jawad Khan on 26 Dec 2008 at 10:03 am

     Mr.Robbinson… I must acknowledge your understanding and knowledge..

     As far as the other comments are concerned, well.. am a pakistani and we know in what field indians are superstar.. Indians are super-powers in making false propaganda. India is great in making too much noise and making false propaganda… I have lived my life in Pakistan.. I have traveled in depth of Pakistan, I haven’t ever seen a single military camp by any religious group.. Jamat-ud-dawa which u guys blamed has done lot of work in humanitarian activities.. Now, even Inter-Pol has said that no credible evidence is provided by India, and Pakistan has done great so far… Pakistan itself is the main victim of terrorism.. Pakistan’s Marriot blast killed over 60 people. Pakistan’s media showed responsibility and they didn’t made the terrorists win by straight-forwardly pointing out India… However, Indian govt and indian media showed extreme immaturity by the recent doings. They just made terrorists successful by making a war-like scenario… What the best a terrorist can wish for ?.. The war between 2 nuclear power states !!… Well done Indians.. !!
     As far as war is concerned, Pakistan is serial producing ballistic and cruise missiles for a long time now.. The coordinates of most of indian’s air / naval and other military bases are already set and known… There wud be not much left in indian military after a war with Pakistan.. same is the case for Pakistan too… As indian missiles will also attack targets here in Pakistan.. But the main difference is we are already in a war -like situation..We are 100% ready for the war.. I don’t know about indians.. But I personally feel, we need a war.. bcoz it will unite us.. all so called terrorist groups ..or actually religioss parties will have then a common enemy..

130. # Vibhav on 26 Dec 2008 at 10:03 am

     Nice data and facts collection
     I would like to add that despite the nuclear factor , India would never want war against PAKISTAN for our own good.
     Obviously we will clean Pak in less than 2 weeks even in the worst scenario of a nuclear war, wat about the consequences, we would have sowed the same seed of hatred which was once sowed by the US in 1945 and its result would be backfire at us like it did to the US in Afghanistan and Iraq.
     War is no solution but “there cannot be a clap with one hand’.

     India is known worldwide to be a Tolerant country for nearly 5000 years. We, even the younger gen
     abide by the Gandhian doctrines BUT DON’T Tempt Us.

131. # james on 26 Dec 2008 at 10:51 am

     indeed, pakistan is an international migrane,but still pakistan can wipe out the black spots spotted on it by the international community by being honest in its fights against the terrorism.it is well known in the world all over about the wickedness of I.S.I and pakistani army.both of them can go upto any extent against harming india by any means.first of all the govt. of pakistan should take necessary against them.then only pakistan would be able to prove itself an HONEST country against fighting terrorism.lastly
     WAR IS NOT THE SOLUTION.

132. # nofal on 26 Dec 2008 at 12:02 pm

     @ Jack

     “Pakistan is an idiotic country, the world has ever seen. It’s like unwanted child born out of British mess with Indian freedom fight. Sooner it is bombed out of shape, better it is for the world peace. If Bush have not been able to do that, Obama should do it.”

     I can say the same about another country but i wont because what you state is an opinion of yours and not a fact therefore it is not a factual debate and this is a discussion forum not an opinion sharing page and if you must give your opinion try not to offend others.

     “History
     That is the real issue you people dont have respect for human life. you rightly said you dont fear death thats why you have new employment scheme in pakistan “suicide bombers” which are cheaply available there and that is the only thing pakis know kill innocents cowardly. YOU PEOPLE WILL SURELY BURN IN HELL.”

     first of all “YOU PEOPLE WILL BURN IN HELL” please act civilised and human.Show me some proof from a good trustworthy source that Pakistan is behind these terrorist attacks.If Pakistan is behind these then why is it that every day some people die from a suicide bomb blast and why has the world been crying about a 3 day event in Mumbai that killed 200 people and the same number die in Pakistan every week and if Pakistan is behind this then why is it that it is a main combatant in the war on terror..

     so stop trash talking. I am certain that you re an angry Indian who has changed his name in order to disguise himself.So basically either you are an ignorant British person or an angry hate filled Indian immigrant.

133. # Jack on 26 Dec 2008 at 1:01 pm

     Nofal

     Im an englishman and also proud of it and not supporter of India. but I know your reality now that you are an immigrant and jihadi supporter who is living on british tax payer’s money and trying to justify a failed state. We dont need people like you in our country. Myself and my british and american friends have same view about pakistan and is not wrong too the fact is it is a hub of terrorism and Maternity ward of suicide bombers and check the facts 50 suicide attacks in Pakistan alone in last year. No wonder your EX PM Nawaz has same opinion about pakistan.

134. # Jack on 26 Dec 2008 at 2:23 pm

     The whole world knows the facts if you dont wanna see its your problem. read this report.

     ‘Next terror attack on US will originate from Pakistan’
     Washington, Dec 3 (IANS) Describing Pakistan as ‘the intersection of nuclear weapons and terrorism’, a top US Congressional panel has warned that the next terror attack on America is likely to originate in its ally’s tribal areas.

     While observing that Pakistan is a US ally, the commission on weapon of mass destruction (WMD) and terrorism said ‘the next terrorist attack against the United States is likely to originate from within the Federally Administered Tribal Areas’ in Pakistan.

     The US says the tribal areas in northwest Pakistan, where the government exerts little control, are a haven for militants from both Pakistan and neighbouring Afghanistan.

     The commission also expressed particular concern about the nuclear programmes of Iran and North Korea, and about Pakistan, which it described as ‘the intersection of nuclear weapons and terrorism.’

     It warned that there is a threat of nuclear terrorism, both because more countries are developing nuclear weapons and because some existing nuclear powers are expanding their arsenals.

     ‘Terrorist organizations are intent on acquiring nuclear weapons,’ said the report, which was published Tuesday on the internet and will be officially released Wednesday.

     It cited testimony before the commission from former Senator Sam Nunn, who said that the ‘risk of a nuclear weapon being used today is growing, not receding.’

     The commission was created in line with a recommendation from the 9/11 Commission on the Sep 11, 2001 terrorist attacks on the US.

     But terrorists are likely to use a weapon of mass destruction somewhere in the world in the next five years, former Senator Bob Graham, chairman of the commission was quoted as saying by CNN Tuesday.

     They are more likely to use a biological weapon than a nuclear one - and the results could be devastating, Graham said.

     ‘The consequences of a biological attack are almost beyond comprehension. It would be 9/11 times 10 or a hundred in terms of the number of people who would be killed,’ he said.

     He cited the flu virus that killed millions of people in 1918 as an example.

     ‘Today it is still in the laboratory, but if it should get out and into the hands of scientists who knew how to use it for a violent purpose, we could have multiple times the 40 million people who were killed 100 years ago,’ he said.

     The US government ‘needs to move more aggressively to limit’ the spread of biological weapons, the commission said in its report. Graham warned that such measures would be costly, but were necessary.

     Graham said a biological attack was more likely than a nuclear one because it would be easier to carry out.

     Biological weapons ‘are more available,’ he said. ‘Anthrax is a natural product of dead animals. Other serious pathogens are available in equally accessible forms.’

     ‘There are so many scientists who have the skills to convert a pathogen from benign, helpful purposes into an illicit, very harmful weapon,’ he added.

     The report recommends a range of measures, including increased security and awareness at biological research labs and strengthening international treaties against the spread of biological and nuclear weapons.

     ‘Many biological pathogens and nuclear materials around the world are poorly secured-and thus vulnerable to theft by those who would put these materials to harmful use, or would sell them on the black market to potential terrorists,’ the report warned.

135. # anil on 26 Dec 2008 at 2:48 pm

     In todays world India needs to keep up a strong armed forces. I am an Indian but I feel there is no need to fight Pakistan over anything. It is certain that the Mullahs will soon blast each other away, make a hell out of that palace and that country will dis-intigrate due to its own short comings.

     We can expect that around the year 2012 a vast majority of our Pakistani neighbours would have got thoroughly fed-up with thier wreached state and they would wish to join back with INDIA. This way they will ensure a proper future for thier children.

136. # A proud Aryan on 26 Dec 2008 at 3:02 pm

     M. Robinson
     1. “I have read history, and if someone truly compares the different ages of religious control, then from my educated prospective, the muslim were the most tolerant of others.”

     Well Mr. Robinson i would most sincerely advice you not just to use historical facts to ur advantage but also analyze the various circumstances that govern human action and its repurcussions in the times that follow.
     There might be some truth to the fact that the muslim rule wasn’t the most brutal of the entire human race(especially if one compares it to the british rule that took over the reigns from the muslim in many parts of the world ) but that doesn’t sum up the fact that they are supposed to be the most docile and humane of all the human races existent in today’s times. I hope u are aware of the fact that the response of people in the most congenial and friendly circumstances isn’t the best means to assess their character more dangerous still to make a prediction about their future responses to impending problems seeding out of some fundamental problem in the basic mechanism shaping their life values and priorities. The fact that the muslim rule was relatively less hostile towards other religions could have been a consequence of sheer lack of respect for the potentials of their slaves(that they didn’t suppress any efforts made by them towards empowering themselves to break the shackles of slavery or being partnered by some third party in doing so), or probably they didn’t imagine their rule getting restricted to as many regions as it is today out of sheer arrogance .Whatever the reasons, it is hardly of any consequence what the muslim rule was like.What is of more importance in the present scenario is that the muslim kamikhaze mentality is not in the interest of global peace and harmony at least. What is required is an urgent and thorough introspection into the basic teachings of Quran about the priorities that a good muslim needs to set before himself.As it is, today more and more of muslims seeking salvation (or jannat) are adhering to some of these teachings :

     1. “O ye who believe! Fight those of the disbelievers who are near to you, and let them find harshness in you, and know that Allah is with those who keep their duty”
     -Qur’an,Sura 9:123

     2.”The hour not be established until you fight with the jews, and the stone behind which a jew will be hiding will say ‘ O Muslim! There is a jew hiding behind me, kill him.”
     -Bukharia 52:177

     Now u c the problem that prophet Muhammad had was not Zionism but jews in general.
     I am sure u have no argument to defend the fact that a religion that is so pathetic and brutal (if this is not an understatement)
     in its teachings , how can the loyal followers be termed tolerant if anything.

137. # nofal on 26 Dec 2008 at 7:17 pm

     @ A proud Aryan

     Jews have been a problem for the world mostly to Christians and Muslims.

     just look at what the did in Lebanon and in Palestine they are the terrorists.

138. # nofal on 26 Dec 2008 at 7:24 pm

     http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/97/UN_Partition_Plan_For_Palestine_1947.png

     http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/47/West_Bank_%26_Gaza_Map_2007_(Settlements).gif

     compare the 2 maps above

     http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli-occupied_territories

     look at how they take over Palestinian settlements

139. # Gyani on 26 Dec 2008 at 8:42 pm

     Only the dead have seen the end of war. ~Plato

     India and Pakistan should live in peace and prosperity. But no.. the evil mind of politicians work on both sides.. and ofcourse the british who laid the seeds of evil and now carried on by the USA.

     Govts. in USA, UK, Russia, France and China are 5 major powers who do not want India and Pakistan to live in peace and for that matter anywhere in the world where is there is even a remotest possibility to create chaos. They will do everything necessary to see that there is mistrust and hatred towards each other and they make a huge profit of selling arms and keeping this military trade running.

     US Politician sayng is -
     We make war in Iraq that we may live in prosperity in US.
     We sell arms to Pakistan/India that we may prosper in US.

     Kashmir is just a reason. And the fools of India and Pakistan still are fighting like kids over stale history. The dead have been long burnt or buried.

     Time to make Peace. forever

     When you make peace with yourself, you make peace with the world.

140. # Dhawal on 26 Dec 2008 at 10:44 pm

     I would like to add, that terrorist I mentioned on my previous post was those misguided islamic peoples, I don’t know much about other form of terrorism they are backing, but their are solid information with FACTs that they are doing that.

141. # Pradeep on 26 Dec 2008 at 11:12 pm

     We have technology , manpower ,resource as good as china, only corruption lacking us all kind of devolopenmts like strong millitary building, fighting against terrorism , every indian must think that corruption and corrupted policians are main threat to india and security, we need to fight against these rathar than thinking to war against pakisthan. if we make our political sytem more unique ,corruption free then we will become more super like russia with our own technology.we must fight and kill againt corruption and corrupted politicians to keep india pride and peaceful. Now real enemies are corruption, terrorism , global warming.

142. # Well-Wisher on 27 Dec 2008 at 1:34 am

     @all
     Many times religious belief drives the man and even a country, so just we see some basic logical things on religion. We go by the youngest relgion to oldest.

     1. If Islam is true and rest are all satanic: According to Muslims, Jesus (pbuh) is just a prophet and his death was not a crucifiction but a crucifixion. So all Christian’s faiths are wasted and become useless. Rest of the other religon’s belief also nothing, all go to hell except Muslims. Islam supercedes here.

     2. If Christianity is true and rest are all satanic: According to Christians, satan came in the form of Angel Gabriel and revealed conflicting Koran to Mohamad (pbuh). So only Christians are capable of washing their sins and saved by thier faith and rest all will fall into hell. So Muslims and other religions are wasting their life with wrong faith. Christianity supercedes here.

     3. If both Islam & Christianity are true: If two controversial faiths are true, logicall rest of the other religions are also automaticall becomes true. In this case, the oldest religion Hinduism, its in-depth knowledge about God and the way it describes the Supreme God Parameswar, he covers everything in this Universe. As Lord Krishna says in Gita “I am the all, whoever prays in any method and offers anything to God in any form will reach me ultimately”, If any devote strongly prays to see me in what form, I will be there in that form to him. This statement covers every religion in this Universe (example: He appeared as YHWH to Abraham (pbuh), As Allah to Mohamad (pbuh), as Knowledge of Nirvana to Buddah, as Jesus (pbuh) as a salvation from sin to Christians, as 10 incarnations to Hindus, and other forms to rest of the religions. So it becomes Universal religion and here Hinduism supercedes.

     God Bless everyone in this world. Wishing you all a Happy New Year.

143. # RemoveTerror on 27 Dec 2008 at 2:05 am

     The problem is that from the early age large numbers of Islamic children are fed on Islamic education, nothing wrong with that, but some of these children are also told to hate other faiths and that is where thing are going wrong – all religions should teach mutual respect.

     After all Islam is one of the youngest religions on world, which has marketing techniques (a hidden agenda) of taking over the world by hook or crook. World is watching and trying to avoid a clash if possible and the responsibility of avoiding this clash lies on both side of the argument (and of course this includes followers of Islam).

     It is in the interest of Pakistani army to maintain hostility with India so that they can milk their country. In the end Pakistani people and their government are hostages of their army (bit like the people of Mumbai were one month ago).

     Sorry to say this but if things do not improve soon innocent people who did not have the wisdom to see truth or guts to stand up to wrong will suffer. All lives are precious let’s opt for peace and compromise – get rid of terrorist and their network.

144. # astroshrum on 27 Dec 2008 at 6:36 am

     Pakistan is the center of attraction for both USA and the world for a few reasons.
     1. Pakistan is the only Islam nation with nuclear capabilities. So the Islamic extremists obviously have an eye on Pakistan. The extremists are trying to corrupt the Pakistani government and the ISI in hopes of getting the nukes.
     2. US DoD has realized that the extremists are out for Pakistan, and that if these people get their hands on nukes, it would endanger global(primarily American) security.
     3. So the only way to keep the nukes away from the bad guys is by pressurizing Pakistan government and keeping it on it’s toes.

     And about India, well India just (unluckily) got in the way due to historic Indo-Pak rivalry. Otherwise India has nothing to do with the Pakistan-USA-extremists business.

145. # Viswanathan Shivakumar on 27 Dec 2008 at 9:46 am

     Dear brothers and sisters of Pakistan and India/ Rest of the World

     I would like to appeal in the name of all things you consider holy to listen to my words here carefully

     1. Nobody can deny the fact before the partition there was no country called PAKISTAN
     2. So everybody knows that PAKISTAN was a integrated part of INDIA before partitioning
     3. All that INDIA has done is give its part of the LAND to PAKISTAN
     4. I do consider people of PAKISTAN to be my brothers and sisters - and i do hope the good samiritans of PAKISTAN will also agree
     5. Escalating of a WAR between these countries will result in one matter - that is it will destroy PAKISTAN
     6. Radical and Terrorist groups will not have place in PAKISTAN any further
     7. INDIA is keeping quiet because INDIA knows its strength
     8. One thing is for sure nor musharaff nor the latest president of pakistan Zardari Saheb is going to lead from the front
     9. Happy Ending would be PAKISTAN and INDIA will be united after which INDIA will emerge as a Better POWER than it is today

     If pakistanis need that please do proceed - and do it faster that is my request

     Viswanathan Shiva Kumar
     guruviswanath@gmail.com

146. # Monis on 01 Jan 2009 at 1:39 pm

     @ Dear all

     I would like to extend my WISH to all of you that…. Now its time to do something you all guys (Indians and their pets) are vowing too much, so please stop your much much… and be brave take all of your weapons along with all your economical, educational and social powers and teach us what you people wanted to taught us since the first day of your birth. Now we are frustrated of your shitting so come-on we are waiting to see you like a man face to face, eyeball to eyeball and the time will tell us who will be the winner. No matter if we will lose our lives but don’t forget that we will destroy you. No matter if there will no more Pakistan rest of the Muslim world rest in peace with dignity… but what about you people? There is ONE an ONLY HINDUSTAN in the whole world……………….

     Once again lets combat… we are ready guys cum on cum on….

147. # Ajith on 01 Jan 2009 at 2:34 pm

     Dear Brothers and Sisters,
     First up all i would like to make a point that, Terrorism has no religion. Religion is just a cover to meet their barbaric appetite. And above all when politicians attempts to reap the best out of this situation, We suffer.
     What have we(India and Pakistan) gained , since 1947, accusing each other for nothing. If we start digging the past, (not just till mideival period) we see that lots of invasion have take place. Large scale immigrations have happened place in the past. Keeping that in reference if we starts accusing , we get nothing. Live in the present , do good deeds(i guess thats even that praying to god). Get united and enjoy peaceful life.
     I have seen Mr Robinson making lots of ’so called’ analysis about indo-pakistan affairs and the tears of kashmiris. Well its good to know a Brit care about our probs, but later i saw him addressing as “we British” did that and this is that and bla bla bla. Britain have no right to comment about the current situation as, the situation we face today is offspring of “divide and rule” policy used by Brits to rule india.
     The only request to pakistan is, please take immense steps to curb terrorism in your soil. Its just a hypothetical request whose reply is well known. What can Mr Zardari possibly do, when the army is more influential than civilian governement. All we could pray is that, Let the educated youth of pakistan could succeed in eliminating the negative influence of army.
     Am very much an indian, but i respect pakistan as a nation indeed.

148. # Tariq on 01 Jan 2009 at 2:45 pm

     For just a moment we should think as whole asian, there should be not any issue between pakistan and India to make strong economic nexus in the region but sorry to say the politions of both the nations are currupt and low minded. Just 10 mans in the mombay attacks keep the two nuclear nations on the border, How bullshits on the this! along indian politions they say they run world top democracy but I think they are all fool and pakistani politions are also. but just non asians American and nato are behind this game to get their porposes. Indian politions says first pakistan delievers their required terrirsot otherwise ready to fight and when pakistan stands aganist indian then whole world fears if Pakistan uses nuclear bomb it will be dangrous for the whole region then Indian shows rear steps. What a shame for the politions for they just think to ruin the terrirtory. Along this Pakistani president says indian fighters plains are just technical mistake, this is good statement just to reduce the war mania but don’t say this is weakness. Weakness is that to steps down the indian leaders against Pakistan attacks.

149. # venkat on 02 Jan 2009 at 9:56 am

     After Chadrayaan-1,

     Mr. Zardari (10%), Gilani, LET masood, JUD Hafiz meet to discuss indias probe to moon.

     Hafiz: how can india terrorise us by sending a probe to moon (Remember according to islam CHAND is their holy object) when we attack them( india)on earth, this is cheating, we have to go to UN with protest.

     Zardari: dont worry we will ask AQ KHAN to become father of our SPACE program (he can import(steal) tech from china and korea and become its father as in earlier cases).

     Masood interrupts: so that we can be the first country to put a “terrornomer” ( equal to astronomer but with a AK47 & a chinese grenade)on moon and kill all the alien infidels & their satelites.

     Gilani puts in: ya.. we can show the world what we are capable of.

     Hafiz protests: according to islam we have to do ULTA(reverse) if others send rocket & man to space why cant we send rocket with the “terrornomer” below earth.

     Hamid Mir, Geo TV joins in: we will whip up all the sentiments about this project, if we suceed we will say we have over taken the world and included moon also in our list to export our holy warriors. if it fails we will attribute the failure to HINDU-MOSSAD-ZIONIST sabotage.

     They try to send the rocket named “JIHAD” with “terrornomer” but it fails. (what happens if it is sent DOWNWARDS to the earth)

     INDIAN english media, Rajdeep Sardesai in primetime news: Mr. Modi sabotaged pakistani space program, we have to consider this as terrorism on pakistan, poor country it is devastated. whole of BJP, RSS, VHP, HINDUS, ISRAEL are mainly reponsible.

     Manmohan Singh: madame sonia gandhi is deeply hurt because of modi’s act of terror on pakistan, we will extradite him to pakistan to stand trial.

     “moral”
     ” Indian People never think how Mr. Modi is reponsible for this, they never think and vote for congress”

150. # Rajesh on 02 Jan 2009 at 3:28 pm

     This is to Monis
     I think you have gone crazy mongering war. It sad to know that you people want to die with Indian hands. But let me tell you we are not murderers like you. Who are you to speak on behalf of the entire islamic world. Because of people like you the entire religion is in a mess. You think we are taught about religion and hatred from right from birth then you are very much wrong . Its you who learn and teach religion and hatred to other communities right from birth.
     Yes i agree you are frustrated of everything thats going on in your country and now you want to target someone who is innocent so you can divert the attention. My hating friend you will loose yes and you think destroying India will make the islamic countries live in peace. Sorry first of all you cant just destroy us and i dont know if your country is getting destroyed of terrorism.
     Who is going to destry Israel . Thousands are getting killed in palestine. Will pakistan attack Israel. Who is going to destroy USA. Thousands are getting killed in Iraq and Afghanistan.
     You know what i favour a country and recognize Palestine as a country but because of people like you and because of islamic terrorism they are not able to achieve independence. I feel very sad when i think of Mr Yasser Arafat where he struggled for independence his entire life and had to die without achieving it and why its because of people like you. Palestine would have been a country and all the Israelis(Jews) would have been kicked out if islamic terror would not have existed in this world.
     You may have to re think about war with India. Check how palestineans are getting killled everyday by Israelis backed up by USA. It might so happen with India as well where in we would be forced to eliminate the state of pakistan for terrrorism.

     And for God sake( Allah ) dont speak on behalf of islamic nations. There are islamic nations like Malaysia , Indonesia who are in peace . Atleast dont destroy their happiness.

151. # Well-Wisher on 02 Jan 2009 at 6:29 pm

     Jews must have Israel all the time in the history because they were living there for many thousand years. PLO was created just give a permanent headache for Israel. Don’t forget that Jews are the most intellectuals among all the human beings God created on this earth. They will prove it in future history to this world and India will be supporting for them to proliferate and expand their nation in middle east. God Bless all Israelites.

152. # M.Robinson on 02 Jan 2009 at 6:55 pm

     @
     ‘Well-wisher
     Jews must have Israel all the time in the history because they were living there for many thousand years’.

     The above statement is incorrect, firstly the jewish people were not forced out of Israel. Secondly the ancestors of much of the palestinian Christians and muslims were jewish who converted. As ethnically the jews and the palestinians are the same people. The Ashkenazi jews(european) are primarily from Khazar converts to Judiaism.

     If using the supposition of ‘well-wisher’ then by definition the world should right all ‘wrongs’ done to peoples of the world, i.e return North and South America to the Native Americans, Australia back to the Aborignes and New Zealand to the Moari’s.

153. # M.Robinson on 02 Jan 2009 at 7:19 pm

     @ rajesh
     ‘ islamic terror would not have existed in this world.’

     Terror comes in many guises, the RSS killed Ghandi, ITs supporters were responsible for the destruction of the Babri Mosque and murder of 2000+ muslims during those days. The BJP(supported by the RSS) gets into power after the destruction of the mosque, so could one assume this to be Hindu Terrorism. The murder of muslims in Gujarat and Mr.Modi made sure no one intervened, you are a Hindu fundamentalist hiding under the garb of an innocent bystander. People like you know of incidents of Hindu terrorism against Christians and muslims. In your defence you will quickly raise the banner ‘ oh were the largest democracy, we are secularists’, if thats the case then why are the Hindu Fundamentalists doing well in politics?

     When my country(G.Britain) and France took over much of the middle east, we promised to to hand back control of the lands to the arab inhabitants. In 1917 we betrayed the Arabs(shameful act) by declaring the Balfour treaty, in effect handing over land to the Jewish people, A land that did not belong to us in the first place.

     There are two types of people in the world, those who become subservient to the situation, and accept their fate. The muslims are not of these, because the have a habit of hitting back at those who would try and subjugate them, this is why they are not liked.

     Its like when the Pakistani nuclear weapon is reffered to as the ‘Islamic bomb’. So the Indian bomb is a ‘Hindu bomb’, the French,US,British and Russian bombs are ‘Christian bombs, and the Chinese bomb is a ‘Buddhist or Confucious Bomb’. Even when we know that each nation developed these bombs for self ‘preservation’ and prestige.
     The Chinese used to be Vilified in a similar way in the late 1940’s to the 1960’s, often reffered to as the ‘yellow menace’. Now the Chinese are being looked upto as the next superpower. Those same nations who used to spread viscious anti chinese propaganda are now cow-towing (hopefully spelt correctly).

     THIS PEOPLE IS THE NEW DIVIDE AND RULE POLICY.

154. # Well-Wisher on 02 Jan 2009 at 11:49 pm

     @Robinson

     From 1517-1917 Turkey’s Ottoman Empire controlled a vast Arab empire, a portion of which is today Lebanon, Syria, and Palestine. During World War I (1914-1918), Turkey supported Germany. When Germany was defeated, so were the Turks. In 1916 control of the southern portion of their Ottoman Empire was “mandated” to France and Britain under the Sykes-Picot Agreement, which divided the Arab region into zones of influence. Lebanon and Syria were assigned (mandated) to France… and “Palestine” (today’s Jordan, Israel and “West Bank”) was mandated to Great Britain.
     Because no other peoples had ever established a national homeland in “Palestine” since the Jews had done it 2,000 years before, the British “looked favorably” upon the creation of a Jewish National Homeland throughout ALL of Palestine. The Jews had already begun mass immigration into Palestine in the 1880’s in an effort to rid the land of swamps and malaria and prepare for the rebirth of Israel. This Jewish effort to revitalize the land attracted an equally large immigration of Arabs from neighboring areas who were drawn by employment opportunities and healthier living conditions. There was never any attempt to “rid” the area of what few Arabs there or those Arab masses that immigrated into this area along with the Jews.

155. # Well-Wisher on 03 Jan 2009 at 12:03 am

     @Robinson
     In later stage, when the conflict occurs between Jews & Arabs, the Palestinian Jews were forced to form an organized defense against the Arabs Palestinians…. thus was formed the Hagana, the beginnings of the Israeli Defense Forces [IDF]. There was also a Jewish underground called the Irgun led by Menachem Begin (who later became Prime Minister of Israel). Besides fighting the Arabs, the Irgun was instrumental in driving out the pro-Arab British. Finally in 1947 the British had enough and turned the Palestine matter over to the United Nations.
     The 1947 U.N. Resolution 181 partition plan was to divide the remaining 25% of Palestine into a Jewish Palestinian State and a SECOND Arab Palestinian State (Trans-Jordan being the first) based upon population concentrations. The Jewish Palestinians accepted… the Arab Palestinians rejected. The Arabs still wanted ALL of Palestine… both east AND west of the Jordan River. Actually the whole old Palestine should belong to Jews and all Arabs those who are fighting now has to migrate back to Saudi.

156. # Nitin on 03 Jan 2009 at 1:38 am

     M.Robinson
     many years ago a temple was build on the place where the greatest hindu god was born.So ancinect hindus build a temple on that same place where the god was born. It was supposed to be the most sacred place on earth for hindus.
     But during the mougal rule that emperor divasted that temple and build that babri mosque over there

     SO.. now that what you call injustice, and stuff liek that
     at 1st place babri mosque was not deserved to be over there

     M.Robinson ..dude whats ur problem…. every where you keep on mouthing and go on giving proofs of ur incomplete knowledge,cummon man.. nothing wrong with me …but ur loosing ur self respect!
     thik of it!

157. # Monis on 03 Jan 2009 at 10:29 am

     @ Rajesh

     My dear lovely, cute Rajesh your assessment about me is completely wrong. I’m not a war monger as you mentioned. There are only three states and the individuals of those states are war monger i.e. USA, Israel and India.
     You know as I mentioned in my previous post that you people have so many complexes like inferiority complex (when you compare yourselves to the western countries) Superiority complex (when you compare yourselves to the small countries like Bhutan, Nepal etc.) and when you see the Pakistan you just get out of control because of so much anger and hatred but unfortunately you can do nothing even with all your BIG ECONOMICAL and MILITARY POWERS. You can do only one thing PROPAGANDA. A deceit Propaganda to defame Pakistan, to defame people of Pakistan and to defame credibility of Pakistan. You know Rajesh as USA, Israel and India tried hard to demoralize us as we feel stronger and stronger. You said that I have no right to talk on behalf of all Islamic community and you your self talk about the ISLAMIC TERRORISM you people always trying to connect the terrorism with Islam because you are scared from Muslims. I really don’t know what thing you feel scary about Muslims.
     Well in last I just want to clear 1 thing to all of you that we Muslims are the followers of ISLAM an Arabic word of PEACE but you did not want to live us with peace because you want to grab our wealthy and healthy mother lands. So whatever you reap so shall you cut.

158. # VK on 03 Jan 2009 at 11:05 am

     I can not beleive what the Pakistanis here are saying. The whole world knows that all the terrorism is caused by mostly muslims and most of these are from Pakistan. If Pakis don’t get their shit together they will soon end up like Afghanistan and Iraq. Forget India, Israel and US will come after Pak and can destroy it in a matter of minutes.

159. # Monis on 03 Jan 2009 at 11:08 am

     @ All those who opposed M. Robinson

     Why you people opposing M. Robinson? You know the truth is bitter and for you its most bitter.

160. # Animesh on 03 Jan 2009 at 12:45 pm

     An Article by a Pakistani Journalist: Farrukh Saleem

     About Pakistan

     EDIT: Please respect others’ copyright and post links instead of whole content.

     Regards,

     Aby

161. # Animesh on 03 Jan 2009 at 4:06 pm

     Dear Aby,

     It was a journalist sharing his thought on a blog… if you read the whole thing I have also shared some research data and comments which is almost half the article.

     It would be great if you can upload as it talks about being constructive and not getting diverted from the main issues.

162. # Animesh on 03 Jan 2009 at 4:07 pm

     There are no copyright violations

163. # Monis on 03 Jan 2009 at 4:08 pm

     @ VK

     ‘I can not believe what the Pakistanis here are saying’
     We just damn care about your beliefs.. and one thing more don’t forget that you still not in a winning position in your SO CALLED war against terror in Afghanistan and Iraq so keep your mouth shut and remember Vietnam……..

164. # Animesh on 03 Jan 2009 at 4:23 pm

     India

     Forex Reserves - $ 254.613 Billion
     Indian Compnies In Forbes List within 1,000

     All Data in Dollars
     Rank Name Revenue Profits Assets Market Value
     193 Reliance Industries 26.07 2.79 30.67 89.29
     198 Oil &Natural Gas Corp 18.90 4.11 33.79 54.11
     219 State Bank of India 15.77 1.47 188.56 33.29
     303 Indian Oil Corporation 42.68 1.82 25.39 16.36
     374 ICICI Bank Banking 9.84 0.64 91.07 29.85
     411 NTPC Utilities 7.84 1.60 20.34 41.57
     647 Steel Authority of India Limited 7.88 1.45 8.05 26.37
     738 Tata Steel Materials 5.83 0.97 11.48 14.63
     826 Bharti Airtel 4.26 0.94 6.61 39.16
     846 Reliance Communications 3.13 0.65 13.08 29.63

     Pakistan

     Pakistan forex reserves climb to $9.80 bln - as on 4th Dec 08

     Pakistan’s 2 leading companies, as per Forbes Global ranking.

     Rank Company Name

     1,284 Oil & Gas Development
     1,316 PTCL

     I dont have the other details.

     India’s Top Ten Companies make more profit or say have money in hand than the the Pakistani government.

     It certainly shows that after 60 Years of Indepence where these two countries are, whats there standing now.

     I agree that size of the country does matter however there are smaller nations that India and Pakistan who are doing better than both of them.

     My intention here is not to show Pakistan inferior, I just wanna say this is what the direction of the two economies have been since independence.

     It shows where was the energy spent all this while and how has the economies of the two neighbouring countries fared.

     Here where the competition lies and not in arms race, its Information age.
     Even in our lives either we get inspired by looking at a people - our neighbours, relatives. Friends and others doing well. And we also get jealous. The establishment of Pakistan is Jealous so Mumbai Happens.

     I would request Pakitani people to be more constructive because you are and you will be part of the its establishment. You can change things if you want and compete with us where it matters.

     You are self declared warriors and proclaim yourself to stand for the Islamic countries around the globe.

     Do that once you are in a position to do so.

     Both the countries have enough problems on their plates to take care of. Lets do that solve our own problems.

     India has been constructive in its approach and Pakistan has been not. Reasons may be many but it boils down to the structure of establishment in both the countries.

     India is a country which owns an Army.

     In Pakistan Army owns the country. How can army be important, only if they have an enemy. For Pakistan Army to be at the centre stage its important be at tenterhooks with India and that is what is happening.

     These people like Zaid Hamid, Hamir Gul, Mr. Kiyani are just being the spokesperson for this cause.

     They are diverting the attention from the real problems.

     In India we have people like Bal Thackery, Narendra Modi (Though he has taken Gujrat forward and done lot of Development work, but should not be forgiven for Gujrat riots)

     The real issues both the countries face are unemployement, poverty, social injustice and lot more.

     India atleast have taken right steps in this direction

     Pakistan needs to do more.

     I hope good sense prevails and we compete in making our respective countries more prosperous.

165. # Well-Wisher on 03 Jan 2009 at 5:58 pm

     @Monis
     What Mr. Robinson talking is neither bitter nor truth, it is poison.

166. # M.Robinson on 03 Jan 2009 at 9:05 pm

     @ Well-Wisher
     ‘The Jews had already begun mass immigration into Palestine in the 1880’s in an effort to rid the land of swamps and malaria and prepare for the rebirth of Israel.’

     firstly you are anything other than a ‘Well-Wisher’.

     I am astounded at the propaganda that you spout, one would assume that palestininans lived on deserts and they had to import all their food from the outside. ‘Swamps and malaria’, this isn’t louisianna, this is the middle east, part oasis and mostly arid and dry. The orange groves and agriculture existed prior to Israel’s existence.
     From your argument that the Jewish people had a right to Palestinian land because they lived there 2000 years ago, by using the same argument The lands of North and South America should be returned to the Native americans.
     Much of the Palestinians (Christian and Muslim) have lived in Palestine for 2000 years, do they have any less right to live there, or by your argument, is it the jewish people have a greater right to the land?

     @VK
     ‘The whole world knows that all the terrorism is caused by mostly muslims and most of these are from Pakistan’

     Define terrorism, Most of the Native Americans were wiped out by our European ancestors. This included murder of women and children.
     The crusades are celebrated in some quarters as a gallant act, but if you actuall read history, then you will see the acts of barbarism committed by European christians against Jews, Muslims and fellow christians.

     Most Indians know perfectly well that the Indian mutiny 1857(war of Independence) was instigated by Muslims, thats why muslims in British India were kept back from any influential positions, in the civil service and British Indian army(there were no single muslim regiments). Now my forefathers would have called these muslims ‘terrorists’, because to them they were the new rulers and the ‘natives’ should accept the fact.

     One mans ‘terrorist’ is another man’s freedom fighter.during World war II, the french resistance fought the Germans for freedom, yet these same French subjugated people in Indochina(Vietnam) , Algeria and other colonies. So although French wanted freedom it was only for themselves not for their minorities(60,000 north african muslims fought for France in Worldwar II) and their colonies.

     Why doesn’t India send its armed forces to Iraq and Afghanistan as requested by its patron the USA? I mean India has desire to be a superpower, then it should shoulder some of the responsibility.

167. # Nitin on 04 Jan 2009 at 12:14 am

     mr robinson
     u replied to everyones comment why not my ?…

168. # Nitin on 04 Jan 2009 at 12:50 am

     hey jet-le
     soe more stuff you uld like to know
     visit this site
     http://www.chinasucks.org/

169. # Well-Wisher on 04 Jan 2009 at 9:29 am

     @Robinson
     My wishes may not be suited for all but only for those right people. I understand you are talking lot of historical stuffs, but manytimes you are twisting the facts to your wish.

     Regarding Israel/Palestinian issue I can tell you somemore. The Middle East war is not now and never was a conflict between Israelis/Jews on the one hand and Palestinians on the other. In fact, the Arab-”Palestinians”, while currently the perpetrators of most of the anti-Jewish atrocities, were never a very important part of the conflict. In fact, before about 1970, virtually no one in the world considered the Middle East conflict to be one between Israelis and Palestinians.

     The term “Palestinian” itself had referred to Israeli Jews back in the 1940s, and had been slowly deconstructed and redefined to refer to the Arabs in the West Bank and Gaza. The Middle East Conflict was always a war by Arabs against Jews, not a conflict between Israelis and “Palestinians.” The war was repackaged as a conflict between Jews and Palestinians as a public relations gimmick by the Arab fascist regimes. These regimes had never had any interest in “Palestinians,” in creating a “Palestinian” state, or in “Palestinian nationalism” before 1967. That is because Palestinian nationalism did not and DOES NOT exist. The Palestinians were a regional group of Arabs having virtually no cultural nor national distinctive traits separating them from Syrians, Lebanese, and Jordanians. They are all basically Arabs!.

     The bulk of what are called “Palestinian Arabs” are members of families who migrated into the Land of Israel beginning in the late 19th century. Palestinian nationalism is a mislabeling of Arab nationalism. Arab nationalism exists, although it is closely bound up with Islamic nationalism and even Islamism. Palestinian nationalism, however, is a phantom. It is nothing more than genocidal hatred of Jews!

     The Arab assaults and aggressions against Israel in 1948, 1956, 1967, 1968, and 1973 had nothing to do with Palestinians. The Palestinian terror campaign would itself be easy to suppress today and eradicate if the Middle East conflict were really a Palestinian-Israeli conflict. Israel would simply obliterate the terrorists and expel their supporters to Syria and Lebanon. The Middle East war continues because it is really an Arab-Israeli war, not an Israeli-Palestinian conflict. It is also in large part a war between barbarism and civilization. In many ways an Islamic religious jihad against the Jews.

170. # Citizen of Humanity on 04 Jan 2009 at 2:46 pm

     I have read just about all the comments. To all the Pakistanis and Indians. All I have to say is if you know the answers to questions mentioned below then you should know who is the enemy?

     1. Who attacked and divided India?

     2. Who started a proxy war with USSR through Pakistan?

     3. Who trained the Afghan mujahids and the also Taliban especially the funding & equipments?

     4. Who is making the most money out of the current rift situation between india and pk?
     i.e. selling fighter planes, Tanks, nuclear technology the list is very long.

     5. Who started covert ops in Afghanistan and Kashmir?

     6. Which countries export the most military equipments in the world?

     7. Which countries have started the most wars in 20th and 21st Century?

     8. Which country deliberately created a country in Middle East for iits own benefits and displaced an entire nation?

     Here is the kicker for question 8.

     The country which was created is still not living in peace and is still spending billions of dollars in military equipment.

     9. Who attacked an oil rich nation on the pretext of WMD and eventually not finiding it?

     10. Which countries have exercised the divide and rule policy?

     I sincerely hope that sane attitudes prevail in both countries (PK & India) military and civilian leadership and not start a war.

     Here is the current scenario for both countries PK & India

     W = Worst
     A = Action
     R = Required

     Equals to

     M = Mutually
     A = Assured
     D = Destruction

     Level of destruction for both countires if all military hardware is used including nuclear options.

     PK losses

     100 million or more dead in PK. Unimanginable level of hunger and diseases not to mention complete destruction of infrastructure.

     India losses

     500 to 700 million since its a indian statistics beaureau report that 300 million people are already living below the poverty line. Again 70 to 80 percent infrastructure destroyed.

     Iam not a scientist but winds do travel from west to east so radiations travel with winds and india is in the east of pk. Therefore the level of destruction might be more in India percentage wise. Not to mention complete drain of its forex reserves and economic infrastructure.

     Last question

     Who will benefit from above scenario by providing both countries monetary and economic aid?

     I think we all know the answers to these question so please PK & India stop the hatered and start talking about peace and economic harmony.

     WAR is not an option !

     I am a pakistani and I love indian people as much as my own people. We have so much in common.

     We should learn to respect each others rights and choices.

     Peace for all humanity

171. # Bijaya on 04 Jan 2009 at 5:40 pm

     @M.Robinson,
     I think Mr. Robinson, is going through lot of stuff on internet and trying to create a theory for himself. We might call it “The great Robinson theory on World”. Anyways in India we allow people to talk, so let him say what he wants to say.

     As you say, the Hindu fundamentalists killed many Muslims during Riots. So they have now killed more than that in Bomb blasts and terrorist activities in Kashmir. Can we call it even and can the Muslims stop(as we really dont see a mascare of muslims in India any more). No they wont, I am for sure. They are not bothered by few Muslims killed by hindus. Their bigger agenda is to rule the whole world and convert every people to Muslims or kill them. If people don’t accept that, they kill them. Few months back some Christians were also killed in India in Riots, and you know why, because these people convert the poor Indians by giving them money so that they also make all people Christians in the world. Now both Muslims and Christians are so crazy about converting people, some want rest of the world dead and some give money to convert. I have never seen a Hindu going to a muslim or an Christian asking them to be converted. Blooddy everyone in this world has some other vested interest and in the process they kill each other. Good, let it go on and let us argue with facts from history to justify each others activities. Sooner or later, there won’t be anyone to read this story also.

     God bless all !!!!

172. # M.Robinson on 04 Jan 2009 at 7:41 pm

     @Nitin
     ‘many years ago a temple was build on the place where the greatest hindu god was born’

     I see youre feeling left out so here is my reply.

     After a year after the destruction of the Babri Mosque, Panorama(BBC Programme) carried out an investigation into the issue. They found that the destruction of the mosque was instigated by the RSS(murderers of gandhi) and BJP, upon carrying out further analysis, many Sadhus of knowledge were in disagreement as to the correct site of Ram’s birth. There exist’s a site close by to the mosque where a small temple still exists purporting to be the correct site of ram’s birth.
     the destruction of the mosque was in essence the Hindu fundamentalist parties showing the muslims that they were in power now.
     you accuse muslims and Christians of being hate mongers. What I find astounding is that there is so much intolerance within your religion. Now correct me if I am wrong, the following refers to Hinduism.

     A widowed(childless) wife was encouraged to throw herself on the burning pyre of her husband( an act the British outlawed, currently making a comeback in India.

     Only Brahmins can become priests( whereas the lower caste hindu’s can never aspire to).

     If a shadow(or mere physical touching) of a low caste falls upon a high caste hindu, then the High caste hindu must bathe to remove (whether spiritual or phsical) the filth.

     If a woman cannot concieve(because her husband in impotent), she can be impregnated b courtesy of the Brahmin priest.

     A widow with children cannot remarry.

     The cost of a wedding and dowry falls upon the girls family, thats why there are so many abortions(of female foetuses) carried out by Hindu’s.There have been cases in Britain as well of such abortions by Hindu’s.

     The Daughter has less inheritance rights than her brothers.

     To be born into a low caste means the individual must have committed sins in the previous life.So upper caste hindu’s justify their mistreatment of low caste hindu’s(beatings, rape etc).

     Low caste hindu’s converted to Budhism in their droves, and yes Christians do spread the teachings of Christianity. Now your argument that these conversions occur under inducements, If thats the case then why don’t you treat your fellow hindu’s with respect and help them, or is that beyond you.

     there are forced reconversions carried out by Hindu fundamentalist groups. If you look at all work carried out with lepers, terminally ill and so forth is done by Christians, why are hindu’s not at the front?, is it a lack of money?(doubtful), or is it considered to dirty to help poor low caste hindu’s. I suggest you start looking inward and treat your fellow Hindu’s with more humanity.
     Giving some one respect and dignity is one way out of the cycle of hatred.

173. # imran on 04 Jan 2009 at 9:01 pm

     M.Robinson
     Sure I will correct you.These info what ever you told are indeed true!But that was past like 60 years ago or may be more..If you tell this facts to the youth in India now..they will also get amused the way you got , when these came to ur notice!
     Now there there its true that such thing as low cast or high cast clasification…is done !
     every one in india wishes that he/she was born in low cast..as in this country you get specail right and privelage for being born in low cast!
     There is no such thing as hindu fundamentalism! Its me who is living in this country and who is being socialised.Here the place where I work we are all hindus musims and christians..working in same team! and we just had christmas..we visited our felow workers house…had a lots of fun!…same happens on “id & mohoram” at my place..!
     so this is how we live here!
     Hindus in india as per i know are they do realy respect other religion.. as per their sentments are not hurted! And if u have a loo at this part , through a human phsycological point-of-view thatn this is absolutely Corrent and fair!
     Here I get a more feeling that I am an Indian rather than a musilm!

174. # Nitin on 04 Jan 2009 at 9:25 pm

     Hey Mr. Robinson
     Can i ask you what is your proffesion! Because how come You have so much time to keep mouthing over here?
     U must be having some work right?

175. # M.Robinson on 04 Jan 2009 at 10:44 pm

     @ Imram(nice muslim name!)
     ‘There is no such thing as hindu fundamentalism!’

     Ask those who suffer at the hands of RSS and VHP, or would you deny these organisations perpetrate violence in the name Hindutva. Most of the higher echelons of BJP leadership came from the ranks of RSS, the most notable one MR.Advani(who led the procession for the destruction of the babri Mosque.

     ‘These info what ever you told are indeed true!But that was past like 60 years ago or may be more’.

     Was Phoolan devi 60 years ago. Are the Dowry murders of yesterday not occuring today?. The concept of SATI is making a comeback, are you dening this occurs. Are 300+ million low caste hindus going to fill the bureaucratic offices of the Indian government. These poor people(low caste Hindu’s) are denied their human rights by the collusion of the willing(upper caste hindu’s).

     @ Nitin
     ‘You have so much time to keep mouthing over here?
     ‘U must be having some work right?’

     Yes I do work, I have my own business, and no I do not spend hours searching information to give answers. Does my responses irk you?. I only tell it as it is, rather than spread propaganda like yourself.

176. # Nitin on 04 Jan 2009 at 11:19 pm

     @Mr. Robinson
     Its not your Comment but its your ignorace…that irk me!
     We (who are born and brought up in India)we know very well thats going on over here!
     you get your information from paki media! whos lie is been nailed by whole world!
     We are just trying to make you understand that ..look dude this not the truth!
     I watch cnn for like 3 hrs everyday after my work! and also indian news channels!
     I never find tings like sati system retrning or anny muslim who is been critisized or something!
     But its only you who see that! If you realy mean what you say than you uld show sources….but your not even doing that!
     See we very well know what our country is and where its gona be in future! You dont need to tell us about it!
     You have your so called knowledge keep it with you and stay happy! we dont need it nor does the world!
     The world knows what India and Indians are
     and thats why majority of the world stand behind india ,rather pakistan! USSR is a big ally of India ..so taking this fact in mind USA should be our rival….but is it? N O. Because Americans know the importance of India .Even your government UK is standing in support of India!
     There is a freekin reason for each and every thing!
     Its just not possible that any one can just be ready to stand for someone!
     Think about it!

177. # Animesh on 04 Jan 2009 at 11:31 pm

     1. @Nitin
     ‘many years ago a temple was build on the place where the greatest hindu god was born’
     I see youre feeling left out so here is my reply.
     After a year after the destruction of the Babri Mosque, Panorama(BBC Programme) carried out an investigation into the issue. They found that the destruction of the mosque was instigated by the RSS(murderers of gandhi) and BJP, upon carrying out further analysis, many Sadhus of knowledge were in disagreement as to the correct site of Ram’s birth. There exist’s a site close by to the mosque where a small temple still exists purporting to be the correct site of ram’s birth.
     the destruction of the mosque was in essence the Hindu fundamentalist parties showing the muslims that they were in power now.
     you accuse muslims and Christians of being hate mongers. What I find astounding is that there is so much intolerance within your religion. Now correct me if I am wrong, the following refers to Hinduism.
     A widowed(childless) wife was encouraged to throw herself on the burning pyre of her husband( an act the British outlawed, currently making a comeback in India.
     Only Brahmins can become priests( whereas the lower caste hindu’s can never aspire to).
     If a shadow(or mere physical touching) of a low caste falls upon a high caste hindu, then the High caste hindu must bathe to remove (whether spiritual or phsical) the filth.
     If a woman cannot concieve(because her husband in impotent), she can be impregnated b courtesy of the Brahmin priest.
     A widow with children cannot remarry.
     The cost of a wedding and dowry falls upon the girls family, thats why there are so many abortions(of female foetuses) carried out by Hindu’s.There have been cases in Britain as well of such abortions by Hindu’s.
     The Daughter has less inheritance rights than her brothers.
     To be born into a low caste means the individual must have committed sins in the previous life.So upper caste hindu’s justify their mistreatment of low caste hindu’s(beatings, rape etc).
     Low caste hindu’s converted to Budhism in their droves, and yes Christians do spread the teachings of Christianity. Now your argument that these conversions occur under inducements, If thats the case then why don’t you treat your fellow hindu’s with respect and help them, or is that beyond you.
     there are forced reconversions carried out by Hindu fundamentalist groups. If you look at all work carried out with lepers, terminally ill and so forth is done by Christians, why are hindu’s not at the front?, is it a lack of money?(doubtful), or is it considered to dirty to help poor low caste hindu’s. I suggest you start looking inward and treat your fellow Hindu’s with more humanity.
     Giving some one respect and dignity is one way out of the cycle of hatred.

     I would like to thank Mr Robinson to enlighten us with all this data… However I feel him being a History student he still lives in 17th or may be 19th centaury. He seems to me a man who studies and reads a lot, However his views seems uni directional as people like him once in history would have said that earth is flat because there never knew that universe can be 3 dimensional. So Dear Robinson it would be great if you can se in all directions and religions because you will find hundreds of such references of atrocities with fellow human beings. He also needs to understand the different between what a religion preaches and the cultural beliefs.

     Let me help you enlighten yourself a little bit.

     Firstly, existence of Ram’s Birthplace (if you have visited Ayodhya) is unquestionable (no offence to the documentary teamand its findings). The date Lord Ram was born can be zeroed down to 10th of January 5114 B.C. The scriptures and the literature (again if you have visited Ayodhya) suggest that it was the location of Lord Ram’s birth. Even NASA suggests a man made bridge structure called Ram Setu that exists between India & Sri Lanka.

     However religion is not about proving facts but about belief. What you want to believe becomes religion for you.

     I still feel and truly want that place to be converted to a all workship place not only having a Mandir and Masjid but also a Church and Gurudhwra. That would reflect the true spirit of India. And trust me people agreeing to me for this in India would me more than the population of the country you reside in.

     Also as I talked about enlightening you. Let me talk about the present world we live in. Here are some facts that will help you see the 3 Dimensional picture.

     1) Kurdistan is the only known part of Iraq –and one of the places in the world–where female circumcision is widespread. More than 60 percent of muslim women in Kurdish areas of northern Iraq have been circumcised, according to a study conducted this year. In at least one Kurdish territory, 95 percent of women have undergone the practice, which human rights groups call female genital mutilation

     2) Though unislamic, Muslims everywhere believe in the existence of mortal spirits (jinn), said to be descended from Iblis, a spirit fallen from heaven.’

     3) ISLAM PERFORMS RITUAL ABUSE THROUGH HUMAN SACRIFICE AND THE ADVOCATION OF PEDOPHILIA WHICH IS RAPING CHILDREN IN KORAN TO SERVE ALLAH. AGAIN A CULTURAL PRACTICE

     4) In some Arab societies the only way to “cleanse” the family honor is to kill the “offending” woman or girl.A study of female homicide in Alexandria, Egypt, found that 47% of all women killed were murdered by a relative after they had been raped (190). At a recent conference in Jordan, experts from six Arab countries estimated that at least several hundred Arab women die each year as a result of honor killings
     5) In islamic societies, men batter and kill women with virtual impunity. In Pakistan, Afghanistan, Bangladesh, Saudi Arabia, Jordan, and other islamic countires, men kill their sisters and mothers if they are victims of rape ! In such cases the women are completely without fault ! They get attacked and raped, and THEY have to be punished for it ???

     6) From Britian a 15-year-old girl in Pakistan who was tricked into marriage over the telephone with a 40-year-old man from Sheffield, who had the mental age of a four-year-old child.
     “The Home Office refused to recognise the validity of the marriage but the Islamic Sharia Council in Britain accepted it,” said Dr Al-Alawi.

     6) In 2006 Marina Mahathir, the daughter of Malaysia’s former Prime Minister, and a campaigner for women’s rights, described the status of Muslim women in Malaysia as similar to that of Black South Africans under apartheid.

     7) Under Taliban religious leadership, was characterized by feminist groups and others as a “gender apartheid” system where women are segregated from men in public and do not enjoy legal equality or equal access to employment or education

     Women are stoned to dealth for adultery (most of the times on fake allegations)

     9) Women on Saudi soil must have a husband or male relative as an escort. We are not allowed to drive. When sight-seeing we must wear a full-length black gown known as an abaya. During Saudi Arabia’s first elections, held the week before women were not permitted to vote or run for office.” She states that hotels have no female employees, and that segregated eating areas in hotels and beaches for women have poorer facilities. She also criticizes Saudi law for setting female inheritance at half of what men inherit .

     10) It became unusual for women to worship in mosques because of fears of unchastity caused by interaction between sexes; this condition persisted until the late 1960s. Since then, women have become increasingly involved in the mosque, though men and women generally worship separately (Muslims explain this by citing the need to avoid distraction during prayer prostrations that raise the buttocks while the forehead touches the ground. Separation between sexes ranges from men and women on opposite sides of an aisle, to men in front of women (as was the case in the time of Muhammad), to women in second-floor balconies or separate rooms accessible by a door for women only. There is a growing movement of women who complain of second-class conditions in separate female sections of mosques.

     10) CASTE SYSTEM - Those who are referred to as Ashrafs are presumed to have a superior status derived from their foreign Arab ancestry

     Some History Also:
     A classical example of scholarly declaration of the Muslim caste system is the Fatawa-i Jahandari, written by the fourteenth century Turkish scholar, Ziauddin Barani. Barani was known for his intensely casteist views, and regarded the Ashraf Muslims as racially superior to the Ajlaf Muslims. He divided the Muslims into grades and sub-grades. In his scheme, all high positions and privileges were to be a monopoly of the high born Turks. Even in his interpretation of the Koranic verse “Indeed, the pious amongst you are most honored by Allah”, he considered piety to be associated with noble birth. Barrani was specific in his recommendation that the “sons of Mohamed” [i.e. Ashrafs] “be given a higher social status than the low-born [i.e. Ajlaf]

     In Pakistan
     11) The society is rigidly divided into subgroups where each Quom is assigned a profession. Different Quoms are not permitted to intermarry or live in the same community. These Muslims practice a ritual-based system of social stratification. The Quoms who deal with human emissions are ranked the lowest

     Lower castes are often severely persecuted by the upper castes. Lower castes are denied privileges in many communities and violence is committed against them. A particularly infamous example of such incidents is that of Mukhtaran Mai in Pakistan, a low caste woman who was gang raped by upper caste men. In addition, educated Pakistani women from the lower castes are often persecuted by the higher castes for attempting to break the shackles of the restrictive system (that traditionally denied education to the lower castes, particularly the women). A recent example of this is the case of Ghazala Shaheen, a low caste Muslim woman in Pakistan who, in addition to getting a higher education, had an uncle who eloped with a woman of a high caste family. She was accosted and gang-raped by the upper-caste family. The chances of any legal action are low due to the Pakistani Government’s inability to repeal the Hudood ordinance against women in Pakistan

     Some more History:

     12) Islam is divided into, if not more, then as many sects as is Hinduism. Schisms, focusing first on disagreements over who should lead the new faith, and later, on matters of doctrine, began developing immediately after Muhammad’s death in the year 632: Islam splintered into the Sunni and Shia sects, which always were at each other’s throats; Kharijis, who provided the first major schism within Islam; Alawis, who broke away from the Shiites in the 9th century; Ahmadiyyahs, who believe their founder was a renovator of Islam, a position other Muslims consider to be heretical; the Wahhabis, who flay the rest of the Sunnis; the Ismailis, earlier known as the Hashishi or the Malahida (”impious heretics”); Druzes, whom most Muslims consider blasphemous since they declared that God was manifested in human form as the Egyptian caliph al Hakim Bi-amr Allah 1,000 years ago, and who do not accept new members and often pose as members of the dominant religion where they live; Salafis, Nusayris, Fatimids, Musta’lians, Qarmatians… and so on and so forth — none of whom will be ready to give their daughters to men of the other sects.

     13) If some Muslims do not afford other Muslims the self-respect they seek, what’s it got to do with us Hindus and our castes?! In fact, unlike Hindus, Muslims are making new societal formations to discriminate against — in Pakistan, what is “MOJAHIR” (Muslims who Migrated to Pakistan from Northern Indian states of Uttar Pradesh and Bihar ) if not a lower caste…? I hope the mojahir situation is changing now it reflects with not so desirable but once a Mojahir in Mr Mussaraf’s case.

     Again I would like to state that my intention is not to hurt any religious sentiments, I personally respect all religions and beliefs. I feel Religion teaches us to unite and it’s a way of life and a way to Moksha or enlightenment.

     Fundamentalists from any religion are the one who just mislead people and use sentiments for their own selfish interest, certainly they are not the caretaker of any religion.

     Mr Robinson quoting and unquoting can continue, its endless - you can come up with 100 examples and I can come with 101.

     Its not about who is better, its about how all of us being from any religion, caste or creed can work together for a better now and a better tomorrow.

     It can only happen if we as mature individuals can contribute to this cause using our religion, our beliefs to understand each other better. Spread love and harmony

178. # Animesh on 04 Jan 2009 at 11:34 pm

     I Am sorry was typing in word so had pasted Mr Robisons Comments Please Read this One
     FOR ROBINSON

     I would like to thank Mr Robinson to enlighten us with all this data… However I feel him being a History student he still lives in 17th or may be 19th centaury. He seems to me a man who studies and reads a lot, However his views seems uni directional as people like him once in history would have said that earth is flat because there never knew that universe can be 3 dimensional. So Dear Robinson it would be great if you can se in all directions and religions because you will find hundreds of such references of atrocities with fellow human beings. He also needs to understand the different between what a religion preaches and the cultural beliefs.

     Let me help you enlighten yourself a little bit.

     Firstly, existence of Ram’s Birthplace (if you have visited Ayodhya) is unquestionable (no offence to the documentary teamand its findings). The date Lord Ram was born can be zeroed down to 10th of January 5114 B.C. The scriptures and the literature (again if you have visited Ayodhya) suggest that it was the location of Lord Ram’s birth. Even NASA suggests a man made bridge structure called Ram Setu that exists between India & Sri Lanka.

     However religion is not about proving facts but about belief. What you want to believe becomes religion for you.

     I still feel and truly want that place to be converted to a all workship place not only having a Mandir and Masjid but also a Church and Gurudhwra. That would reflect the true spirit of India. And trust me people agreeing to me for this in India would me more than the population of the country you reside in.

     Also as I talked about enlightening you. Let me talk about the present world we live in. Here are some facts that will help you see the 3 Dimensional picture.

     1) Kurdistan is the only known part of Iraq –and one of the places in the world–where female circumcision is widespread. More than 60 percent of muslim women in Kurdish areas of northern Iraq have been circumcised, according to a study conducted this year. In at least one Kurdish territory, 95 percent of women have undergone the practice, which human rights groups call female genital mutilation

     2) Though unislamic, Muslims everywhere believe in the existence of mortal spirits (jinn), said to be descended from Iblis, a spirit fallen from heaven.’

     3) ISLAM PERFORMS RITUAL ABUSE THROUGH HUMAN SACRIFICE AND THE ADVOCATION OF PEDOPHILIA WHICH IS RAPING CHILDREN IN KORAN TO SERVE ALLAH. AGAIN A CULTURAL PRACTICE

     4) In some Arab societies the only way to “cleanse” the family honor is to kill the “offending” woman or girl.A study of female homicide in Alexandria, Egypt, found that 47% of all women killed were murdered by a relative after they had been raped (190). At a recent conference in Jordan, experts from six Arab countries estimated that at least several hundred Arab women die each year as a result of honor killings
     5) In islamic societies, men batter and kill women with virtual impunity. In Pakistan, Afghanistan, Bangladesh, Saudi Arabia, Jordan, and other islamic countires, men kill their sisters and mothers if they are victims of rape ! In such cases the women are completely without fault ! They get attacked and raped, and THEY have to be punished for it ???

     6) From Britian a 15-year-old girl in Pakistan who was tricked into marriage over the telephone with a 40-year-old man from Sheffield, who had the mental age of a four-year-old child.
     “The Home Office refused to recognise the validity of the marriage but the Islamic Sharia Council in Britain accepted it,” said Dr Al-Alawi.

     6) In 2006 Marina Mahathir, the daughter of Malaysia’s former Prime Minister, and a campaigner for women’s rights, described the status of Muslim women in Malaysia as similar to that of Black South Africans under apartheid.

     7) Under Taliban religious leadership, was characterized by feminist groups and others as a “gender apartheid” system where women are segregated from men in public and do not enjoy legal equality or equal access to employment or education

     Women are stoned to dealth for adultery (most of the times on fake allegations)

     9) Women on Saudi soil must have a husband or male relative as an escort. We are not allowed to drive. When sight-seeing we must wear a full-length black gown known as an abaya. During Saudi Arabia’s first elections, held the week before women were not permitted to vote or run for office.” She states that hotels have no female employees, and that segregated eating areas in hotels and beaches for women have poorer facilities. She also criticizes Saudi law for setting female inheritance at half of what men inherit .

     10) It became unusual for women to worship in mosques because of fears of unchastity caused by interaction between sexes; this condition persisted until the late 1960s. Since then, women have become increasingly involved in the mosque, though men and women generally worship separately (Muslims explain this by citing the need to avoid distraction during prayer prostrations that raise the buttocks while the forehead touches the ground. Separation between sexes ranges from men and women on opposite sides of an aisle, to men in front of women (as was the case in the time of Muhammad), to women in second-floor balconies or separate rooms accessible by a door for women only. There is a growing movement of women who complain of second-class conditions in separate female sections of mosques.

     10) CASTE SYSTEM - Those who are referred to as Ashrafs are presumed to have a superior status derived from their foreign Arab ancestry

     Some History Also:
     A classical example of scholarly declaration of the Muslim caste system is the Fatawa-i Jahandari, written by the fourteenth century Turkish scholar, Ziauddin Barani. Barani was known for his intensely casteist views, and regarded the Ashraf Muslims as racially superior to the Ajlaf Muslims. He divided the Muslims into grades and sub-grades. In his scheme, all high positions and privileges were to be a monopoly of the high born Turks. Even in his interpretation of the Koranic verse “Indeed, the pious amongst you are most honored by Allah”, he considered piety to be associated with noble birth. Barrani was specific in his recommendation that the “sons of Mohamed” [i.e. Ashrafs] “be given a higher social status than the low-born [i.e. Ajlaf]

     In Pakistan
     11) The society is rigidly divided into subgroups where each Quom is assigned a profession. Different Quoms are not permitted to intermarry or live in the same community. These Muslims practice a ritual-based system of social stratification. The Quoms who deal with human emissions are ranked the lowest

     Lower castes are often severely persecuted by the upper castes. Lower castes are denied privileges in many communities and violence is committed against them. A particularly infamous example of such incidents is that of Mukhtaran Mai in Pakistan, a low caste woman who was gang raped by upper caste men. In addition, educated Pakistani women from the lower castes are often persecuted by the higher castes for attempting to break the shackles of the restrictive system (that traditionally denied education to the lower castes, particularly the women). A recent example of this is the case of Ghazala Shaheen, a low caste Muslim woman in Pakistan who, in addition to getting a higher education, had an uncle who eloped with a woman of a high caste family. She was accosted and gang-raped by the upper-caste family. The chances of any legal action are low due to the Pakistani Government’s inability to repeal the Hudood ordinance against women in Pakistan

     Some more History:

     12) Islam is divided into, if not more, then as many sects as is Hinduism. Schisms, focusing first on disagreements over who should lead the new faith, and later, on matters of doctrine, began developing immediately after Muhammad’s death in the year 632: Islam splintered into the Sunni and Shia sects, which always were at each other’s throats; Kharijis, who provided the first major schism within Islam; Alawis, who broke away from the Shiites in the 9th century; Ahmadiyyahs, who believe their founder was a renovator of Islam, a position other Muslims consider to be heretical; the Wahhabis, who flay the rest of the Sunnis; the Ismailis, earlier known as the Hashishi or the Malahida (”impious heretics”); Druzes, whom most Muslims consider blasphemous since they declared that God was manifested in human form as the Egyptian caliph al Hakim Bi-amr Allah 1,000 years ago, and who do not accept new members and often pose as members of the dominant religion where they live; Salafis, Nusayris, Fatimids, Musta’lians, Qarmatians… and so on and so forth — none of whom will be ready to give their daughters to men of the other sects.

     13) If some Muslims do not afford other Muslims the self-respect they seek, what’s it got to do with us Hindus and our castes?! In fact, unlike Hindus, Muslims are making new societal formations to discriminate against — in Pakistan, what is “MOJAHIR” (Muslims who Migrated to Pakistan from Northern Indian states of Uttar Pradesh and Bihar ) if not a lower caste…? I hope the mojahir situation is changing now it reflects with not so desirable but once a Mojahir in Mr Mussaraf’s case.

     Again I would like to state that my intention is not to hurt any religious sentiments, I personally respect all religions and beliefs. I feel Religion teaches us to unite and it’s a way of life and a way to Moksha or enlightenment.

     Fundamentalists from any religion are the one who just mislead people and use sentiments for their own selfish interest, certainly they are not the caretaker of any religion.

     Mr Robinson quoting and unquoting can continue, its endless - you can come up with 100 examples and I can come with 101.

     Its not about who is better, its about how all of us being from any religion, caste or creed can work together for a better now and a better tomorrow.

     It can only happen if we as mature individuals can contribute to this cause using our religion, our beliefs to understand each other better. Spread love and harmony

179. # M.Robinson on 05 Jan 2009 at 1:53 am

     @ Animesh

     In the Old testament there is ‘an eye for an eye’. The perpetrator of a crime is jugded by society and given a sentence which is deemed appropriate for the day and in relation to that particular countries religious and cultural history. I know of the various differences in Islam, in relation to the sects, or denominations. In Europe we have Christian denominations, the Catholics killed those it considered heretical, then England and France had the 100 year Catholic and Protestant wars. Northern Ireland has had its fair share of sectarian violence.Where religion is left, nationalism takes over(the new religion).
     Rather than address the points I made earlier you have reverberated to Insulting Islam and muslims. this is the usual Islamophodia and disinformation I read from most Hindu’s on various blogs. You have raised a few issues, in the overall majority the issue is not of what Islam says but what certain people think of culture and are quick to attach it to Islam.

     The circumcisiom of women is hideous to say the least, but no where in Islam is it allowed. Rather it is a cultural phenomenon, that has survived. It exists in some African Christian countries, again there is nothing in the Gospels that allows such an act.

     Where as there is a Caste system within Hindu scripture, there is no caste system within Islam.

     ‘educated Pakistani women from the lower castes are often persecuted by the higher castes for attempting to break the shackles of the restrictive system ‘

     The caste system does not exist in Islam, what exists in Pakistan are tribal/Klan affiliations.In arab countries muslims from different tribes intermarry, the reason this does’nt happen often in Pakistan, I believe because as the overwhelming majority of muslims are the descendents of Hindu’s, some of the Hindu cultural aspects have remained. The reason of injustice in Pakistan is due the inept and despicable big landowners who patronise the current situation for their ends. In Britain, we broke the backbone of these landowning families by a simple change in the law, it was the ‘Inheritence tax’.

     Mohajir, in its correct interpretation refers to ‘ those who become persecuted because of their religion, or who cannot truly follow their religious beliefs because of fear, can then emigrate to a different land.’ In general there will always be some schism between native and emigres. In Britain there was extreme prejudice towards immigrants, things have improved but we still need to reduce ignorance. In Pakistan it was and still is a political tool.

     ‘ “sons of Mohamed” [i.e. Ashrafs] “be given a higher social status than the low-born [i.e. Ajlaf]

     In Pakistan’

     In the three abrahamic faiths, no one is higher expect through good works and piety. The proof is in the last sermon of the Prophet Muhammad. This ‘Barrani’ individual is coming up with theories which cannot be ascribed to Islam but rather his own warped thinking.

     In most muslim countries both the state and certain fabrics of society pay lip service to Islam and Islamic rights of women. An Imam I know, told me of the rights for women in Islam, I was astounded, some of them are listed are below:

     women who work, have the right to keep that money for themselves.(set out 1400 years ago)
     It is the husbands job to provide for household expenditure..(set out 1400 years ago)
     Women can own their own property, separate from their husbands..(set out 1400 years ago)
     Islamic marriage contracts are to certain degree ‘pre-nuptial ‘ agreements.Where women can set certain conditions if they want. (set out 1400 years ago).
     The inheritence women receive, belongs to them not their husbands.(set out 1400 years ago).

     What people do in a cultural context, may be different, but you cannot ascribe that to Islam.

     In Saudi arabia recently there was a case of a newscaster who was beaten by her husband( a case of domestic violence), she reported it to the police, and the courts handed out a guilty verdict to her husband, the punishment was lashes on his back.You may not agree with the punishment system in Saudi Arabia, thats tough its their country. Even in a secular nation like Singapore there is corporal punishment.there was the case of a Young american tourist who thought it would be cool to damage some cars, upon being apprehended and taken to court, he was sentenced to ten lashes on the buttocks and a fine. the american press were in uproar. President Clinton phoned the Prime minister of Singapore, but the reply was ‘the law is the law’, Ignorance is no defence.So the young American was given his due medicine.

     What I have seen on this blog is those who show affinity to India, do not attack Pakistan, but rather Islam. This I believe they feel they are serving their future patrons(USA and Israel). They are literally taking the term ‘My enemies enemy is my friend’ to its conclusion.

180. # Nitin on 05 Jan 2009 at 2:20 am

     Yes Animesh..I got it thats its not for me and its for Mr. Robinson
     GReat work u have typed in a lot of stuff…Its worth more than apreceation.But what i have notices is that Mr.Robinson seems to be very stuborn .I dont think it might open his eyez!
     Let him be happy what with he believes
     (lakh koshish karlo …akhri boond chadi main he girege)

181. # Nitin on 05 Jan 2009 at 2:21 am

     Yes Animesh..I got it thats its not for me and its for Mr. Robinson
     GReat work u have typed in a lot of stuff…Its worth more than apreceation.But what i have noticed is that Mr.Robinson seems to be very stuborn .I dont think it might open his eyez!
     Let him be happy with what he believes
     (lakh koshish karlo …akhri boond chadi main he girege)

182. # M.Robinson on 05 Jan 2009 at 2:23 am

     @ Nitin
     ‘I watch cnn for like 3 hrs everyday after my work! and also indian news channels!’

     This is the same CNN that is embedded with US troops in Iraq. A CNN that recently started to spout anti-Iranian propaganda, firstly by having an anchor woman of Iranian descent and getting her to do it. This is the same CNN that deliberately translated speeches incorrectly, that were made by the president of Iran(Mr.Ahmanidejad). I do not take for gospel issues concerning world politics. This occured not during some obscure time in history, but when noises were being made about attacking Iran by the Bush administration.

     Please feel free to believe CNN.

     ‘thats why majority of the world stand behind india ,rather pakistan! USSR is a big ally of India .’

     You must really be relying on CNN and Indian channels for your news, because I can tell you now, the USSR does not exist any more. The Russians are allies of yours but how much of an ally are you of theirs? would India side with Russia if hypothetically the USA and Russia went to war?
     Considering that India’s new found friends are USA and Israel, whom both have used Georgia to cajole Russian into a little boder war.

183. # Nitin on 05 Jan 2009 at 2:47 am

     M.Robinson
     okay sir..tell me which channels should I watch to get so called true news , which only you get!

184. # Sheks on 05 Jan 2009 at 8:20 am

     @ Robinson

     What is - Indian or Hindu or Muslim or Pakistani or British ?

     For that matter…Cricket Fans, Asians, Europeans or Book Lovers

     How do we know?

     Identities are artificial constructions. So, any point of view that generalizes actions/motives across identities is not aligned to the truth, even though it might be educated.

     A historical context would help. But unfortunately, history is somebody’s opinion about what happened - as they want you to see it. Where did you learn your history, Robinson? And where did you learn your religion? How much did you explore before deciding on the nature of Hindusim and India?

     It is fundamentally stupid to arrive at a discussion with the conclusion already firmly in place, at least in your head. ‘Education’ and ‘Intellect’ then becomes only tools to help you prove something you already believe emotionally.

     There are numerous Indians and Pakistanis in this forum who are advocating peace and harmony with each other - though much less eloquently than you are espousing your stubborn point of view. They have the potential to bring about a real change in the real world, because they are not walking around with their education blinding them to what’s possible.

     Past is not equal to the future.

     And to understand and manifest that - you need character, not historical education.

185. # G.VINOD on 05 Jan 2009 at 8:43 am

     Robinson
     India supported the Russians during the Russia-Georgian war and
     condemned the Georgian atrocities against the S.Ossetians.

186. # Fayaz Ahmed on 05 Jan 2009 at 12:20 pm

     I have read the comments of all persons here most of the people talked about terrorism. First of all we should define what is terrorism. Why people blast thereselves when life is so precious.Why they takes such a decision. The world is travelling through one of it darkest period. The poor people are forced to do that when they dont have any reason to live they die but why. The best example is right now israel.What is he doing did anyone see the pictures of innocent children murdered what was there fault. there fault is that they are born in palestine now imagine what will be the sentiments of there parents. They will think they have lost everything and this Psychic pressure will force them to do such activities. Now what the whole world is doing right now nothing UNO everything is fake just a way to control poor countries. This will cause many OSAMA BIN Ladens to born. And we all are silent just watching doing nothing. Dont condemn the reaction condemn the action for that reaction. This dark period of world is responsible for this in which Right is wrong and wrong is right.America,India what all these countries are doing. America killing innocent people in IRAQ.India Killing people in ASAM,Kashmir.This cause disturbences in there own country.If this does not stop a third world war is on its way and think what would be the results.Massive destruction, massive killings and we all would be responsible for it the need is we should change our attitudes.We should stop the killings of innocent people. We should not link these things to religion. We should link it to our soceities.

187. # M.Robinson on 05 Jan 2009 at 1:01 pm
188. # Sheks on 05 Jan 2009 at 1:54 pm

     @ Robinson

     Do you honestly believe that you could prove me or anyone wrong, except in your own eyes? The biggest fallacy would be to assume that anyone can “win” an argument.

     It is always possible to dig up dirt and state facts in such a way that our point of view ’seems’ correct. The more intelligent you are, the better you are at convincing yourself that your point of view is the one that is right.

     You have roughly made about four points in your comment and it is entirely possible (and extremely easy) for me or anyone else to state other facts which would paint a whole new picture, quite contrary to the one your paint. I could ask you for instance - what is your education of the Hindu scriptures and what have you understood? But honestly, it would be waste of time to discuss that. I have no desire to do so.

     I hardly want to state my preference or distaste for any of the organizations or ‘identities’ you talk about in your post. I have not found that helpful in understanding, dissecting or thinking about issues.

     So, Robinson - will you be intellectually honest and courageous enough to explore with me an entirely new way of thinking about history, religion, politics and identities?

     It’s called “principles”.

     Instead of forming opinions hashed from others, try this:

     Really look into what you believe about the world and find a principle that rings true for you.

     For example “Violence is wrong”.

     If that seems too revolutionary, how about “Understanding leads to tolerance” or “When people understand each other, they are less prone to kill each other”.

     Now, with those simple principles - it becomes easy to look at things happening in the world (without predispositions) and state your preferences. When you do this, you do not feel constrained or imprisoned by what you “have always believed” or “should believe” because “it is right” and “because i know it to be right”.

     If you and I were to agree on a principle which says “Violence is wrong” then we could isolate instances of violence perpetrated by anyone and state our preference against those actions.

     If Hindus are indulged in violence - it’s wrong.
     If Muslims are indulgedin violence - it’s wrong.
     If Indians are induldged in violence - it’s wrong.
     If Pakistanis are indulged in violence - it’s wrong.

     Of course, if you want - we can have a discussion on what constitutes violence and if there are any cases in which it could be justified. That is open to discussion - and what a fruitful discussion it will be!! Expanding, for both you and me.

     Unlike here, where - you - with a made up mind, fixed point of view are using your intellect and your knowledge to spew venom.

     Principles will help you denounce actions and not communities or religions.

     Allow me to repeat that - it’s really important and I want you to get this:

     Principles will help you denounce actions and not communities or religions.

     It will free you from the shackles of “this is right, that is wrong - they are right, they are wrong - he is right, she is wrong” - thinking.

     Of course, you will still need the courage to apply the principles fairly. That, as I mentioned - would require character.

189. # Well-Wisher on 05 Jan 2009 at 5:07 pm

     @Robinson & Fayaz Ahmad
     If muslims really care about other country’s muslims, let their government call them out and give citizenship of their nation, build nice houses, and give them good life there. Otherwise don’t talk people about other countries, we know how to treat our own people. You all hypocrites keep on barking on all the false information and consistently espoused by terrorist supporters like you. Did you all never read in history that your moghul tyrants killed millions of people in India and destroyed numerous precious valuable Hindu temples? Don’t keep on spitting poisons on others, we developed resistance to that already, you people will run out of poison sooner and finally go retarded.

190. # Monis on 05 Jan 2009 at 6:06 pm

     @ Well Wisher

     You are well wisher of Zionist Hindus only……
     So just keep you mouth shut or fights us like a man. You all Indians have a same habit of barking. Now its time to do some thing, time to bite so c’mon my janu we are waiting for you….

191. # Animesh on 05 Jan 2009 at 6:54 pm

     Dear Aby, Can youplease moderate the blog I have just posted

192. # Animesh on 05 Jan 2009 at 7:36 pm

     My Dear Mr Robinson, you seem to me as a vivid reader a person who reads and (thinks)
     knows a lot, however you have not only failed to read but also misinterpret what I had written in my last comment. So let me help you again (it would have been great if I was paid for helping you comprehend better as trust me it is like a Job but no regrets)
     We have also agreed to no. of things, which I feel shows there is little sanity left in you.
     Let me quote what I had written in the comment:

     Comment 1
     “He also needs to understand the difference between what a religion preaches and the cultural beliefs”
     Comment 2
     “THOUGH UNISLAMIC”, Muslims everywhere believe in the existence of mortal spirits (jinn), said to be descended from Iblis, a spirit fallen from heaven.

     Comment 3
     ISLAM PERFORMS RITUAL ABUSE THROUGH HUMAN SACRIFICE AND THE ADVOCATION OF PEDOPHILIA WHICH IS RAPING CHILDREN IN KORAN TO SERVE ALLAH. AGAIN “A CULTURAL PRACTICE”
     Thrice in my last post I had mentioned that its all about Cultural beliefs and not about what religion preaches and you have agreed to me twice in your post .
     Quoting you:
     “ You have raised a few issues, in the overall majority the issue is not of what Islam says but what certain people think of culture and are quick to attach it to Islam.”
     “What people do in a cultural context, may be different, but you cannot ascribe that to Islam.”
     So I guess it nullifies your argument when you said.
     “Rather than address the points I made earlier you have reverberated to Insulting Islam and muslims. this is the usual Islamophodia and disinformation I read from most Hindu’s on various blogs.”

     “What I have seen on this blog is those who show affinity to India, do not attack Pakistan, but rather Islam.”
     This was inspite of us thinking alike and me clarifying at the end of the post by saying:
     “Again I would like to state that my intention is not to hurt any religious sentiments, I personally respect all religions and beliefs. I feel Religion teaches us to unite and it’s a way of life and a way to Moksha or enlightenment”
     I guess next time being a self-proclaimed historian, be right and more importantly logical in points you make. Ask yourself questions like Why, How, to Whom, Whats the basis of points I am making, Do I know enough, What can be the counter points that I can face and What are the practices that actually happen in line with the religion I am advocating.Continued in next post…

193. # Animesh on 05 Jan 2009 at 7:38 pm

     Your knowledge is good but questionable as I would reiterate that Earth is not Flat its Round, stop looking in one direction look everywhere in all the directions because again religion is not about being superior its there to unite and a way to enlightenment.
     As far as your understanding about Hinduism is concerned as you had written in one of the earlier post its very very limited. If you had to give a test probably you would have scored in single digits out of hundred.
     You know about the Sati Pratha, Dowry, Priests impregnanting women, untouchability, only bramin priests etc etc.
     When I said that there is a difference between what a religion preaches and the cultural beliefs and quoted few examples for the muslim community (I also have a list of Christians doing pretty much the same) it did not go well with you. My intention was only to make you realize that in all religions there is difference between its preaching and the way its being followed. Though your examples were outdated and it was like using Windows 3.1 version or may be Windows 95 you need to update yourself to be a Vista.
     All these that you have written are social evils not religious evils as you think them to be.
     As far as your biggest argument about the caste system is concerned. Hinduism gives a social structure to the society dividing them into Bramins (religious scholars), Khatrias (the warriors), Shudras (The workers) and Vaishyas (the business community)

     However it does not endorse that a son of Bramin has to be a Bramin, a shudra or Vaishyas can be a Bramin if he is well read and a scholar.

     It was supposed to be a work related divison of classes, there was no caste angle to it and anyboby could have been anybody just by having those skillsets.
     Due to struggle of power and to pass over their heritage to their sons and family it however became a rigid system were religion was interpreted the way priests wanted it to.

     And what I wanted to make you understand was that we had our set of priests who did that, so there were maulana’s and pastors or fathers who did that with every religion on earth for their own connivance.Continued in next post

194. # Animesh on 05 Jan 2009 at 7:40 pm

     For Robinson : As far as history is concerned we had Chandra Gupta Maurya a very famous ruler who was son of a Dasi or Servant. Maharishi Valmiki was son of a shudra and an outcaste and hundreds of examples like these which I can quote.
     I personally love muslims and have lot of friends who have been with me in thick and thin.

     Just to help you a little bit more I would quote some hindu teachings that may help you see the other side as well.

     What does Hinduism say about conversion ?
     There is no concept of conversion in Hinduism. Hinduism believes in one God. If you read the Bible, you can see expressions like “God of the Egyptians”, “God of Israelites”, etc. Hinduism does not believe in many Gods like this. Hinduism believes in one God, whom everyone of every religion call by various names and worship in their own way. It is said in the Vedas that “God is one. The wise men call Him by various names.” You should note here that the people who call God by various names are called “wise men”. In the Bhagavat Gita, it is said that in whatever way a man worships God, God being Omniscient, knows that He is being worshipped and responds to the sincerity of the worshipper. Hinduism accepts diversity of religions and accepts the validity if several paths, and so there is no concept of conversion.
     Hinduism cares only about vertical conversion. Hinduism encourages and helps a Christian to be a better Christian and a Muslim to be a better Muslim. Any Hindu saint will ask a Christian to have faith in Christ and go to Church regularly. He will ask a Muslim to have faith in Allah and perform the religious duties ordained in the Koran sincerely. Hinduism does not support horizontal conversion from one faith to another.
     Hindus consider claims that “if you do not believe in Christ, you will be doomed” as a disparaging remark on Christ. Christ is a personification of selflessness. His love is unconditional. Putting conditions like this on Him is blasphemy.

195. # M.Robinson on 05 Jan 2009 at 8:34 pm

     Probably my last reply here.

     The essence of my argument was not that any particular religion was to blame. In saying that I would still contend that when it comes to issues relating to muslims, one sees a sea of bloggers who feel they need to put in their two-pence worth of worthless dribble, meaningless by any stretch of the imagination, I could mention some names but I am sure those correspondents are aware of their own identity.
     Now If the attacks had been against Christianity or Hinduism, then I would have argued a point against the attackers.

196. # Vishal on 06 Jan 2009 at 12:06 pm

     The entire country of Pakistan is a blemish on the world map.
     They have done no respectable work in any field except in the field of terrorism.
     Look at their history, their politicians their military, their education system, their cricket team (has so many clashes within, classic example being 8 captain swaps in a year.) Look at Asif, afridi, shoaib and all the dopers in their national team. they earn so much bad repute to their countrymen and to the game. Not a single civil govt has lasted it tenure, owe it to the insecurities within the people of pakistan. Their culture is faulty and it has been shown in their history. if they cant see it then they have become ‘ignorant’.

     Look at their text books which are vastly teaching anti-india culture. Infact pakistan state policy is to defeat india in all aspects and not to prosper on its own. Their history text books says “India was a part of pakistan before partition” … wow…. nice to hear that….. they say that “The britishers came to the subcontinent conspiring with the hindus who wanted to suppress the muslims” … all facts are distorted, to corrupt the minds of pakistani citizens. They say they defeated the indian army in 1971… this after indian returned 90000 pakistan soldiers who were prisioners of war, After loosing control on east pakistan (bangladesh)….. “Chullu bhar pani main doob maro salo” ….. even in 1965 they say they won….. and in kargil in 1999….. ok keep fooling yourself and your generations. The world outside knows the truth and is coming to terms with the true colors of Pakistan. Wait and let the Afghanistan war to be over and the US will need no more support of the Pakistanis and they will chuck them out of all ties.

     The state of Pakistan was created out of hatred sowed by jinnah and the muslim league. They were successful in making some muslims insecure enough to demand a separate state. But the point to be noted is that the creation of pakistan was out of hatred. The first step itself in the formation of this poor country was anti-indian.

     Indian history shows non-violence, in fact we have never been aggressive and expansionists against any civilization of the world. That is why their are christians, muslims, buddhists, sikhs and so many other religions who have lived in harmony. If this would have been in any other country then they would have been divided into ten smaller countries by now.

     Pakistan should concentrate of Education, health, poverty, corruption, and many such areas and get rid of its anti-india state policy. They should get their houses in order. Pakistanis should acknowledge that they are indeed in a pathetic condition. India is rising and moving ahead in all aspects. Infact the entire GDP of pakistan is not even equal to 1/4th of the income of Mumbai. 24.38 % is the rate of inflation in this poor country computed by international agencies. (though the govt lies it as 12.45%) as apposed to 6.3% in India. Such is the pathetic state of pakistan and it is largely depended on the charities it gets from the world. God save pakistan. If they continue like this then the country is doomed.

197. # vishal on 06 Jan 2009 at 4:29 pm

     have a look here:

     http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/4964934.stm

198. # Sheks on 06 Jan 2009 at 7:39 pm

     Like I said, it requires intellectual honesty and character…

199. # Animesh on 06 Jan 2009 at 7:40 pm

     Dear Mr Robinson, will miss you on the post, though with no more points to make I think you must have decided to go back and re-learn your History for which you needed some time, you have all the rights for a graceful exit.
     However I really enjoyed sharing thoughts with you, Would like to make a good bye post.

     You must have heard the saying “An Eye for an Eye”,
     However you must have also heard “That an eye for an eye, makes the whole world blind” and its true if you try following it everywhere.
     Again I would like to quote you, what you said in your last blog.
     “The essence of my argument was not that any particular religion was to blame. In saying that I would still contend that when it comes to issues relating to muslims, one sees a sea of bloggers who feel they need to put in their two-pence worth of worthless dribble, meaningless by any stretch of the imagination”

     I will say that again that you seem to me as an intellectual person who has the ability to influence many, you are a vivid reader and I hope a good speaker too.

     The approach that you have taken till now for these bloggers is the First one – “An eye for an eye”
     You have reverted back by saying all the information that you have or can gather about what is wrong with other religions.
     I agree that lot of bloogers understand and comprehend the world where Islam has been shown in bad light and the main reason you can attribute to this the anti Islamic propoganda that has happened all across the world.
     Muslims in general are also at fault as I have not seen lot of them coming out and letting people who don’t know the true essence of Islam. you are one of them.
     You have clearly failed in your previous approach.

     I now request you to try the other approach
     “An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind”
     So next time when see such a sea of Islamophobic bloggers , try this Indian rule. Try to explain them about the good of Islam, the essence of Koran.
     I completely agree with sheks it seems you get in an argument with the conclusion already in place, this will never result in a fruitful discussion, as you have your own interpreted result in place, so whatever your try an argue you would just be trying to fit your argument to your interpreted result.

     For examples If you have already concluded that Indians or Hindus are bad, you would always try to find of look at what’s wrong with them. Even if India does something good it wont fit in with your thoughts as its already pre decided, you would completely denounce it or probably you will take that good deed as its weakness or may be just say its not enough.

     If you really wanna see this change in you though not necessary (if you still feel that I am only one of the sea of blogger’s) but what you need to do is , you need to unlearn certain things before you learn anything new.

     Unlearning will help you change your existing beliefs and will help you learn new things.

200. # VK on 06 Jan 2009 at 11:28 pm

     Pakistan has a history of disowning its own citizens after the work they were hired or recruited is done. During the Kargil War, Pakistani Army disowned the bodies and injured soldiers around the Line of Control (LOC), prompting Indian Army to cremate their bodies with full mulim rights. This time again (Mumbai Attack), they are washing away their hands by not accepting Ajmal Amir Kasab (jehadi dog) as a pakistani citizen. Pakistani Govt. has been repeatedly denying it’s role in the Mumabi Terror Attack, but if you go by the evidences that the Mumabi Police and the Indian investigatin agencies have gathered; kasab’s confession and his letter to Pakistani High Commission asking for Legal Assistance, Kasab’s father coming on GEO TV and accepting his son, GPS device (used by terrorist to navigate their way from Karach to Mumbai) found in the boat that was used by the 10 jehadi dogs, satellite phone conversations between the attackers and their masters in Pak, wrappers of milk, toothpaste and other items found in the boat with ‘made in Pakistan’ stamp etc. now all these evidences lead to only one country and that is our poor old neighbour pakistan. Whether the people or the govt. of of Pakistan accept it or not, the world community (US, UK, Australia, France, Germany, Israel…) has come to a consensus that the attacks on the mumbai had pakistani links. Even the FBI has conluded that the threads of mumbai attack are tied to pakistan.

     What more evidences you need Mr. Zardari? You can disown Kasab but you cannot let a father disown his son.

     Rather than making false statements to the media and misleading your countrymen, you should come out strong and act on the terrorist organizations like LeT, JeM, JuD, Hizb-Mujahideen etc…, shut their terror camps, execute people like Masood Azhar, Lakhvi, clean up the ISI. Come out clear on your strategy to tackle the terror otherwise it won’t be too long before this terror menace eats up the entire Pakistan.

201. # Nitin on 06 Jan 2009 at 11:57 pm

     Animesh buddy you rock

202. # VK on 07 Jan 2009 at 12:50 am

     Tale of two countries in 61 years of independence:

     Like any growing country India has its own problems, poverty, illiteracy, social issues, sponsored terrorism etc. but there is no denying fact that things are changing in India rapidly. We are second fastest growing economy (after china) and tenth largest economy in the world. If India continues to grow at the same pace, by 2020 we will be the third largest economy behind China and US. India’s growing middle class is second biggest in the world after China. We are a self sustained country that has been assisting and helping other countries in the region and around the world at times of emergency. Our IITs, IIMs, AIIMS are best in the world. We are the biggest software exporter in the world. TATA, Reliance, Infosys, Wipro, Mah & Mah, Aditya Birla Group, Bharti Telecom, ICICI Bank etc. are some of the many Indian Multinationals that are at par with any US or Global multinational.

     In contrast pakistan has become a hub of terror activities. They are on the verge of being declared a failed state. Things have only become bad to worse in that country. Their Army and the Civilian Govt. doesn’t see each other eye to eye, due to which the whole country is suffering. Had US not been funding Pakistan for their help on ‘War on Terror’, Pak would have stumbled by now. Their economy is in dire straits, recently they were out begging IMF for financial assistance. Their President has been begging around Saudi Arabia, China, US to run his country. Even if their democratically elected govt. wants to do something for the country, the Army, the ISI and the bloody radical mullahs doesn’t let it do anything.

     “Last week, Pakistan’s credit rating slipped to second worst in the world, just a step above that of Seychelles. With less than a month and a half of foreign exchange reserves and no more than 10 days of oil supplies at hand (down from 21 days earlier this year), Pakistan truly stands at the brink of bankruptcy.”

     Grow up Pak, it’s a high time. Start focussing on your flaws and clean up your mess before it swallows you.

203. # Rajesh on 07 Jan 2009 at 5:48 pm

     Situation around middle east is terrible for now. It might get worse. With Pakistan’s collapse India does not have to gain or loose anything. All India needs to do is keep its progress on track. As of now the economies around the world are grim. I see a minimal affect on the Indian economy. I dont know in this situation what will Pakistan do. We should not be simply be dragged in a conflict. But yes if security is challenged then we have to face Pakistan like Israel.
     I am proud to say that people might be living in poverty in India but atleast they are not terrorists like Pakistanis who dont hesitate killing their own people for sake of power and money.
     Let me tell you about my story when i was young. I used to stay close to muslim populated area. Whenever there was any Hindu festival approaching stones used to land on our house. People used to panic as to what was happening. There used to be silence around only to find some muslims throwing stones. You know what when asked they used to say they dont like Kafirs. Hindus are called Kafirs. I went to find what does that mean and found from one of my muslims friends that it was name given to people not following Islam.
     Another incident when there were hindu procession all the music was stopped if it approached any mosque. These are some of the instances where i saw muslims intolerant . From hating pigs, eating cows everything. What i feel is if in today’s world any religion has to flourish its got to be tolerant.
     This is my last reply on this site and i would like to state that no religion in this world is superior to other.

204. # Animesh on 07 Jan 2009 at 6:53 pm

     For Nitin Thanks Dude

205. # Yash on 08 Jan 2009 at 9:47 am

     AN UPDATE:-MAY,2008
     India on Wednesday test-fired the 3000 km range surface-to-surface nuclear capable Agni-3 missile from the Wheelers’ Island off Orissa coast.
     The intermediate range ballistic missile (IRBM) was test-fired from a mobile launcher from the launch complex (LC-4) of the integrated test range (ITR) at about 0956 hours, defence sources said.

     The 16 metre-long and 1.8-metre wide missile roared into the sky in a vertically slanted position leaving behind a thick column of orange and white smoke and, within seconds, became invisible to the naked eye, an eyewitness said.

     Agni-3 missile is fitted with on-board computer for its guidance system. A battery of sophisticated radars, electro-optic tracking systems, telemetric data centres in the mainland apart from two naval war ships anchored near the impact point, were engaged to monitor the entire trajectory in Wednesday’s test launch.

     “The test result will be known after detailed analyses of the flight data recovered,” the sources said.

     Weighing about 48 tonnes, the Agni-3 missile was first test-fired on July 9, 2006 but it failed to meet its mission objectives due to cascaded failure of booster flex nozzle controller.

     However, during the second test conducted on April 12, 2007, the entire flight path of 15 minutes duration validated all mission objectives, they said.

     Though defence scientists had planned only three tests of the missile before its induction, more tests would now be required to prove its robustness due to the failure of the first test flight, Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO) sources said.

     Agni-3 is the country’s first solid fuel missile that is compact and small enough for easy mobility and can be easily packaged for deployment on a variety of surface and sub-surface platform

206. # Yash on 08 Jan 2009 at 9:48 am

     ANOTHER UPDATE:-
     NEW DELHI -(Dow Jones)- The Indian government Monday said it has signed a $2.1 billion deal with Boeing Co. (BA) for the supply of eight P-8I maritime patrol aircraft in its latest move to modernize its mainly Soviet-vintage armed forces.

     The agreement for the P-8I, which is the proposed Indian variant of the U.S. Navy’s long-range maritime P-8A aircraft, will boost the South Asian nation’s ability to monitor its 7,600 kilometer coastline. The plane can also conduct both surface and antisubmarine warfare.

     “Though we have signed a deal, final clearance is still required from a U.S. authority,” Indian Navy spokesman Commander Nirad Sinha told Dow Jones Newswires.

     “The first plane delivery is four years from the final contract signing, so I think it should come in 2013.”

     Boeing India unit spokeswoman Swati Rangachari said the company is expected to issue a statement on the P-8I deal sometime Tuesday.

     India’s move to modernize its defense forces over the next decade has spurred competition amongst global aerospace and military contractors as they eye equipment and systems contracts worth billions of dollars, including a $12 billion deal for 126 fighter jets.

     India is already among the world’s top arms importers and is likely to issue contracts worth up to $60 billion by 2015 for items ranging from artillery to fighter jets and mid-air refueling tankers to submarines and warships.

     India has a policy which makes it compulsory for foreign companies that clinch military orders to reinvest a proportion of the winning contractual value in India.

     This reinvestment, also known as offsets, is part of India’s plan to build its defense and aerospace industries - both public and private - including via transfer of technology.

     Boeing, which had planned to sell its Apache AH-64D Longbow attack helicopter to the Indian Air Force said in October that it won’t bid for a contract to supply 22 helicopters due to time constraints.

     Separately, Boeing’s commercial aircraft division sells passenger aircraft to Indian carriers. the company has received 164 orders from local airlines valued at more than $25 billion since India’s budget airline travel boom began in 2004.

     In July, Boeing said it estimated that India will need 1,001 new aircraft worth $105 billion by 2027 as robust economic growth boosts local and international air travel.

207. # Yash on 08 Jan 2009 at 9:51 am

     India begins construction of aircraft carrier
     (Agencies)
     Updated: 2005-04-12 15:44/CHINADAILY

     India began an eight-year project to build an aircraft carrier in its most ambitious military programme to date, officials said.

     Defence Minister Pranab Mukherjee launched the construction of the 37,500-tonne carrier at the state-run Cochin Shipyard in the southern state of Kerala, a naval spokesman said on Monday.

     The carrier will carry 30 British- and Russian-made jet fighters as well as locally-designed light combat aircraft which took India more than 22 years to develop.

     Federal Shipping Minister T.R. Balu said the ship-building yard would complete the project and hand over the carrier to the 137-ship Indian navy by 2012.

     “The project is strategically important for our defence and so we will complete it within the target period,” Balu said.

     The 252 metre-long (831 feet) carrier, which will be powered by four gas turbines and have a range of 7,500 nautical miles, will have a top speed of 28 knots and will carry 160 officers and 1,400 sailors.

     It will have two 200 metre-long runways and a landing deck for helicopters.

     The carrier was designed by the Indian navy but Italian firm Fincantieri will help Cochin Shipyard integrate the main propulsion system and perform other specialised tasks.

     The Indian Navy had two aircraft carriers but only the INS Viraat is in operation as the INS Vikrant was decommissioned in January 1997.

     Last year India signed a 1.5 billion dollar deal with Russia for a 40,000 tonne aircraft carrier, Admiral Gorshkov, which is slated to join the Indian navy in 2008 after a refit.

     Besides the aircraft carrier, India is building 19 other ships, including frigates and corvettes. Last month it unveiled plans to buy patrol boats.

208. # Yash on 08 Jan 2009 at 9:54 am

     INDIANS MAY BE MAKING WORLD’S MOST POWERFUL WEAPON
     Greg Harrowman
     May 9,2008

     New Delhi:-The author, a strategic analyst at the Institute for Defence Studies and Analyses in India, introduces the science and threat of Electromagnetic Pulse weapons. He argues that because EMP weapons do not cause any damage to population or visible property of a nation they could become \”best force multipliers of the future.\”…………………….

209. # Yash on 08 Jan 2009 at 9:59 am

     Indian space ambitions soar with lunar launch
     10:57 22 October 2008 by New Scientist and Reuters
     For similar stories, visit the Spaceflight Topic Guide
     Video: Watch footage from the launch of the Chandrayaan spacecraft

     India launched its first unmanned moon mission on Wednesday following in the footsteps of rival China, as the emerging Asian power celebrated its space ambitions and scientific prowess.

     The cuboid Chandrayaan-1 moon vehicle blasted off from a southern Indian space centre shortly after dawn in a boost for the country’s ambitions to gain more global space business.

     “What we have started is a remarkable journey,” Madhavan Nair, chairman of the Indian Space Research Organisation told reporters.

     The operation is ostensibly about mapping the moon in unprecedented detail, laying the groundwork for a manned mission in 2014 or 2015.

     Space race
     But the mission is also a part of the growing space race between Asian nations, coming soon after China’s much-celebrated first space walk last month.

     India intends to keep up the pace in a friendly contest with serious technological and military implications. China’s destruction of a satellite using a missile last year raised fears among other nations that China has military ambitions in space.

     Chandrayaan will spend two years orbiting the moon using onboard spectrometers to look for evidence of water and precious metals.

     A gadget called the Moon Impactor Probe will also detach from the orbiter and land on the lunar surface. An onboard mass spectrometer will analyse dust it kicks up. A principal objective is to look for helium-3, an isotope thought to be valuable for use in nuclear fusion. Although rare on Earth, it is believed to be more common on the moon.

     National pride
     India’s project cost $79 million, considerably less than the Chinese and Japanese probes in 2007, or the European SMART-1 that cost $140 million in 2006.

     India says its mission will pave the way for it to claim a bigger chunk of the global space business. It has already launched satellites for countries around the globe and is developing a new launcher for heavier payloads.

     India’s national TV channels broadcasted the countdown to the launch live. Scientists were seen thumping their chests, hugging each other and applauding as the rocket shot up into space. Like China’s recent space walk, the successful launch was greeted with patriotic excitement in the media.

     “Destination Moon … Historic Day For India” blazed one TV channel on its screen. In a nation where millions of people live in poverty, the cost of the mission has scarcely been questioned.

     “I’m very proud,” says Sunil Tambe, a taxi driver in Mumbai. “It means India can do these big projects and I think it will also benefit us because there will be more information and we can learn new things.”

210. # Yash on 08 Jan 2009 at 10:03 am

     BAE Systems and Mahindra Defence to discuss co-development of Indian Mine Protected Vehicle news

     12 February 2008

     New Delhi: BAE Systems and Mahindra Defence are in talks to jointly develop an Indian mine protected vehicle based on BAE Systems’ highly successful RG-31 mine protected vehicle.

     BAE Systems has already supplied 165 mine protected vehicles known as Casspir to the Indian Army since 1999.

     The all-steel, welded armor, monocoque hull of the RG-31 protects occupants from anti-tank mine detonations and is proven to have saved the lives of countless crews from mines and roadside bomb attacks. With a modular interior layout the vehicle can be configured as an APC, command vehicle, ambulance, surveillance vehicle and for many other uses. In standard APC configuration, this air-conditioned vehicle carries a crew of 8-10.

     At this year’s 5th Defence and Naval Exhibition (DEFEXPO), a BAE Systems RG-31 will be on display on the Mahindra Defence stand.

     Nearly 600 RG-31s are in service with the United States, Canada, and other forces, including the United Nations. Under the U.S. Department of Defense’s Mine Resistant Ambush Protected (MRAP) programme, 624 RG-31s have been ordered.

     ”Mahindra is an enormously capable world class company with the skills to become a strong partner for BAE Systems on the development of a mine protected vehicle for India,” said Mike Mendoza, BAE Systems’ managing director India.

     BAE Systems is the premier global defence and aerospace company delivering a full range of products and services for air, land and naval forces, as well as advanced electronics, information technology solutions and customer support services.

     Mahindra Defence Systems is a division of the Mahindra Group. The company today is a leading provider of high mobility and light bullet proof vehicles to the Indian armed forces, paramilitary and police forces. There are over 500 Rakshaks and up-armoured Scorpios in service in the Indian Army and security/police forces in India and abroad.

     ”Mahindra Defence Systems is in the business of providing vehicle protection to defence forces,” said Brigadier Khutub Hai, Chief Executive of Mahindra Defence Systems. ”Our cooperation with BAE Systems, who are leaders in this field, for joint production of mine protected vehicles is a strategic fit for our vehicle armouring business.”

211. # Yash on 08 Jan 2009 at 10:14 am

     INDIAN MILITARY WILL CROSS $100 BILLION MARK BY 2015,……………….AND STORIES ARE MORE ,,,,,,,HEAR THIS,
     A COMMAND ROOM IN BANGALORE OPERATES ON ALL NORTH AMERICAN AND WESTERN EUROPEAN STOCK MARKETS ….GO TO BBC FOR FURTHER DETAILS.

     …………THEIR ARE MILLIONS OF SUCH STORIIES WITH TATA BUYING WORLD’S 5TH LARGEST STEEL MANUFACTURER AND LANDROVER AND JAGUAR BRANDS.
     …….ESSAR AN INDIAN STEEL COMPANY HAS LARGEST STEEL PLANT IN USA.
     ………OUR OIL REFINERY IN JAMNAGAR IS WORLD’S LATGEST AND WE DEAL WITH 95% OF WORLD’S DIAMONDS AND EVERY YEAR INDIANS BUY 55% OF WORLD’S ANNUAL GOLD PRODUCTION.
     ……..OUR FOREX RESERVES ARE 4TH HIGHEST ,OUR STOCK EXCHANGE HAS MAXIMUM NO. OF COMPANIES LISTED ON IT IN THE WORLD,
     …THERE ARE FOUR INDIANS IN WORLD’S TOP TEN RICHEST PEOPLE LIST……….AND THERE ARE 40 BILLIONAIRES IN OUR NATION MORE THAN CHINA AND JAPAN COMBINED AND THIRD HIGHEST IN THE WORLD.
     ..OUR TATA TEA IS WORLD’S LARGEST TEA COMPANY,TATA STEEL WORLD’S FIFTH LARGEST, NRI’S ARCELOR MITTAL IS WORLD’S LARGEST,TCS IS WORLD’S 4TH AND ASIA’S LARGEST IT COMPANY.
     …………..DELHI METRO IS WORLD’S LARGEST METRO SYSTEM UNDER CONSTRUCTION.
     …………ETC. ETC.
     …………….NOW TELL WHERE YOUR RUBBISH NATION STANDS?

212. # Waffen on 08 Jan 2009 at 1:55 pm

     As Indians we must learn from what went wrong in Mumbai.We need to clean up our house. We need to weed out the anti-national elements without whose help the masterminds in Pakistan would not have been successful in carrying out Mumbai attacks.Pakistan has already started the war with their help.We cant deny these facts.We have to stand together to reply back. It is not the military destruction we must seek.We must seek a total victory in terms of economic destruction, to the extent the Govt in Pakistan is forced to take care of day to day issues for its people instead of crying for war.We need to tell the world and ensure that Pakistan is declared a terrorist state in the UN.We also need to ensure that Pakistan does not fall into Taliban hands with the help of US and China. Once done, the entire world will live in peace and people of Pakistan follow what ever religion they want without getting on others back.
     Secondly, for the past 60-61 yrs, Pakistan has been braying for Kashmir. Look at the area in their control.Their govts have never been able to stand up to the grievance of the people in Kashmir. Latest example is the earthquake in Kashmir. People were out in the cold for months without proper sanitation and proper food.They had no job to make a livelihood.I dont understand why they want a miserable life for people in the Indian side of Kashmir.The latest round of election very clearly spells the terms of the people here in Indian Kashmir. I even know of the Kashmiris coming from Pakistan Occupied Kashmir.They simply dont want to go back.Why? they feel free here.they see schools, medical facilities, empowerment of women, consumder goods , job availability etc.

213. # Elecser on 08 Jan 2009 at 2:16 pm

     Great to read all what your nation have. I dont know if all this wealth belongs to 100% of your population or only 1% of dominant rich indians.

214. # pooja on 08 Jan 2009 at 3:44 pm

     I think,every pakistani can make bombs (this is the only thing which they can do).but tell me how many pakistanis can write,can read,have any knowledge of IT,software (everone knows very few).How much freedom they have given to their womans.Maximum pakistani womans are illeterate,have no freedom.so how they can, even compare pakistan with india.they just know,how to make a child terrorist.poor fellow.
     its really an insult for us INDIAN to compare ourself with poor,backward,underdeveloped pakistan

     i m a HINDU.but my maximum friends are muslim.my ideal is DR A. P. J. Abdul Kalam. i really respect ISLAM.we are a family and feel proud for that.
     we have no interest in giving any explaination to pakistanis for that.

     pakistan is very small in size and maximum population is of same religion,then why they are fighting with one another.why war is going on between two groups in pakistan. so pakistanis first look at yourself.very small country then also not having unity.

     INDIA is biggest democracy in world.i dont think,even one pakistani knows the meaning of DEMOCRACY.

     every pakistani knows,if war happens between india and pakistan.although india will suffer some loss BUT PAKISTAN WILL BE FULLY DESTROYED.And those who dont know this fact,will come to know when war starts.

215. # Rashmanus on 08 Jan 2009 at 7:27 pm

     Pooja, you are an one ignorant individual – well, what can we expect from Indians. INDIANS ARE DYING WITH HUNGER, do you know that? You see Indians in every IT firm or company, it is not because you are smarter than us, it is because you are GOD DAMN MORE THAN US. I mean more than I BILLION Indians …
     Stop watching bollywood movies and you will find how much poverty, illiteracy and backwardness consists in INDIA. So, open your eyes and smell the Roses. One thing is for sure if there is a war, everyone knows what will happen to Pakistan, but one thing is for sure that there will be no more INDIA on map of this earth.

216. # Nitin on 08 Jan 2009 at 8:44 pm

     Pooja
     I realy appreciate your comment but, the stuff you said! was been explained to them long back ago in this post!
     But it seems that the love to be in their own dreams!and keep doing bla bla that our country is this, our country is that bla bla bla fairys, and castels and unicorns! and so on…….!

217. # Nitin on 08 Jan 2009 at 9:23 pm

     ” Rashmanus”
     Dude Indias job amrket is not affecte like americas!
     the unemployment is increasing in america and it is decreasing in India!
     I stay in India, in city called pune, and over here at an average 90 compnaies are opening every year!
     we are having your jobs! yeheee!
     And there is no way India can be vanised from earths map! may be in your dream!
     Right now we dont but even if we uld have our rivalry with USA than to India would win, You know why!
     il explain …If india wages a war on USA than russia who is our strong ally would join us withou any invitaion!
     so world power no2 & no3 together , if they attack USA then Usa wount be on earth!
     But dont worry ! that wont happen as long as USA behaves good with India!

218. # Nitin on 08 Jan 2009 at 9:26 pm

     The total population of USA is equal to Indian having a bachelors degree! so please dont try to make this a USA vs India bloog! the blog is called”india-pakistan-military-strength” so concentrate on that!

219. # schubert on 08 Jan 2009 at 10:21 pm

     Dear Rashmanus
     I don’t think u have a clue about what you’re talkin abt. RAW involved in terrorist activities, and blab la.
     One thing for sure you are a true American, who had voted the pudding head George W. Bush as your representative.
     Grow up…acquaint yourself to realties of today.

220. # Nitin on 08 Jan 2009 at 10:44 pm

     NO schubert
     he is a pakistani setteled in USA, who give funds to their relegios organizations and these organisations fund terrorist camps against india!

221. # Nitin on 08 Jan 2009 at 11:03 pm

     http://www.ndtv.com/convergence/ndtv/MumbaiDossier/Section-30-46-4th.htm

222. # Nitin on 08 Jan 2009 at 11:06 pm

     “When RAW did Marriot in Pakistan, Pakistan did’t blame RAW ”
     Yess pakistan dint blame raw beacuse:-
     1)No such eveidence was found reguarding raw and only a person having very wired imagination power can think of that!
     2) it simply just dint do it!
     We blame paksitan for mumbai 27th nov08 becasue there is like plenty of proof and evidance that only pakistan has done it!And today for the 1st time i uld like to share the evidence and proof of mumbai 27th and show the truth of pakistan to the wole world.Have a look above these are the coppies of the dossier sent by gov of india

223. # Nitin on 08 Jan 2009 at 11:06 pm

     Rashmanus
     Yess pakistan dint blame raw beacuse:-
     1)No such eveidence was found reguarding raw and only a person having very wired imagination power can think of that!
     2) it simply just dint do it!
     We blame paksitan for mumbai 27th nov08 becasue there is like plenty of proof and evidance that only pakistan has done it!And today for the 1st time i uld like to share the evidence and proof of mumbai 27th and show the truth of pakistan to the wole world.Have a look above these are the coppies of the dossier sent by gov of india

224. # Nitin on 09 Jan 2009 at 12:38 am

     Rashmanus
     Now even the pakistani gov has acpeted that “ajmal kasab is a pakistani nation”
     aboubt me I am not a hindu extermist cos i dont believe in god!I dont believe in any relegion nor hindusim nor islam or christanity!Religion doest not exist, religion/god is just a “feeling & thinking nothing else!

225. # VK on 09 Jan 2009 at 2:54 am

     Hey Rash….you better stay off from this blog cuz you have no idea what you are talking about. Get your facts clear, bring the evidence that shows RAW was behind the Marriott blast and then let’s have a conversation. What you are talking reminds me of a recent incident…….It is so funny that recently (post 11/26) during a bomb blast at lahore, pakistani media and officials started blaming an Indian spy agent involvement in the blast and later in a day or two a pakistani cum talibani terrorist outfit came out and took the responsibility for the blast. Pakistan govt. and ISI think they are too smart and fool the world, including their people.

     The whole world knows that Pakistan is an irresponsible nation that no one can trust upon. Your’s is the most tainted country on this planet. In 61 years you guys have achieved nothing except for sponsoring terrorism. Your cricket board is the most corrupt and rotten, your players are always under the scanner for drug abuse. No team wants to play in your country.

     And why are you advocating for US so much? I wonder how you people get the visa to travel across the world, you are a failed state and everyone knows what you are capable of.

     Don’t even compare your failed state to India. We have the most peace loving muslims in our country. They follow and preach true islam. Our Bollywood has had some of the best muslim stars from Dilip Kumar, Mohd. Rafi, Talat Mehmood, Aamir Khan, Sharukh Khan etc. Our Cricket team has always had some of the finest muslim players starting from Mohd. Azharuddin, Irfan Pathan, Zaheer Khan etc. No matter how much you criticize India, Indians, Bollywood, your stage artists still come and perform in India as they know that we are an open country and we respect the talent.

226. # pooja on 09 Jan 2009 at 6:56 am

     Rashmanus

     history says, 3 times INDIA has defeated pakistan(1965,1971 and kargil war).if u dont know that then i think YOU ARE an ignorant individual.so first go and read history.india is well ahead of pakistan in every domain(Military udgets and Economic Impact,Manpower and Ground Forces,Comparison of Air Forces ,Naval and Sea Based Forces,
     The Nuclear Club,Ballistic and Cruise Missile Proliferation,technology,science,aerospace etc etc).pakistan knows that they cant win if they fight face to face with india.therefore they have choosen the way of terrorism.they are not having daring to fight face to face.

227. # G.VINOD on 09 Jan 2009 at 7:25 am

     First let the Pakistani government take control over their western borders,
     which are now controlled by the Talibans. Let them save their people
     from the U.S airstrikes, which had already killed thousands of Pakistanis.
     After doing all this let them think of teaching others.

228. # Nav Arya Kishlay on 09 Jan 2009 at 8:25 am

     Dear Rashmanus

     I don’t know what is your background and to which country you belong and moreover I am not interested in knowing that,, However I would like to draw your attention towards certain realities..

     As you stated that India is a poor country in response to that I would say first If you have an access to internet and facts and figures then please rectify your knowledge,, India is amongst the top ten growing Economy in the ratings,, sadly Pakistan is amongst the top ten worst countries on this world map.

     I use the word “Sadly” as Being born and brought in India I have never been taught to develop a feeling of Hatred for any one. We have always advocated peace and togetherness which you guys can never understand or perhaps choose not to understand.

     Secondly its not about religion, cast,creed or gender its about the thought process inside the human brain. An intellect never comes to anyone by birth it is developed over the period of time.

     If you think by raising your voice and through aggression you will be able to prove your point then you are living in an illusion. If that would have been the case just imagine what will happen to the world when 100 crores of Indians will roar together..

     Any economy or civilization develops only when they concentrate on their present and focus towards the future…We cannot progress by running backwards.. As change is the only constant in this world and it is fruitful only when it is positive and creative.. Destruction will never lead you to anywhere…

     Any ways my idea is not to preach you its my perspective which I developed by challenging my own capabilities and competing with my own self which is the toughest thing to do ,, If I start getting jealous of people who are better than me then I will never think of my own development. The more I bring in negativity in my life the more negative I will become.

     At least I am proud to say that my country has given so much for the development of mankind as a whole, starting from vedas, concept of zero, yoga, technology, Creativity, peace, sports and culture. As a Nation we think positive and believe in passing on the same to everyone around the world and if that makes some of them jealous then the problem is theirs not mine.

229. # VK on 09 Jan 2009 at 8:31 am

     Ironically in the past couple of days I haven’t read many pakistani comments. Seems as if the pakistani bloggers cannot defend their terror supporting country anymore after their govt. accepted kasab’s identity. After all their is a limit to how much one can defend his/her lies. Pakistan is in a complete turmoil, the govt. has lost control of it’s northern territory to taliban, their economy is in a complete mess, president and prime minister don’t see each other eye to eye, US has confirmed that Pakistan in the biggest problem for the Obama govt. to fix…….Dear neighbors, you better fix your house first and dare you say anything about India.

230. # G.VINOD on 09 Jan 2009 at 8:34 am

     The Pakistanis have started barking like street dogs. Poor fellows we
     can only pity them. We can understand their frustrations as they
     could not win a battle against the small Taliban groups and since
     they are losing their territories every day to the Talibans, their brains
     have stopped working out of fear. So the only way to save themselves
     is to pretend as if they are bold since their brains are off. Just pity
     them.

231. # VK on 09 Jan 2009 at 9:02 am

     Dear Monis………look who is talking about courage. You think your country has courage to do a one on one conflict with India? Sending the infiltrators through the LOC and sea and killing the innocent civilians is that what you call courage in pakistan? You people are cowards. You talk about courage, then why did you leave the body of your dead and injured soldiers on the indian side of LOC during the kargil war? You guys lost the kargil war badly. It was a slap on your face and not ours, we regained our territory with complete pride. In the 1971 war, you lost east-pakistan. The war ended in the surrender of the pakistani military. Slap, Slap, Slap……

232. # G.VINOD on 09 Jan 2009 at 9:12 am

     90,000 Pakistani soldiers surrendered to the Indian army after
     the 1971 Indo-Pak war, which is a world record.

233. # pooja on 09 Jan 2009 at 9:33 am

     Monis

     really u r very much frustrated by ur defeat.defeat hurts a lot.hota hai,sach sabko bura lagta hai.pata nahi aur kitni baar haaroge.i think next step of your frustration is CRYING.so plz dont cry.if possible try to improve your country,so that u may give some(very less) competition to india.YOU underdeveloped country.u pakistani even cant life without bollywood films.u can speak just in this site but INDIA speaks in WAR .
     first of all tell me meaning of COURAGE u loser.

234. # Aby on 09 Jan 2009 at 1:42 pm

     Once again, I would like to request the comment authors to avoid attacking a person for their arguments. If you disagree with someone’s opinion, attack the argument, not the person.

      

     I will appoint someone to have a neutral review of all the comments above and delete those where the comment author resorted to personal attacks. After that, any further comments with such inflammatory attacks will be moderated. If you wish to debate do it the right way without using fallacies.

      
     Regards,
      
     Aby

235. # Lenny on 09 Jan 2009 at 2:05 pm

     Please I suggest Pakistan that not to interfere in other countries affair instead they should try to maintain peace with negibhour and beside spending much on arms and military they should make facilities in their own country like education, technology and what ever infrastructure things that is the best way they can do peace. Please I urge that getting involved in these kinds of activities they are getting themselves targetted through and maintaing strains Internationally.

236. # Well-Wisher on 10 Jan 2009 at 3:49 am

     @ all Muslims

     Islamic Research Foundation (IRF), Mumbai has recently found from their research theories that your prophet Mohd (pbuh) is our Kalki Avatar the tenth incarnation of Lord Krishna described in Hinduism. All the attributes descibed about the Kalki in Kalki Purana (birth, inhabitation, boyhood, adult age, as a rule maker, etc) are exactly matching to Prophet Mohd (pbuh) complete life. We Hindus won’t get angry on this research thesis. If your IRF continues their research on this, they should do research on who is Allah. The Almighty God which your Mohd (pbuh) describing is nothing but our Supreme God Parmeshwar.

     In Hinduism Lord Krishna, in all his previous 9 incarnations, he prayed to Supreme God Shiva as his only and final God to reach Moksha (Paradise). If Mohd (pbuh) is tenth incarnation, his only mighty God Allah should be our Supreme God Parameshwar. He is everything and the whole Universe had been created from him, he is omniscience, omnipotent, and omnipresent. The same applies to the Almighty God Allah as well. So both are representing same God.

     In this case, Hindus & Muslims are coming closer to each other as brothers. Both of their beliefs are united now. Finally, we are all reaching to the same place by different path. Why should we fight by making difference using our pathetic illusioned human mind?

     Common Pakistanis our brothers, give up terrorism, we will rejoin back and grow-up together, and will make a bigger & mighty unified India.

     God Bless all the Muslims & Hindus and let them unite back.

237. # Punjabi Soldier on 10 Jan 2009 at 6:38 am

     Namaste/Sat Sri Akal to everyone.I am new in this wonderful site and i went thru every post here.First of of i would like to ask all the Pakistani people on this thread who were blaming so called Hindu Zionists/Mossad in mumbai killing since pakistan admitted that the killers were from pakistan do you have anything to say???
     I am sorry to say but Quran clearely says kill all non believers:-
     Torment to Non-believers:
     SURA 4.56: (As for) those who disbelieve in Our communications, We shall make them enter fire;
     so oft as their skins are thoroughly burned, We will change them for other skins, that they may taste the chastisement; surely Allah is Mighty, Wise.
     Allah causes you to disbelieve and then he punishes you for that
     2.7 Allah has set a seal upon their hearts and upon their hearing and there is a covering over their eyes, and there is a great punishment for them.
     No friends with parents / siblings if not believers
     9.23: O you who believe! do not take your fathers and your brothers for guardians if they love unbelief more than belief; and whoever of you takes them for a guardian, these it is that are the unjust.
     Friends with Jews, Christians…
     5.51: O you who believe! do not take the Jews and the Christians for friends; they are friends of each other; and whoever amongst you takes them for a friend, then surely he is one of them; surely Allah does not guide the unjust people.
     Gruesome Amputations
     Said he (Pharaoh): You believe in him before I give you permission; most surely he is the chief of you who taught you the magic, so you shall know: certainly I will cut off your hands and your feet on opposite sides, and certainly I will crucify you all. (External link: Dhimmi Watch)
     Fight non-believers
     9.123: O you who believe! fight those of the unbelievers who are near to you and let them find in you hardness; and know that Allah is with those who guard (against evil).
     Kill non-believers
     4.89 : They desire that you should disbelieve as they have disbelieved, so that you might be (all) alike; therefore take not from among them friends until they fly (their homes) in Allah’s way; but if they turn back, then seize them and kill them wherever you find them, and take not from among them a friend or a helper.
     Killing Idolaters
     9.5: So when the sacred months have passed away, then slay the idolaters wherever you find them, and take them captives and besiege them and lie in wait for them in every ambush, then if they repent and keep up prayer and pay the poor-rate, leave their way free to them; surely Allah is Forgiving, Merciful.
     Islam Acceptable:
     3.85: And whoever desires a religion other than Islam, it shall not be accepted from him, and in the hereafter he shall be one of the losers.
     No friends from outsiders
     3.118: O you who believe! do not take for intimate friends from among others than your own people; they do not fall short of inflicting loss upon you; they love what distresses you; vehement hatred has already appeared from out of their mouths, and what their breasts conceal is greater still; indeed, We have made the communications clear to you, if you will understand.
     No friends with non believers
     3.28: Let not the believers take the unbelievers for friends rather than believers; and whoever does this, he shall have nothing of (the guardianship of) Allah, but you should guard yourselves against them, guarding carefully; and Allah makes you cautious of (retribution from) Himself; and to Allah is the eventual coming.
     Believers make superior friends
     4.144: O you who believe! do not take the unbelievers for friends rather than the believers; do you desire that you should give to Allah a manifest proof against yourselves?
     God a plotter
     8.30: And when those who disbelieved devised plans against you that they might confine you or slay you or drive you away; and they devised plans and Allah too had arranged a plan; and Allah is the best of planners.
     Anti Jewish verses
     5.82: Certainly you will find the most violent of people in enmity for those who believe (to be) the Jews and those who are polytheists, and you will certainly find the nearest in friendship to those who believe (to be) those who say: We are Christians; this is because there are priests and monks among them and because they do not behave proudly.
     Idolaters are unclean just because they are idolater
     9.28: O you who believe! the idolaters are nothing but unclean, so they shall not approach the Sacred Mosque after this year; and if you fear poverty then Allah will enrich you out of His grace if He please; surely Allah is Knowing Wise.
     Forcing non-believers to pay tax
     9.29: Fight those who do not believe in Allah, nor in the latter day, nor do they prohibit what Allah and His Apostle have prohibited, nor follow the religion of truth, out of those who have been given the Book, until they pay the tax in acknowledgment of superiority and they are in a state of subjection.
     The Torment of Hell for infidels (Jews, atheists, and unbelieving infidels)
     43: Surely the tree of the Zaqqum,
     [Sinners, eat Zaqqum to intensify the torment of the Khati'un
     (Koran Sura 69:36-37); it tastes like Like molten brass...]
     44: Is the food of the sinful
     45: Like dregs of oil; it shall boil in (their) bellies,
     46: Like the boiling of hot water.
     47: Seize him, then drag him down into the middle of the hell;
     48: Then pour above his head of the torment of the boiling water:
     49: Taste; you forsooth are the mighty, the honorable:
     50: Surely this is what you disputed about.
     51: Surely those who guard (against evil) are in a secure place,
     52: In gardens and springs;
     53: They shall wear of fine and thick silk, (sitting) face to face;
     54: Thus (shall it be), and We will wed them with Houris pure, beautiful ones.
     55: They shall call therein for every fruit in security;
     56: They shall not taste therein death except the first death,
     and He will save them from the punishment of the hell,
     57: A grace from your Lord; this is the great achievement.
     58: So have We made it easy in your tongue that they may be mindful.
     2.62, 5.69 : All except Muslims / Jews/Christians / Sabeans will go to hell
     Surely those who believe, and those who are Jews, and the Christians, and the Sabians, whoever believes in Allah and the Last day and does good, they shall have their reward from their Lord, and there is no fear for them, nor shall they grieve.
     Smite the neck and cut fingertips of unbelievers
     8.12: When your Lord revealed to the angels: I am with you, therefore make firm those who believe. I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them.
     Smite the neck of unbelievers
     47.4: So when you meet in battle those who disbelieve, then smite the necks until when you have overcome them, then make (them) prisoners, and afterwards either set them free as a favor or let them ransom (themselves) until the war terminates. That (shall be so); and if Allah had pleased He would certainly have exacted what is due from them, but that He may try some of you by means of others; and (as for) those who are slain in the way of Allah, He will by no means allow their deeds to perish.
     Severe Punishment for atheists
     10.4: To Him is your return, of all (of you); the promise of Allah (made) in truth; surely He begins the creation in the first instance, then He reproduces it, that He may with justice recompense those who believe and do good; and (as for) those who disbelieve, they shall have a drink of hot water and painful punishment because they disbelieved.
     5.10: And (as for) those who disbelieve and reject our communications, these are the companions of the name.
     5.86: And (as for) those who disbelieve and reject Our communications, these are the companions of the flame.
     Severe Punishment for non-believers
     22.19: These are two adversaries who dispute about their Lord; then (as to) those who disbelieve, for them are cut out garments of fire, boiling water shall be poured over their heads.

     22.20: With it shall be melted what is in their bellies and (their) skins as well.

     22.21: And for them are whips of iron.

     22.22: Whenever they will desire to go forth from it, from grief, they shall be turned back into it, and taste the chastisement of burning.
     Severe Punishment for non-believers
     72.23 : (It is) only a delivering (of communications) from Allah and His messages; and whoever disobeys Allah and His Apostle surely he shall have the fire of hell to abide therein for a long time.
     98.6 : Surely those who disbelieve from among the followers of the Book and the polytheists shall be in the fire of hell, abiding therein; they are the worst of men.
     Punishing non-believers of Hereafter
     17.10 : And that (as for) those who do not believe in the hereafter, We have prepared for them a painful chastisement.
     Punishing for rejecting faith
     3.91 : Surely, those who disbelieve and die while they are unbelievers, the earth full of gold shall not be accepted from one of them, though he should offer to ransom himself with it, these it is who shall have a painful chastisement, and they shall have no helpers.
     Unbelievers go to hell
     4.140 : And indeed He has revealed to you in the Book that when you hear Allah’s communications disbelieved in and mocked at do not sit with them until they enter into some other discourse; surely then you would be like them; surely Allah will gather together the hypocrites and the unbelievers all in hell.
     7.36 : And (as for) those who reject Our communications and turn away from them haughtily — these are the inmates of the fire they shall abide in it.
     Partial Believers go to hell too
     4.150 : Surely those who disbelieve in Allah and His apostles and (those who) desire to make a distinction between Allah and His apostles and say: We believe in some and disbelieve in others, and desire to take a course between (this and) that.

     4.151 : These it is that are truly unbelievers, and We have prepared for the unbelievers a disgraceful chastisement.

     4.152 : And those who believe in Allah and His apostles and do not make a distinction between any of them — Allah will grant them their rewards; and Allah is Forgiving, Merciful.
     Sadistic punishments
     56.41 : And those of the left hand, how wretched are those of the left hand!

     56.42 : In hot wind and boiling water,

     56.43 : And the shade of black smoke,

     56.44 : Neither cool nor honorable.
     Punishment for apostates
     16.106 : He who disbelieves in Allah after his having believed, not he who is compelled while his heart is at rest on account of faith, but he who opens (his) breast to disbelief — on these is the wrath of Allah, and they shall have a grievous chastisement.

     3.86 : How shall Allah guide a people who disbelieved after their believing and (after) they had borne witness that the Apostle was true and clear arguments had come to them; and Allah does not guide the unjust people.

     3.87 : (As for) these, their reward is that upon them is the curse of Allah and the angels and of men, all together.

     3.88 : Abiding in it; their chastisement shall not be lightened nor shall they be respited.

     3.89 : Except those who repent after that and amend, then surely Allah is Forgiving, Merciful.

     3.90 : Surely, those who disbelieve after their believing, then increase in unbelief, their repentance shall not be accepted, and these are they that go astray.

238. # Punjabi Soldier on 10 Jan 2009 at 6:39 am

     As you can see Islam and Quran is full of hate and the only way of world peace is denouncing it.

239. # Well-Wisher on 10 Jan 2009 at 4:40 pm

     If any religious book telling about killing its non-believers, it is an great insult to their God. Converting people to their religion by hook & crook methods also another big insult to their God. Disrespecting other religion is equally disrespecting their own. God never asked anyone to be an extremist and kill others, it is the cause of illusioned human mind and putting the final blame on God by telling that he wishes the killing of non-believers. This is an absolute insultation to God.

240. # Nitin on 10 Jan 2009 at 9:11 pm

     Punjabi Soldier
     It is simply shocking for me!all this time wht i hurd was that its a religion of peace!
     but any ways if this is reality ! than im just speachless….

241. # Punjabi Soldier on 11 Jan 2009 at 3:07 am

     My dear brother this is just the tip of Ice Berg quran is full of hate…Thats y whre ever muslims go they try to create chaos till everyone converts cause they r just following quran.

242. # Well-Wisher on 11 Jan 2009 at 4:49 am

     Christianity is a big rival for Islam. Both are trying to convert people from every nook & corners of the world. Once these two religions acheive the conversions near to 100% of world population (each take 50%) and rest of the other religions will go literally to extinction stage. But it will take another few more centuries. Once other religions are more or less destroyed, and these two religions share the world population equally, they will stuck with stumbling block on each other for further conversion, then there will be going to arise a big conflict between these two religious followers throughout the world. This conflict later turn into a world war in the future history and going to fight using nukes & other deadly weapons to end the world. During the fight there won’t be any pacific attempts will be made between countries to stop the war, because death will be considered as holiness and sacrifaction to God on both the religion.

243. # Deepak on 11 Jan 2009 at 9:59 am

     Kashmir

     Since 1948
     Pakistan is encouraging Ex army persons and other paki citizen to get settle in POK. They dream that if any day public poll is taken by UN. this POK must go to PAK
     where as in India by law no Indian from any state can buy land in kashmir (we want to keep same kashmir as it is)

     Rather then thinking for Kashmiris think of your own people
     feed them nicely (because it makes no sense in keeping country people hungry and buying Weapon for Terrorism to free kashmir)

     Kashmir is a God,s country and one day it will become again paradise.

244. # Well-Wisher on 11 Jan 2009 at 10:27 am

     Indian Govt should change the law in Kashmir so that people from other part of India can buy property in Kashmir, and resettle back all the Kashmiri Pandits there. Only that way Kashmir can be transformed into Paradise. Indian military should chase the PAK occupiers & their military back to their borders from northern part of Kashmir and we should get back the complete Kashmir and turn them into Paradise.

245. # G.Vinod on 11 Jan 2009 at 11:43 am

     It’s high time that Indian government abolishes article 370,
     which gives special status for Kashmir, be abolished. It keeps
     off Kashmir away from rest of India.

246. # G.Vinod on 11 Jan 2009 at 11:45 am

     It’s high time that Indian government abolishes article 370,
     which gives special status for Kashmir, as it keeps off Kashmir
     away from rest of India.

247. # Animesh on 11 Jan 2009 at 2:02 pm

     Dear Punjabi Soldier,
     I completely understand your feelings and I am with you when it comes to our feeling towards Pakistan. I think the way the Pakistani leadership has disappointed their people has very few parallels across the world. What Pakistan has been doing for last 50 years is a cruel joke, because they cannot be serious about hating somebody so much that economic policies, friendly countries, every choice that they make has an India element in it.

     However I am not with you when you quote kuran and muslim teachings in a bad light.

     Remember this forum is India Vs Pakistan not Hindu Vs Muslim or Sikh vs Muslim.

     Pakistan proclaims itself to be the crusader for muslims and muslim rights all over the world. It has a special affinity for Muslims of India.

     Now Please think about it if an Indian muslim reads your blog what will he think, how will he react and for once you will justify all that what Pakistan has been trying to do.

     A muslim who says no to the bodies of terrorists who created havoc in Mumbai to be buried in India, The maulana’s (of India) who passed an anti terrorism resolution in one of the biggest summits of muslim religious leaders world has ever seen in Hyderabad. A muslim who,s friends of Family was killed in the various terrorists attacks in India.

     I am not criticizing what you have written however I feel your blog is not against Pakistan, its against India. The very fabric of Indian society is such 14 crore(may be more) Muslims live in India. I have met both hate mongers and peace loving muslims , like some hate mongering Hindus and so the peace loving once. There are a few muslims who have been misguided and them being what we call not a true Indian is because of the society they live in.

     Me and you are part of that society, if educated people like us who can see both the sides of the coin can react like this, we are only playing role of a catalyst for Pakistan’s Agenda.

     I hope you will understand what that whatever I have written is not to put you down but just to understand the perspectives little better.

     I also know the situation on the blog and on ground may be different, however lets all of us the HINDU INDIAN (ZIONISTS) show not only Pakistan but whole of world that yes their is unity in diversity and their is a truly secular country that exists and this will only happen if we, me and you and people like us who have our share of roles to play in our day today lifes, play our role to perfection.

248. # Punjabi Soldier on 11 Jan 2009 at 6:47 pm

     Well brother Animesh i totally understand what you mean but when a pakistani claims that quran doesnt preach hatred and muslims are the most peaceful religion i have to write the truth.If you think i am wrong please prove me wrong thats the reason i have given the ref of the exact paragraphs.Because of the same attitude of us we were ruled by moguls for 800 years then by british.On top of that in our schools they still teach us about Aryan Invasion which has proved to be false.Its our attitude that we are called cowards.The freedoms all muslims enjoy in India can we enjoy those in any muslim countries?In saudi we cant even practice our religion.While in India a muslim preacher name zakir naik openly claims Sanatan Dharma is false and says islam is the only true religion.By 2047 according to recent studies we will be a minority in India .Then again these muslims will ask for another chunk of our Land then what? wake up and change your attuitude.All the freedom and respect that we have given muslims how do they pay us back?By celebrating their Independence day on aug 14th by burning firecrackers when pakistan wins in Indo-pak matches by hosting paki flags on their house and they r not doing anything wrong basically they are just following quran .They cant question quran it clearly tells them that .Religion comes before the country.Any true muslim can never love any other culture and religion and cant be even friends with any non believer so my brother please open your eyes and realise whats going on before its too late.Regarding Aryan Invasion theory every one should read this and see how badly world wants to prove us inferior:-http://www.stephen-knapp.com/death_of_the_aryan_invasion_theory.htm

249. # Punjabi Soldier on 11 Jan 2009 at 6:56 pm

     akistan, objectively speaking, attempted aggression after its birth in 1947 four times and got something out of them two times. It faced aggression from India in 1971 which resulted in its losing half of its country out of which an independent country of Bangladesh was born.

     Firstly it was against the princely state of Jammu and Kashmir (J & K) in 1948 which had yet to make up its mind on whether to join Pakistan or India when Pakistani tribal forces attacked it. Thereafter J & K joined India in return for Indian armed forces saving the rest of J & K from the tribal invaders. Finally the Prime Minister of India took the issue to the UN which called for a ceasefire and resulted in Pakistan having control over one-third of J & K and India having control over two-thirds of it and having the whole of J & K as a part of India on paper.

     The second instance was in 1965 when Pakistan launched a campaign to capture parts of a region called Rann of Kutch in the West of India and South-East of Pakistan. This region was disputed between Pakistan and India and finally Pakistan managed to occupy large swathes of it which were unguarded by India owing to it being an inhospitable salt desert. Then emboldened Pakistan launched a third campaign immediately against the rest of J & K not under its control. This caused Indian retaliation in the form of its occupying large parts of Pakistani-occupied J & K and parts of Sindh and Punjab regions of Pakistan. Finally a ceasefire was proposed by some foreign countries which both Pakistan and India accepted. In the end Pakistan and India returned eachother whatever territory they had occupied from the other with Pakistan being allowed to keep 10% out of whatever of Rann of Kutch it claimed. However its aims of wresting J & K from India were not met in 1965 and it faced a defeat there.

     In the opinion of GlobalSecurity.org on the 1965 Indo-Pak war , “The losses were relatively heavy — on the Pakistani side, twenty aircraft, 200 tanks, and 3,800 troops. Pakistan’s army had been able to withstand Indian pressure, but a continuation of the fighting would only have led to further losses and ultimate defeat for Pakistan.”

     The fourth instance of Pakistan committing aggression against India was in 1999 when its regular army personnel dressed in civilian outfits occupied strategic peaks on the Indian controlled part of J & K in the Kargil region there during the winter. This brought about an overwhelming Indian retaliation in the summer when India discovered the occupation. India retook peak after peak from the Pakistani soldiers without crossing into Pakistani held part of J & K (India maintained the sanctity of the 1948 war ceasefire line in J & K called the LoC against all odds in 1999). Finally the Prime Minister of Pakistan visited US which proposed a ceasefire. India thereafter ceased its fire while the occupying Pakistani forces evacuated themselves out of the Indian part of J & K. Thus in 1999 Pakistan failed to wrest Indian controlled part of J & K from India by force yet again.

     A note about what ATL_ROX has posted. It is filled for the most part with things conjured out of thin air except the great tactics shown by the Pakistani Air Force in the 1965 war and the discipline and professionalism of the Pakistani military. While no one will dispute the above two things, all the rest of it written in his/her post is completely inaccurate and every neutral source in the world will attest to it. If he/she insists on otherwise then neutral proof should be provided to attest to the same.

     Regarding the claim that Pakistan is filled with warrior-minded people and India is/has been militarily weak, the mere military history between India and Pakistan where in each of Pakistan’s almost half a dozen encounters with the Indian military, all it managed was a patch of salt-desert which if it had been important for India it wouldn’t have been given away so easily (refer to the rout by India of Pakistani soldiers from the very strategic peaks of Kargil in 1999) versus India splitting Pakistan into half in 1971 speaks for itself about which country, India or Pakistan, can claim military superiority over the other in the history of their existence.

     Pakistani military victories weren’t so much victories as a victory against the hapless independent state of J & K half of which Pakistan managed to conquer in 1948 until India came to its rescue and therefter took the matter to the UN naively without liberating the whole of J & K from Pakistani occupation.

     As for the rest, winning against this and that unit of the adversary here and there in the numerous wars fought by Pakistan can’t be claimed to be military victories. Pakistan may have got the better of its adversary in a handful of engagements in the numerous wars it fought but it has never won a war despite such blatantly and outrageously untruthful *stories* that most Pakistanis are brought up to believe in. Infact such beliefs of theirs is very annoying and amusing for the rest of the world.

250. # NEEL on 12 Jan 2009 at 7:45 am

     One more thing guys, every1 respect their own countries but Pakistan people should come out of dreams and face the reality, I am Singaporean , and i give you one short example ,in Singapore i seen lot of Indian students as well pakistani students doing their hotel management, but when the matters comes to take admission and visa college it self saying Indian have chance to get visa 98% while if pakistani passport 90% they ill not get visa, Malaysia our neighbor country is Muslim country still they have different view for Indians and much more different for Pakistani passport.i am not talking about visa and passport stuff but its just general point of view. no matter pakistani people not supporting terrorism but they should let show the rest world that they are really clear out of it.no body have problem with Islam or Muslim but everybody have problem with terrorism, whey never hear terrorist name as John miller,mike,or any other hindu name? why terrorist names only muslims? need to be awake and learn, need to face the truth and need to be true muslim , true islam followers by stopping this all.Allah never shown wrong way,go help people who really need you, go help in charity, don’t buy guns and bombs do some charity to those who really need it.by respecting all religion , you are respecting your prime creator your llah,your own god.

251. # Well-Wisher on 12 Jan 2009 at 4:31 pm

     @Punjabi Soldier
     You rightly told all the Indo-Pak facts. Pak is always trying to deceive India. We should get back all the area lost to Pak (Kutch, Sindh, Punjab, Kashmir) and completely eradicte terrorism in there using our militart & airforce. Somehow we should follow Israeli method, otherwise these people will take it very easy on us.

252. # Nitin on 12 Jan 2009 at 10:36 pm

     Curent situation
     Now that Pakistan has build up its army on its borders with India.And they were 1st to do that.So thre are benifits by doing this!
     1)They have relocated the postion of troops from waziristan to Indo -Porki border,These troops wre serving the US army agains talibanis.So by doing this they have bought USA and India ,both the countries under dim pressure !
     2)They want to offtract the worlds attention from 26/11 Mumbai Probe.
     THey think that they are only smart.and whole world is dum like no one wil know!
     Imagine during 9/11 the PM of Porkitsan saying “India has osama bin ladeen!” this was the funniest statement world has ever hurd!.after the satement”Its not the army its , the terrorts (mujahideen) those in kargil!”
     So Porkis know one thing !that you guies are not smart ur a funniest country world has ever seen.And most critisized country on earth!

253. # Nitin on 12 Jan 2009 at 10:37 pm

     Current situation
     Now that Pakistan has build up its army on its borders with India.And they were 1st to do that.So thre are benifits by doing this!
     1)They have relocated the postion of troops from waziristan to Indo -Porki border,These troops wre serving the US army agains talibanis.So by doing this they have bought USA and India ,both the countries under dim pressure !
     2)They want to offtract the worlds attention from 26/11 Mumbai Probe.
     THey think that they are only smart.and whole world is dum like no one wil know!
     Imagine during 9/11 the PM of Porkitsan saying “India has osama bin ladeen!” this was the funniest statement world has ever hurd!.after the satement”Its not the army its , the terrorts (mujahideen) those in kargil!”
     So Porkis know one thing !that you guies are not smart ur a funniest country world has ever seen.And most critisized country on earth!

254. # Aman on 13 Jan 2009 at 3:58 pm

     My dear friend Monis. I read your all previous comment. From your words its seems that either you are war lover or Pakistan’s Militry General. All time u r talking about war and fight. Do u really think that your country is enable to fight agaist us. For bailout package you are looking for International Monitry Fund. You economy condition is so poor that they always depend on world help. See your country. You are continusioly talking about indian media. See yourself what information do u get from youe media. You can get only those information which your government wants to give u. You all are frog in the well. Truning around and around and you think that is the whole world. Think beyond the well. You also wrote that your missiles are ready to target indian militry and other strtegical building. From where you get these missile. From koria or china. Lable laga diya Pakistan kaa to wo pakistan ka ho gaya. Kuch to creative socha karo tu log. Always war and terrorism. Ab bhi waqut hai sudhar jao nahi to khud ko barbad kar loge.

255. # NEEL on 13 Jan 2009 at 9:08 pm

     @Aman :
     you are right Aman, Actually i use to read news papers from both countries mostly i see Times of India from India and Daily PK from pakistan, i marked 1 thing in both Indian media never talk about war and nuclear ,opposite to that pak media always talk about war,new defense tie-ups ,kashmir, common Pak guys you need to learn something out of Indian media, they always talk about technology,Development,Health,Study… while pak media always trying to misguide pakistan people. even pakistan knows the fact they borrowing money from all countries around the world, still they need to pay lot money to china and USA for the aircrafts,bombs and artilleries they bought from them and they planning to buy more =)) whtas that?? better they need to try concentrate on education and health. one fact you should know each year India giving 5000 PHD in world and this numbers lot more than total PHD in pakistan. see here. another thing i read before few days in Daily PK they saying Gujarat Chief Minister narendra modi and L.K.Advani wanted in pakistan and they are mass killers, but check some gujju news papers fact is something else, just before 1 day Gujarat C.M. Signed MOU of RS.7,48,940,00,00,000 for devlopment through Japan,Oman,USA,Britain,Germany,Israel. dont you think this is devlopment and progress?? one more singapore company promised to invest 75,000,00,00,00,00 in next 2 years in Gujarat. check out all facts before pointing your fingures to some1 in India. stop pointing wrong fingures and try to devlop your country this way.

256. # NEEL on 13 Jan 2009 at 9:18 pm

     @ Nitin:
     You knw wht nitin , Pakistan is very cleaver , they knows now conditions against them, entire world unite against them and their terror, so no 1 going to help them financially now, so they doing this:)) they know very well if they remove troops from Afghan border USA will come to them and will offer them some more loan so they can keep their soldiers on border:))

257. # Monis on 14 Jan 2009 at 9:37 am

     @ Aman
     There is a saying in Persian “Tang Aamad Ba’Jung Aamad” it means that if you continue torture some one. One day he will reply the same with 100 times greater strength. You guys for example Punjabi Soldier (what can I say to him on this blog if he will come face to face then I will teach him how to respect other’s religions and what is the result of quoting wrong meanings of the Holy Verses of Holy Quran). I never ever disgrace India in terms of writing the wrong spelling etc. whereas Indians are mostly insulting Pakistan and Islam like write porkistan instead of Pakistan etc. Mr. Aby is also very much influenced by you guys. When I was posted some youtube links in which 100s of Indians youth brutally beating 2 Muslim guys in a university campus in the presence of Police and the Policemen were standing speechlessly. It seems that Policemen were also enjoyed that act of brutal. Mr. Aby blocked that post so it is clearly indicates that Mr. Aby is not an impartial person and this blog is not a neutral blog. So all the reasonable persons like M. Robinson etc leaving this blog. Mr. Aman somebody form your side targeted my capabilities of English. I really don’t know that English very much essential to prove someone’s capabilities or worthiness well if it is necessary then 80% Indians are not worth full in any aspect of life. Well just leave it.. now come on that point which you raise that I’m a war monger. My dear Aman I’m not a War monger but I have a warm precious blood we are very much like to punch someone against his any cruel action against us rather than abusing his nationality/origin/religion etc. We Muslims learned that not to abuse someone’s pride so we are very much happy to live like a lion as the saying of Tipu Sultan “Sher ki aik din ki zindagi Geedar ki 100 saal ki zindagi se behter hay”. This is our history that we always bounce back to every cruel nation/ruler etc. So, we are not afraid of your so called Military strength, Population strength, financial strength etc. We have courage to face you and all your allies (Israel, Russia, USA etc.) if you want to live with peace then you should provide us peace and consider us equal to your self (I’m not talking about being a Pakistani I’m talking on behalf of Muslims) every nook and corner of this world where you and your allies killing Muslims, occupying their mother lands, insulting religious personalities of Muslim etc etc. You should stop it because we are not like those people who always bearing the brutality, cruelness and injustice. If you do not give us our rights then we will take it by force.

     @ Neel
     Are you an Indian living in Singapore…. Well whatever you are please don’t camouflage your native origin. Now considering you an Indian I want to disclose a truth that you (Indians) are not powerful than USA in any aspect of military or economical strength. Mr. Neel USA could not win a war against poor Vietnamese then how you think that you can win a war against a strong Pakistan. Well if you think that it was years ago then look into the current situation even with all his great military and economical powers USA still not in a driving seat in Afghanistan which hadn’t regular military troops and Afghans are still giving a tough time with their old rifles to the well trained fully equipped American force. Remember one thing my dear that.. there is courage of one that can win the wars not weapons.

258. # Animesh on 14 Jan 2009 at 2:17 pm

     Dear Friend Punjabi Soldier,

     I understand and see where you are coming from. However I still disagree. Because of conduct of few muslims in India, the question the credential of the whole community is wrong, I have grown in a locality where I have seen all that you have written, however as I grew up I met many muslims who were as Indian as you and me. Many hate violence, terrorism, pakistans conduct the way we do. Its a reality that if 14% of India s population is muslims they cannot be driven out, changing the my attitude towards them will only make things worse.
     I give hate I will get hate,
     I get hate I give
     Hate, however if I get hate and I give love, if not the first time but surely the fifth time I will get love.

     Love, Peace and Harmony is the only solution. Why as individuals we try to contradict what is right, why we see problems and not solutions, if in 2047 we are the minority we still can live and live happily.

     Just by changing the question or the problem statement we can get the right solution.

     If the problem statement is
     What bad can happen to us if we are in minority in 2047?

     Answer can be: Eliminate them - However that is not possible, it is a situation that has come to us, may be because of bad of weak decisions in 1947, but eliminating them is not posssible.

     We will get answers which can help us decide our actions whenever we meet an Indian muslim, if will govern everything the way we percieve him, the way we interact, the suspicion that we show - our whole behaviour can alter towards a particular community, if we start looking for this answer.

     But if the question is:

     How to live happily in 2047? what can be the answers.

     Answer can be:
     Spread Peace and Harmony,
     To encourage community living, make sure hindus and muslims dont stay in separate colonies but have model communities or colonies were they stay as neighbours, for every hindu gets a muslim neighbour. This will help us understand each other better.
     Encourage all communities meetings,
     Set an example by turning Ayodhya as a all community workship place, with a temple, mosque, gurudhwara and a church.
     Have community celebrations of all important festivals were everyone can mix.
     Advertise, I say again Advertise the way you see congress and BJPs ad today on Tv about good of Islam, and the things that are common in all religions.

     What we have in had is 28 years, what can be done in these 28 years, that will show India in its true spirits. What can be done that whether its 2047 or 2500. India always stands out and we become the model nation, a nation that can stand for unity in diversity, a nation that can stand any eventuality, an example were all religions co-exist.

     And as I said it will require effort, effort from me and you and people like us to take India where we want to.

259. # Animesh on 14 Jan 2009 at 2:26 pm

     Dear Punjabi Soldier,

     I am trying to enter some content that can clear misconceptions about Islam, the one you had quoted earlier, however its not getting moderated

260. # Animesh on 14 Jan 2009 at 2:30 pm

     Verse 60:08: Muslims are governed by the rules that the relationship with non-Muslims should be based on justice, mutual respect, cooperation, and communication. The Quran is very explicit about the justice part of the relationship when God stated “Allah forbids you not, with regard to those who fight you not for (your) Faith nor drive you out of your homes, from dealing kindly and justly with them: for Allah loveth those who are just.”

     The Ultimate Justice

     Another prominent example that I keep referring to concerning the just treatment of Islam to non-Muslims; is the fact that while a husband is allowed to ask his Muslim wife not to go to the Mosque; he has no right to ask his wife to go to Church or Synagogue if it happens that the wife is a Christian or a Jew.

261. # Animesh on 14 Jan 2009 at 2:32 pm

     Infact listen this about creation of Israel from Koran

     It is suggested that us Jews (more precisely Hebrews) impress upon the Muslim community that the Quran contains versus that are supportive of the existence and re-establishment of the State of Israel. “Moses said to his people, ‘My people, remember God’s blessing on you … and gave you what He had not given any other people. My people, go into the holy land which God has ordained for you’” (Quran, Chapter 5, verses 20-21). “God took a pledge from the Children Of Israel … and God said, ‘I am with you … I will wipe out your sins and admit you into Gardens graced with flowing streams…” (Quran, Chapter 5, Verses 12 - 13)

262. # Animesh on 14 Jan 2009 at 2:39 pm

     It should be emphasized that so many revelations in the Holy Quran came down to provide guidance to Prophet Muhammad and the Muslims based on what they were confronting at that time. Therefore, it is important to understand and know the historic context of the revelations for a proper understanding of these verses.
     The Prophet Muhammad, peace and blessings be upon him, was the peace maker of his time. He endured torture, hunger and the killing of his loved ones by his enemies, but he remained a merciful person. In his most startling conquest of Makkah only four people died. In his 23 years of struggle for Islam, the total number of people who lost their lives from all sides was less than 2,000 in wars that were imposed on him and the Muslim community.

263. # Animesh on 14 Jan 2009 at 2:55 pm

     Two.One Nine Zero 2.190 : Fight against those who fight against you in the way of Allah, but do not transgress, for Allah does not love transgressors.

     In verse 2.190, God instructs Muslims to fight back, but not to transgress, and remain just even during the battle. “They are told that material interests should not be the motivation for their fighting, that they should not take up arms against those were not in opposition to the true faith, that they should not resort to unscrupulous methods or to the indiscriminate killing and pillage which characterized the other wars. The excesses alluded to in this verse are acts such as taking up arms against women and children, the old and the injured, mutilation of the dead bodies of the enemy, uncalled for devastation through the destruction of fields and livestock, and other similar acts of injustice and brutality.

     The Prophet prohibited all these acts. The real intent of the verse is to stress that force should be used only when its use is unavoidable, and only to the extent that is absolutely necessary.”

     Two. One nine two :2.192. Then if they desist, know well that Allah is Ever-Forgiving, Most Compassionate.

     Two. One nine three: 2.193. Keep on fighting against them until mischief ends and the way prescribed by Allah prevails. But if they desist, then know that hostility is only against the wrong-doers.

     Commentary on verse 2.192:
     God, in whom the believers have faith, is forgiving and ready to pardon even the worst criminals and sinners after they have renounced their arrogant defiance towards Him. It is suggested that this attribute of God should be reflected in the behavior of the believers as well. Hence, whenever the believers have to resort to armed conflict, they should do so not for the sake of quenching their thirst for vengeance but in the just cause of their defense. Their conflict with any group should last only as long as that group is fighting them. As soon as it gives up this fight the hostility should cease. (see (note 203, page 152, as above.)

264. # Animesh on 14 Jan 2009 at 2:57 pm

     Dear Punjabi Soldier, its 38 years not 28 {Little weak in maths }

265. # NEEL on 14 Jan 2009 at 5:52 pm

     @monish
     Dear Monish i think you didnt checked what i wrote in my post, i didnt wrote anything about war and who going to win, i just said pakistan need to concentrate on development and technology rather than looking for international warfare.i wrote their about pakistani and Indian media check it out your media or any new papers half of your news with full of talking about India,kashmir and new bombs and alliance with china and blah blah, but i didnt found any logical or technological talk in your new papers, same way you can go and check any of Indian news papers and see what they write? its mumbai attack and thats why may be in media i think 5% talk about terrorism and may be 1% about pakistan.while not today but as always i seen Pakistani media have only 1 talk Kashmir,India and bombs=)). so we dont need to clear this all you know we want you to know your own media. another thing what you think Indians hate muslim or Islam?? if like that we could never accept Dr. A.P.J. Abdul Kalam as our president. so you need to see and understand.Indians with mixed cultures but living as brothers no matter muslim-Hindu or Sikh. each country have some bad people if you saying hindu’s hate muslim and Islam because of some bad people out there then you r totally wrong, see in your own country whats between Shiya and Sunni? you both community muslims still cant even stay togather then how cum you talk about India which is 10 times larger than you in both area and population. and yeh Islam is really a holly religion , what my point is just stop doing terrorism on name of Islam and Allah, stop being with those bloody terrorists. one more thing Oman,Iran,Afghanistan,Malaysia,Saudi Arabia these all muslim countries right?? and i think if we go to muslim rules then these countries may follow all muslim rules very good way than pakistan , still India have really good alliance with them , why? why only pakistan.. then entire world blaming them?see dear Monish just because of your millitary and few bad people in Pakistan all muslim community and Islam getting down in front of people in entire world. just because of those bloody terrorists who hidden in your countries entire muslim cummunity count as terrorist, if they go some country and tell from pakistan and muslim then people check them thrice , why?? do you guys really like this all??this not good for Pakistan,Islam or Muslim as well not good for any country in the world.so tell your government , you really wana defeat India , than defeat them by bombing terrorist.another thing just for you i dont want to make you down here but keep in mind check all Internet media not pakistani web just pure media like wiki pedia and all you will get truth about India and pakistan strength.dont try to make Pakistan up with low level technology and low level knowlege of chineese:D:D sorry to say but their 80% jets and fighter planes are coppied of russian technology only, just like they copying Nokia mobile phones with their low material and technology :))

266. # NEEL on 14 Jan 2009 at 6:21 pm

     @Dear Animesh you right, fighting against whome you fight against you.
     Even in hindu holly book shrimad bhagvad geeta, as well as Christian bible said the same thing. but no book said do jihad against innocent people…. while these PAK supported terrorists doing this, and India against that.

     @Monish :- dear monish if Pakistan cant Help to grow Islam atlist stop letting Islam down… you know wht? your anti hindu campaigns and these terrorist activities only making hindus angry on muslims in India and all problems comes from your country only.Indian Hindi-Muslims really love to stay together but its your country who really cant see Indian muslims can live happy in India. one side you guys making them hateful and other side if these Indian muslims comes to Pakistan you only calling them Muhajir,this is shame guys. you guys calling hindu as Kafir , but Hindu’s not Kafir , you know Kafir word? for whom it use? its for bad people , if you wana use word “kafir” use it for terrorists who hiding in pakistan.

267. # Mr. Sinha on 14 Jan 2009 at 8:58 pm

     Dear All,

     i am thinking that i am still a kid after reading these articles. i am of 23 yrs and according to my understanding IND and PAK are going thru the same prb. Politicians, but IND is in upper hand because of stable political situation which is not in PAK and also due to huge size and natural resources. PAK is also a good place and full of nice people but the situation of democracy there is the only cause of all the evil. In IND here politicians are afraid with the mob due to nice election procedure. Just keep Democracy and election healthy then these countries live long healthy otherwise PAK will die due to politicians( Cancer) and IND will die due lack of political will power in our politicians (AIDS).

     Bbye
     have a nice posting

268. # NEEL on 15 Jan 2009 at 5:19 am

     Total Poppulation (Available in Pakistan) :- 82,747,782
     Total Millitary :- :- 13,54,000
     Total poolice:- 2,00,000
     ______________________________________
     Total Person who earning :- 81193782

     -> Per capita Income :- per year :- Pakistani rs. 78,56,00
     -> so total 81193782*785600 = 63785835139200 Pakistani rs
     -> Now lets deduct 20% tax which goes to government from this total income so rest will be as below.

     -> So now Pakistani Government getting total tax of :- 12757167027840 = USD 162,387,569,046
     -> So we can say each year Pakistani government earning = 162.39 Billion

     _________________________________________________________________________________

     Expenses:-
     Government Offices & Police expenses as per doccuments each year:- 42billion
     External affairs and services maintainance budget each year:- 19billion
     Millitary Budget each year 4.96 billion
     _________________________
     approx 66 billion

     out of 162.39 billion government using 66 billion so rest will be :- 96.43 billion .

     They saying Airforce saying to buy arround 240 JF-17 = 240 will cost = 20 million approx for 240 JF-17

     36 airplane type F16 C/D Block 52+ fighting falcon = = 684 million

     Lot many has to come in list now if pakistani government using these all funds in buying these aircrafts and missiel as

     well as intellegence then nothing will be rest in their hand out of 96.43 billion :))

     so now there are 2 criterias left for them , they leave civilion withought any needed facilities like schools,colleges,or

     hospitals ,technology buildings or Information technologies.

     or second one is they dont buy these planes and stuffs of mass destruction .

     => Note:- but here situation is so different Pakistan saying they doing everything for their civillion what they require and

     same time they buying these all stuffs too , now strange is then from where these money comming

     => bagging to USA,Worldbank? china will not give em a single rs because they have enough poppulation in their own

     country to feed , they will give them or these baggers?? =))

     or a most powerful criteria to be considered is Pakistan getting financial help by millitants and thats why giving them safe

     place to hide in their country :)) now world have to decide what pakistani really deserve :))

269. # Monis on 15 Jan 2009 at 6:38 am

     @ Neel
     Although India is the world’s most populous democracy, its current foreign policy often would make a confirmed dictator proud, says a US human rights report released on Wednesday.
     “The Indian government lacks the will and capacity to implement many laws and policies designed to ensure the protection of rights,” observes Human Rights Watch, a US-based rights group.
     “There is a pattern of denial of justice and impunity, whether it is in cases of human rights violations by security forces, or the failure to protect women, children, and marginalised groups such as Dalits, tribal groups, and religious minorities.”
     The report adds that India’s failure to properly investigate and prosecute those responsible leads to continuing abuses.
     The report notes that human rights groups in India lack sufficient resources to conduct their own investigations, and are not empowered to investigate violations by the army.
     In efforts to contain armed groups in places like Kashmir and Manipur, “Indian security forces are responsible for extrajudicial killings, arbitrary detention, due process violations, and ill-treatment in custody. “Laws such as the Armed Forces (Special Powers) Act sanction impunity.”

270. # Monis on 15 Jan 2009 at 6:46 am

     @ Neel
     The report notes that while the level of violence has decreased in Kashmir, failure to investigate human rights violations transparently and prosecute those responsible remains a strong reason for public anger. Kashmiris believe that many of the thousands “disappeared” over the last two decades were dumped into unmarked graves. The government has ignored calls for an independent investigation by human rights groups to determine the fate of the victims.
     The report notes that widespread protests erupted in Indian-held Jammu and Kashmir after a state government decision in May 2008 to transfer forest land to a Hindu trust to build temporary shelters during an annual Hindu pilgrimage called “Amarnath Yatra.” Several people were killed and many injured in the protests, and the issue fuelled religious tension.
     Security forces used tear gas and opened fire using live ammunition as well as rubber bullets to control protesters who set fires, damaged government property, hurled stones, and in some cases attacked policemen.
     The report points out that India continue to provide extraordinary powers to its troops and grants them immunity from prosecution when they abuse those powers and commit human rights violations.
     The Armed Forces (Special Powers) Act was enacted on August 18, 1958, as a short-term measure to allow deployment of the army in the northeast. The law has remained in force in various parts of the country for five decades.
     It provides the armed forces with sweeping powers to shoot to kill, arrest, and search in violation of international human rights law. The law has led to widespread human rights abuses and protects troops from prosecution for such crimes.
     The Indian government has failed to protect vulnerable communities, including Dalits, tribal groups, and religious minorities. Since August 2008, supporters of the Hindu militant groups Vishwa Hinud Parishad and Bajrang Dal in Orissa have attacked Christians, many of them tribal minorities or Dalits. The militants have burned churches, beat priests and nuns, and destroyed property.
     Several policemen were suspended for dereliction of duty after a nun alleged that she was raped. At this writing, at least 40 persons had died in the violence, with scores injured and thousands internally displaced.
     Failure to secure justice for the 2002 Gujarat riots — in which more than 2,000 Muslims were killed following an attack on a train carrying Hindu pilgrims — has fuelled anger amongst Muslims.
     Police continue to arbitrarily round up and detain Muslims nationwide after bomb blasts; many have alleged were tortured during interrogation and forced into signing false confessions.
     Muslims also face discrimination in access to housing and jobs and the Indian government does little to protect them.

271. # NEEL on 15 Jan 2009 at 7:24 am

     @ Monish
     Dear monish i am not against of you or Muslims i told u in my previous post also. and yeh here i am agree with you about the laws and acts of Indian government and they fail to fulfill them thats 100% correct, but here i said every time when there is Indians trying to be normal and Hidnu-Muslim trying to start their business again togather these hidden terrorist attacks , some times pakistan giving some Hindu against statments and again all Indian politicians as well knows start getting benefits out of it.
     See there are number of Hindus as well as more muslims than Pakistan in India right? now think a small matter a small stone threw towards hindu or muslim can take big riot and thats naked truth. you onle can even see same in Pakistan Shiya and Sunni , they both muslims only still if some statement come against shiya then they start fighting to sunni or comes to sunni and they start to shiya, then how cum you expect 100 crrors can be safe out of it?

272. # NEEL on 15 Jan 2009 at 7:32 am

     @ Monish
     So my saying is this monish pakistanis as well as Pakistan government should leave Indian muslims for what they doing , as India never interfering hindus in Pakistan.
     every country have their own rules-regulations and their own standards for minority and majority ,and you guys should not interfere in that thats my point. see PAK occupied kashmir its pakistan part lets Indian claim it but still they never come to pak occupied kashmir and doing terrorism and here what all mujahiddin doing in Indian occupied kashmir? terrorism? what you guys think Kashmir people like pakistan and hate India? they dont like pakistan nor India they want their self just all alone , so lets keep our own parth with us and thank god for what we have .If kashmiri’s really like pakistan then they never take part in voting in election in Kashmir , but they even giving votes as well as same way they support pakistan too they playing game on both side as they know well if they say something against pakistan mujahiddin will kill them or if they say something wrong about India millitary will harress them .they like a sandwitch between Indian millitary and pakistani mujahiddin.and this is truth no1 can deny this.

273. # Animesh on 15 Jan 2009 at 1:10 pm

     Dear Monis,
     Some facts and figures
     Just to help you understand better Human Rights also Include democracy, Political rights, Civil Liberties, press freedom, corruption.
     The table below shows the most recent World Democracy Audit scores and rankings achieved by this country. The bracket figures show the range in which these topics where measured. Lower scores are preferable.
     Scores of Pakistan:
     Topics
     World Democracy Audit overall ranking (1-150) - 114 ,
     Political Rights (1-7) - 6 ,
     Civil Liberties (1-7) - 5 ,
     Press Freedom (0-150) - 106,
     Corruption (0-145) - 110,
     India
     World Democracy Audit overall ranking (1-150) - 46
     Political Rights (1-7) - 2
     Civil Liberties (1-7) - 3
     Press Freedom ( 0-150) - 46
     Corruption (0-145) - 57

     The top twenty worst offenders: Amnesty reports
     Pakistan is on 11th Number

     ________________________________________

     1)The report Freedom in the World 2006 by Freedom House gave Pakistan a political rights rating of 4 (1 representing free and 7 representing not free), and a civil liberties rating of 5, earning it the designation of partly free.
     2)Pakistan’s human rights record is generally regarded as poor by domestic and international observers, although there have been some improvements since 2000.
     3)Pakistan’s security forces use excessive and sometimes lethal force and are complicit in extrajudicial killings of civilians and suspected militants. The police and military have been accused of engaging in physical abuse, rape, and arbitrary arrest and detention, particularly in areas of acute conflict.
     Although the government has enacted measures to counter these problems, abuses continue. Furthermore, courts suffer from lack of funds, outside intervention, and deep case backlogs that lead to long trial delays and lengthy pretrial detentions. Many observers inside and outside Pakistan contend that Pakistan’s legal code is largely concerned with crime, national security, and domestic tranquility and less with the protection of individual rights.
     4)In 2002 citizens participated in general elections, but those elections were criticized as deeply flawed by domestic and international observers. Societal actors also are responsible for human rights abuses. Violence by drug lords and sectarian militias claims numerous innocent lives, discrimination and violence against women are widespread, human trafficking is problematic, and debt slavery and bonded labor persist.
     4)The government often ignores abuses against children and religious minorities, and government institutions and some Muslim groups have persecuted non-Muslims and used some laws as the legal basis for doing so. The Blasphemy Law, for example, allows life imprisonment or the death penalty for contravening Islamic principles, but legislation was passed in October 2004 to eliminate misuse of the law.
     5)Furthermore, the social acceptance of many these problems hinders their eradication. One prominent example is honor killings (“karo kari”), which are believed to have accounted for more than 4,000 deaths from 1998 to 2003. Many view this practice as indicative of a feudal mentality and as an anathema to Islam, but others defend the practice as a means of punishing violators of cultural norms and view attempts to stop it to as an assault on cultural heritage.
     6)Pakistan was recommended by the U.S. Commission on International Religious Freedom (USCIRF) in May to be designated as a “Country of Particular Concern” (CPC) by the Department of State because of its government’s engagement or toleration of systematic, ongoing, and egregious violations of religious freedom
     6)There have been severe persecution of Hindus by Muslims in Pakistan since its formation in 1947. The increasing Islamization has caused many Hindus to leave Hinduism and seek emancipation by converting to other faiths such as Buddhism and Christianity. Such Islamization include the blasphemy laws, which make it dangerous for religious minorities to express themselves freely and engage freely in religious and cultural activities
     Hindus in what is now Pakistan have declined from 23 % of the total population in 1947 to less than 2% today. The report condemns Pakistan for systematic state-sponsored religious discrimination against Hindus through bigoted “anti-blasphemy” laws. It documents numerous reports of millions of Hindus being held as “bonded laborers” in slavery-like conditions in rural Pakistan, something repeatedly ignored by the Pakistani government.
     7)Forced and coerced conversions of religious minorities to Islam occurred at the hands of societal actors. Religious minorities claimed that government actions to stem the problem were inadequate. Several human rights groups have highlighted the increased phenomenon of Hindu girls, particularly in Karachi, being kidnapped from their families and forced to convert to Islam.
     8)Several minority Muslim communities, such as the Mojahir and the Ahmadiyya have been attacked in pogroms in Pakistan over the years Plus, the ethnic Balochi have allegedly been severely discriminated against, leading them to start a secessionist movement under Nawab Akbar Bugti called the balochistan Liberation Army.

     9)A non-governmental Human Rights Commission of Pakistan (HRCP) report released in late January 2006 found scores of cases of arbitrary arrests and detention, torture, extrajudicial executions, “disappearances” and use of excessive force by security and intelligence forces committed since early 2005. Amongst the victims are women, children and many political activists. In addition, the Commission noted with concern that armed Baloch fighters opposing the army’s presence in the province have laid landmines as a result of which civilians have been indiscriminately killed and maimed.
     The findings of the HRCP fact-finding mission corroborate a large number of reports received by Amnesty International from Baloch activists and civil society organisations since early 2005. According to a January 2006 statement by Senator Sanaullah Baloch, at least 180 people have died in bombings, 122 children have been killed by paramilitary troops and hundreds of people have been arrested since the beginning of the campaign in early 2005. On 8 December 2005, the federal Interior Minister stated that some 4,000 people had been arrested in Balochistan since the beginning of 2005. The identities, whereabouts of and charges against many of these detainees remain unknown. Having monitored some of these cases of detention and “disappearance”, Amnesty International fears that some of the detainees may have been arbitrarily detained, or held under preventive detention legislation or on politically motivated criminal charges, in violation of Pakistan statutory law and international human rights standards.

     10)On 17 March 2005, some 62 persons, including 33 Hindu women and children were killed at Dera Bugti when Frontier Corps personnel shelled, bombarded and fired at them.

     11)On 17 December 2005, at least 22 persons, mostly women and children, including infants, were killed in bombing, firing and shelling by armed forces in the Marri area of Jabbar and Pekal, apparently in retribution for rocket attacks on 14 December on a paramilitary camp on the outskirts of Kohlu during a visit by President Musharraf and on 15 December on a helicopter carrying the Inspector General of the Frontier Corps.
     12)On 9 December 2005, 18 members of the Pakistan Petroleum Workers’ Union from Balochistan who had gone to Karachi for negotiations with their management were detained by security forces from their hotel. Their whereabouts remain unknown.

     13)Dr Hanned Shareef, a writer, medical doctor and member of the BSO was arrested on 18 November 2005 in Turbat by men in the uniform of the paramilitary Frontier Corps. State officials have refused to confirm that he has been arrested. When his family members attempted to file a complaint against the Frontier Corps soldiers involved, police at the Turbat city police station refused to accept it [AI Index: ASA 33/032/2005].
     14)A 17-year-old girl was abducted by police officials and kept for almost 16 days in private custody where she was raped and tortured to confess her involvement in the murder of her fiancée. Her elder sister was also brought in police lock up and held, naked for three days naked to pressure the sister to confess to the charges.

     15)The society is rigidly divided into subgroups where each Quom is assigned a profession. Different Quoms are not permitted to intermarry or live in the same community. These Muslims practice a ritual-based system of social stratification. The Quoms who deal with human emissions are ranked the lowest
     16)Lower castes are often severely persecuted by the upper castes. Lower castes are denied privileges in many communities and violence is committed against them. A particularly infamous example of such incidents is that of Mukhtaran Mai in Pakistan, a low caste woman who was gang raped by upper caste men. In addition, educated Pakistani women from the lower castes are often persecuted by the higher castes for attempting to break the shackles of the restrictive system (that traditionally denied education to the lower castes, particularly the women). A recent example of this is the case of Ghazala Shaheen, a low caste Muslim woman in Pakistan who, in addition to getting a higher education, had an uncle who eloped with a woman of a high caste family. She was accosted and gang-raped by the upper-caste family. The chances of any legal action are low due to the Pakistani Government’s inability to repeal the Hudood ordinance against women in Pakistan
     17) In Pakistan men batter and kill women with virtual impunity. In Pakistan men kill their sisters and mothers if they are victims of rape ! In such cases the women are completely without fault ! They get attacked and raped, and THEY have to be punished for it ???

     18)PAKISTAN: Prominent lawyer tortured, poisoned in detention; two others held incommunicado. The physical condition and health of a prominent lawyer, Mr. Munir A. Malik, former president of the Supreme Court of Pakistan Bar Association, whom we reported to have traces of blood in his urine due to severe torture while in custody, continues to deteriorate. Mr. Malik told his physicians after regaining consciousness that his health worsened after he was forced to drink the juices and food rations given to him whom he believed could have contained poison. No action has been taken against those involved in arresting, detaining and torturing him. Though the government claimed they had already released him, the security forces deployed at the hospital admitted that this is not the case.
     19)PAKISTAN: Higher police officers have impunity in the torture case of a French researcher. The police in Pakistan have been involved in beating, torturing and threatening a French researcher on 20 September 2007 and have not been charged. While no action has been taken against them, the police officials threaten local journalists and a local English language teacher, not to cover the story.

     20) PAKISTAN: Chief Justice of a provincial High Court was threatened by a ruling party. Several judges including the Chief Justice, of the Sindh High Court were threatened by a ruling political party in General Musharraf’s government on accepting the bail applications of several arrested lawyers on 29 September 2007. There were a variety of threats but the Chief Minister of the province condoned the actions of the ruling party, arguing that the writing against the Chief Justice is the “peoples’ voice”. It is alleged that the workers and leadership of the ruling party are involved in the mayhem of May 12, 2007, the killings of two lawyers in recent days and threats to office bearers of different Bar Associations, including attacks on the cars of sitting judges.

274. # Animesh on 15 Jan 2009 at 1:40 pm

     Dear Monis,

     Finally Pakistan has done it.

     It has won over India, atleast in some respect its better than India.

     Its better in rankings when it comes to the Human Rights Violations segement.

     Its better in Rankings when it comes to Most Dangerous Place in the world.

     It is better in rankings when it comes to number of people who have disappeared.

     It is better in rankings when it comes to Honour Killings. (Two thousand people died in Gujrat Riots, however 4,000 people have been killed in Honor Killing or what you call “Karo Kari”)

     It is better in rankings when it comes to excesses done by Army (Check your own Backyard in Baloochistan and POK) before commenting on Kashmir and Gujrat.

     It is better in ranking in terms of largest reduction in population of a community (Hindus reduced from 23% in 1947 to 2% in 2007) ever.

     You have won this battle. Congratulations.

275. # Animesh on 15 Jan 2009 at 1:42 pm

     Dear Monis,

     You talk about Indian Human Rights Commision not being well equipped, I agree to that, But I guess your government and government agencies are not equipped to even investigate Mohtarma Bennazir Bhuttos Killers, UN had to do it. Still not a much headaway in that case. I wonder What will happen if something happens to common people like you in Pakistan, is your state well equipped to investigate then.

276. # Aman on 15 Jan 2009 at 3:17 pm

     Mr. Monis you are talking about beating muslims. Its nat the matter of hindu and muslim. It happens some times in same relegon also. Kya kabhi ek muslman dusre muslman pe haath nahi uthata. Agar ek relgon walo ne dusre relegon walo pe haath uthaya to its not the matter of any relegon Its just the issue who selfish wants to rase for their own benifit. Ladaiyan to apne gharon main bhi hoti hai phir use issue kyun nahi banate. Jahan tak english ki baat hai to i am also not good in english. Tu muslmano ki baat karte ho. Main ye nahi kaheta ki sare galat ho par kabi ye socha hai ki sare world main jo bhi major trrriost attack hate hai unme tumahara hi naam kyun ata hai.

277. # Well-Wisher on 15 Jan 2009 at 3:28 pm

     @Animesh
     Wow, you responded very well to Monis. It is their regular job to practice hatred against India everybody, everywhere, and everytime in Pakistan. They made it as one of their legislation to talk always against India and annex Kashmir with them. They broke India by separating Pakistan (inlcuding Bangladesh) and keeps on trying to break it one more time. If they keeps on behaving bad and trying for it, in future they may loose their own existence.

278. # Animesh on 15 Jan 2009 at 4:03 pm

     Dear Monis,
     A country who did not have democracy but Military rule for most of the time after independence should not talk about Human Rights.

     Every country has its set of problems, we what you call a fake democracy have our set of problems and you (I dont have words for the kind of democratic government you have) have your own set of problems.
     And your problems are so many that you should concentrate on solving them not worry about us.You can see all that is wrong with India but as you must have heard the saying “Charity begins at Home” Please do that.
     What you do is first you clean your house and then you think of cleaning others house.
     So dear Monis start cleaning your house as soon as possible, before others take that initiative as its so very dirty that countries across the world can smell it.

279. # VK on 16 Jan 2009 at 2:02 am

     Now that Pakistan has accepted Kasab and they cannot deny their involvement in Mumbai attack, Monis has decided to divert the conversation to Human Rights. Looks like he has been reading a lot of books and articles on Human Rights and India, lately. Well, let’s not sway away from the topic and that’s pakistan’s involvement in Mumbai terrosrist attack. For almost two decades they have been involved in this proxy war of infiltrating militants into Indian territory, but poor neighbors have not been able to achieve anything substantial. On all fronts wether dipolomatic or militarly, they have been a complete looser and still they are not willing to learn. Globally, their have been voices of ‘Pakistan is an international migraine ‘, ‘Pakistan is a terrosrist state’ etc. but Pakistan is afterall Pakistan. They claim to be the problem solver of the entire muslim world. Look at other islamic countries, UAE, Bahrain, Oman, Qatar, Jordan, Saudi Arabia, they are as big and as islamic countries as Pakistan, but look at them and look at Pakistan. While the other countries are growing (including India), Pakistan is going the other way. They are the only country on this planet that is roaming across the globe begging for money to rescue their tumbbling economy. They got $billions in aid from US for their support in the war on terror, a part of which was economic aid package, but where is that money gone? Pentagon came out with a report saying that Pakistan used that money to upgrade their F-16s, how stupid is that? A country where there is so much poverty, people don’t have jobs, their govt. is using the money to feed its army. No wonder why Pakistan is in a crumbling situation at this point.

     The govt. doesn’t have money to feed its people and they talk about war with India. Internally, pakistan knows that they cannot afford to go on war with India at any cost. Indian foreign reserve stands at $300bn, whereas, pakistani foreign reserve is below $10bn. Incase of a full-fledged war, they won’t even be able to stand for more than a week, forget about getting anywhere close to India. The history tells that you can only win war if your army is well equipped with arms and ammunitions, fighter planes, your navy is well equipped and on all fronts India is way ahead of Pakistan. We might not be best equipped army, airforce, navy in the world but we are way ahead of you. You better think twice before planning any mischief otherwise you will be hammered like a nail.

     Live peacefully and let the other nantions live likewise. Kashmir is an Indian state and the entire country is united about it. Try to live with what you have, fix your internal problems, get on par with the other countries and then let’s talk. Actually, you know who your peer countries are? Somalia, Sudan, Zimbabwe, Uganda, Ethiopia etc. You are on the esteemed 20 Failed States list of 2008. CONGRATULATIONS! You have gained three places from last year to be at no. 9. Wow,that’s even better. Keep up the good work…..you will be no. 1 soon.

280. # Punjabi Soldier on 16 Jan 2009 at 7:22 am

     Myth of islam:-
     Islam means peace and love and Muslims only want to be left alone to practice their beliefs–in peace. This is one of the greatest lies of the last century but many Muslims continue to say it, over and over, like a mantra, perhaps more to convince themselves than the rest of the world.

     In these modern times even nomadic Bedouins have cell-phones so it is difficult for Muslims not to read or hear about the suicide bombers, the genocide, the constant attacks in Iraq , and beheadings carried out by their fellow Muslims all over the world. When it is against infidels, it is easier to accept. All can be justified, somehow, in the Quran. But more and more, Muslims are turning on other Muslims and this is not as easily explained away. For some Muslims, it must seem as though the very foundations of Islam are crumbling and there is no amount of shoring up that will save it.

     A recent article from the on-line Telegraph exposed the story that Shia Muslims are easily bought off not only with money but promises of the title “emir” for killing more than ten Iraqi Shia Muslims. For $1500 a month and a promise of fame, they happily killed fellow Muslims. This reveals more Islamic hypocrisy: Muslims never kill other Muslims. Sunni Muslims often kill Shia, but for Shia to be so easily bought to kill other Shia Muslims is a shock.

     Islamics seem to be still fighting the Crusades. Anyone who fights back against Islam is called a “crusader” and thus, is evil. We Americans have the clarion call, “Remember the Alamo .” Islam has, “We are still fighting the Crusades and Europe belongs to Islam!”

     The re-taking of Europe is underway as Muslims flood into every European country. Some startling statistics are starting to be reported. Everywhere that there is a large number of Muslims, the report of rapes of non-Muslim girls and women has tripled. These statistics expose another Islamic lie: Muslims never rape women.

     People must understand that Mohammed himself told his followers that the rape of non-believers was not rape. This justified the raping of the many women taken as slaves in their conquests. Non-Muslim women are not women to many Muslims, they are just whores.

     For Muslims, doing everything in God’s name is at the core of Islam. Any sin is justified if it is done in the name of God. Killing can’t be a sin if it is God’s will. Rape is accepted as long as the woman raped is a non-believer. Mohammed said as much.

     I have been told that women in Islam are treated with more respect than any western women who run “nearly naked in the streets to please men.” Muslims seem to think that all we in the evil West do is watch pornography, drink, and shoot up heroin. All American women are prostitutes. What has amazed me is that these Muslim men who tell me this seem know more about American pornography than I do. But then, they claim to know more about America than I do. I only live here. What do I know? I’m a stupid woman.

     Muslim men tell me the reason Muslim women must be covered head to toe is because of the respect Muslim men have for them. Any woman who shows any of her skin is “asking to be raped.” And so, since Muslim men apparently can’t control themselves, out of respect, women must be suffocated in 120 degree heat by only showing their eyes. Muslim women are even supposed to look down, rather than into a man’s eyes because that is considered to “provocative and tempting.” There seems to be a serious lack of control among some Muslim men.

     Also, out of respect, Muslim women need not concern themselves with voting, driving a car, leaving the house unattended, or talking to any man that is not their father or brother. Should women stray from the ways of Islam, they will receive a respectful demonstration of an “honor killing.”

     Zacarias Moussaoui, a French Muslim, has pleaded guilty on all counts of conspiracy pertaining to the attack on 9/11 and now faces the death penalty. According to Moussaoui, his mission was to highjack a 747 and crash it into our White House. Moussaoui made the statement that he expects “no leniency from the Americans.” Does he deserve leniency? Did Daniel Pearl or Nicholas Berg receive leniency? Did either of those men even commit a crime? Did the Bulgarian man, brutally gunned down just the other day in Iraq receive leniency? Yet, I have no doubt that when Moussaoui receives the death penalty, Muslims around the world will scream foul, racism, and will claim Americans are uncivilized butchers.

     Mr. Kostov, the Bulgarian man identified as the pilot of the downed helicopter in Iraq, was executed as he surrendered to the Islamic terrorists. As they riddled his body with bullets, they shouted, “Allahu akbar!”–“God is great!” The last words Mr. Kostov heard was a man yelling “Carry out God’s verdict.” The Islamic terrorists stated that he was killed “in revenge for the Muslims killed in the mosques of Fallujah.” The pure hypocrisy of it all was that the same day a car bomb blew up outside a mosque and killed nine fellow Muslims. The bombing was carried out at prayer time for maximum kill. Saturday, April 23, another mosque was targeted and two more Muslims were killed by fellow Muslims. April 24 brought more death at a mosque from a car bomber as well as a bomb outside an ice cream shop, meant to target children.

     Muqtada Al Sadr, a Muslim cleric, used the mosques in Fallujah to judge and convict over 200 fellow Muslims and behead them as punishment under the ruthless Islamic Shari’a law. But if an American bullet scratches the paint on a mosque the hue and cry is heard around the world. Yet, Muslims in Iraq are free to blow up any mosque or church and kill as many people as they can because it has been ordained and they are “Allah’s warriors.”

     The hypocrisy is that mosques are only “holy places” when Muslims are killing in them. If a non-believer even gets near a mosque it’s a sacrilege and someone must die for it.

     The reality is that anything Muslims do, any crime, any execution, any bombing, is all justified because Allah has instructed them to do it. The hypocrisy is when moderate Muslims deny that those committing these hideous crimes are Muslims. The truth seems to be that it is peaceful Muslims that do not follow true Islam. This is a truth many Muslims must realize. They must realize the hypocrisy of Islam. If Islam means peace, then why does death, oppression, genocide, and war follow Islam everywhere it goes?

281. # aryan on 16 Jan 2009 at 8:26 am

     I totally agree with what puinjabi soldier has to say about islam. These guys they dont want just Palestine, kashmir or checnya they want to conquer whole of the world.

     This is what has been taught to them in the quran. Where ever these dirty craps are they are spoiling the whole of the world

282. # Monis on 16 Jan 2009 at 10:10 am

     @ ABY
     What are you doing here???? Punjabi soldier is continuously doing disgrace ISLAM. if I started talk on Hinduism, Christianity and Sikhism then no body will stop me.

283. # Monis on 16 Jan 2009 at 10:15 am

     @ Punjabi Soldier
     Hey cowerd if u r a son of ur own father or if u are a man then talk infornt of any muslim r talk infront of me. huh you cowerd only barking here on this blog cum on if u have guts.

284. # Monis on 16 Jan 2009 at 10:18 am

     @ all indians
     Tribesmen in India’s far eastern state of Mizoram, bordering Burma and Bangladesh, are shuddering at the sight of the heavy flowering of the ubiquitous bamboo
     It attracts hordes of rats, a phenomenon known locally as Mautam, the Mizos’ worst nightmare.
     Not only do the rats thrive on the bamboo flowers, they also then go on to destroy the farmers’ crops.
     Mizo oral tradition suggests this deadly ecological cycle is repeated every 48 years.
     Most Mizo farmers are now not even sowing rice or corn, so worried are they by the rats.
     “It is no use planting anything. The hordes of rats have already destroyed the standing crop in some areas and will destroy all the rest,” says Thangthiauva of Pangzawl village Officials in Mizoram’s agriculture department share his gloom.
     Plant Protection Officer James Lalsiamliana says the Mautam, that struck the Mizo Hills in 1910-11 and again in 1958-59 is back with a vengeance.
     “It will affect more than 30% of Mizoram’s land area and much of the area under some crop or other. It cannot be stopped, we can only do damage control,” said Mr Lalsiamliana.
     He told the BBC that some parts of Champhai, Aizawl and Serchhip districts had already witnessed crop destruction by hordes of rats in the winter of 2006-2007.
     “But the worse is still to come.”

285. # amit on 16 Jan 2009 at 12:02 pm

     I totally agree with punjabi soldier..these terrorists always commit heinous crimes in the name of GOD…also they don’t give freedom to their female counterparts…
     @monis..
     friend stop yelling..
     “saach to hamesha kadwa hota hai”
     frnd one thing you must remember is that ..its a blog ..
     here you fight with your “brain” and not physically..
     i always see such remarks from my pakistani friends when they are out of words..
     but thank GOD the picture in India is completely different..
     the muslim womens are free and enjoy their fundamental rights..
     *********LONG LIVE INDIA********
     ************JAI HIND***********

286. # amit on 16 Jan 2009 at 12:14 pm

     @Monis..
     you are the real coward..you are the shouting in this blog.
     everyone in this blog can sense the level of ur frustration….
     you pakistani’s have already lost the fight here in this blog by showing the level of ur frustration..(you all are fighting a lost battle..)
     you have always tried to copy us(INDIAN’S) in every aspect…
     now you should learn “how not to loose your composure “

287. # Animesh on 16 Jan 2009 at 1:24 pm

     Dear Monis,

     Have you completely lost it…. What and why that rat article from Mizoram all about…

     Dont worry India will nor send a army of rats to deal with your army (Though I think they can very well do the job). No seriously man, why that mizoram article, what were you trying to convey,

     is this is what is being taught in the PG courses in Pakistan.

     Again “if you are son of your own father”, it is not some galli of Lahore or Islamabad were you are with your 10 friends with hockey and cricket bats in hand trying to get after Punjabi Soldier.

     Its a blog I sent so much of data to go through, was expecting a reply as you had tried to show your intellectual side in the last blog, However as you were faking it, the true monis is for all of us to see.

     Blog is a discussion forum its about points and counterpoints, its not a boxing match, and even if it is it is though words and what you write, its not about how many push ups you do every morning.

     Come on Monis you can reply back and that too by making some sense, people here are waiting, you are the centre of attraction, show them that people from Pakistan are educated enough to win a sensible argument and its not always about muscle power (Its Information age - the age of mind power)

     Though I am still scared of you what if you come here and stone me to death.

288. # Monis on 16 Jan 2009 at 4:04 pm

     @ Aminesh
     Mr. Right…. may be you think that I’m insane or have lost my senses, but it is a matter of fact that I posted the “Rat article from Mizoram” is just to show you that what punjabi soldier is continuously doing. He tried to spoil the spirit of forum by posting nonsense about ISLAM. Everyone knows that this blog is for Evaluation of Military Strength of Pakistan and India not for abusing or disgracing any religion by fake and nonsense self generated meanings of one’s Scriptures. Anyone can judge that whatever I posted here is excluded of religious abhorrence. I never ever write a single word on Hinduism or etc. I really don’t understand that why punjabi soldier and his fellows are doing such things and what they are trying to prove?
     Well! As I earlier said that we Muslims are prohibited to abuse someone’s pride (religion, tradition and family values etc) so, I just warned Punjabi soldier once again that not to do these kind of discreditable things. What you think I cannot write something regarding Hinduism or Sikhism or else??? I can my dear I really can, since there are a lot of stuff available every where regarding those religions good or bad both.
     This was an exam of my patience but thanks to Almighty ALLAH that I did not do so. Dear Aminesh you know one thing that there are so many people from both sides India and Pakistan are using these kinds of blogs and arguing with each other on different topics. I have seen in every blog that every third Indian blogger attacked on Islam. I just want to ask one question that why you afraid of Muslims or Islam? Why you abused Islam? We did not talk about your Bhagwat Geeta so why you talk about Holy Quran and the shameful thing is to quote the wrong meanings of Verses of the Holy Quran. Indeed it shows the bully attitude of one, like a scoundrel who always attacks the people which are not able to defend themselves and if he faces some one strong then pee in his pants.
     Freedom of expressions doesn’t mean to criticize some one’s religion or beliefs. If you guys think that by doing this you can win a war then yes you can win a war of words nothing else because you are feeding us a poison of hate and we have now venomous hatred for you. You know why we Muslims are famous. Now its tit for tat for scoundrel like punjabi soldier but not in the same way I’ll not abuse his beliefs. I’ll just reply him with my Right Punch on his face to break his tooth so that whenever he will think for doing wrong, he will remember my punch and lost tooth.

289. # VK on 16 Jan 2009 at 7:27 pm

     Being an Indian, I agree this is not a forum or a blog to defame a particular religion. Let’s not talk about the preachings of one religion and compare that to another. No matter what others have to say, I firmly believe that no religion, no god, no allah, no bhagwan tells its followers to kill innocent people. India is a mult-cultural society and from our early school days we are being taught that all religions are equal and we should have an equal respect for all the religions. So again I request all my fellow country mates not to target any particular religion in this blog. Religion is a very emotional and sentimenal topic so let’s not discuss it here.

     Having said that, it hurts me to see how easily some of these people are brain washed in the name of a religion to pick up the guns and kill thousands of innocent people. It’s not about religion, but what surprise me is to see most of the terrorist attacks had muslims involved in it. From 9/11, to London, from Bali to Mumbai, all the major terrorist attacks across the globe had pakistani links. Their madrasas preach hatred against jews, christians, hindus. Pakistan claims that they are suffering from terrorism, but then who gave these people shelter? where do these orgnaizations get all their weapons (ISI) and money? Why is pakistan reluctant of shutting the terrorist camps and the madrasas that are sowing the seed of hatred in their young blood? Why are people so easily willing to pick up guns and grenades? Why is that country a safe haven for people like dawood ibrahim, maulans masood azhar, baitulah mesud etc. If the whole world is saying that there is problem with pakistan then definetely there is problem with that country. You country is not willing to extradite terrorists to the other country, your govt. says that the trial will be conducted in your country but everyone knows that will never happen, your govt. says that you are fighting against terrorism but are not willing to dismantle terrorist camps and organizations that are waging proxy war against India. Actually, the whole country is in a complete disarray. The Govt. doesn’t know what to say and what to do, people don’t know what to expect out of the govt. Terrorist organizations are becoming stronger and stronger and eventually they will take over your country from north to south.

     You should even wait for Barrack Obama to become the president. In one of his presidnetial debate he said that pakistan if he becomes the president of united states he won’t mind attacking pakistan if there are evidences found of pakistan and al-qaeda involvement.

     Read this excerpt from obama’s debate with mccain in Aug 08.”To succeed in Afghanistan, we also need to fundamentally rethink our Pakistan policy. For years, we have supported stability over democracy in Pakistan, and gotten neither. The core leadership of al Qaeda has a safe-haven in Pakistan. The Taliban are able to strike inside Afghanistan and then return to the mountains of the Pakistani border. Throughout Pakistan, domestic unrest has been rising. The full democratic aspirations of the Pakistani people have been too long denied. A child growing up in Pakistan, more often than not, is taught to see America as a source of hate – not hope. We cannot tolerate a sanctuary for terrorists who threaten America’s homeland and Pakistan’s stability. If we have actionable intelligence about high-level al Qaeda targets in Pakistan’s border region, we must act if Pakistan will not or cannot”.

     I will tell you, change your attitude towards the world otherwise the whole world will have to force a change on you. You cannot live in isolation. If you can, then go to another planet and let the people of this planet live peacefully. This world doesn’t need Pakistan. You people are good for nothing.

290. # VK on 16 Jan 2009 at 10:11 pm

     It’s funny when Monis says that muslims are famous…..You are right monis, muslims are famous across the world. Here is a list of some of the most popular muslims:

     Osama Bin Laden
     Khalid Sheikh Mohammed
     Dawood Ibrahim
     Maulana Masood Azhar
     Mohd. Atta
     Ramzi Yousuf
     Saddam Hussain
     Ayman Al Zawhari
     Baitulah Masood
     Ajmal Amir Kasab
     AQ Khan
     Pervez Musharraf

     This list can go on and on. And if you go by the list, most of these famous muslim personalities have pakistani ties. You people prefer guns over education. Your kids are being taught to fight against India, Israel and other Western Countries. You know you cannot afford to go into war with another nation and that’s why you do these acts of terrorism by running, hiding and killing innocent people. If you think what you people are doing for religion is right and if you are true sons of your mother, then come and have a full scale war with our country. If you think running around with reifle, throwing grenades at a public place, killing innocent people is an act of strength then that’s a complete bull shit. I am sorry to say but that is not an act of humanity and i don’t think that your religion teaches you that. These are the self made preachings by your radical mullahs and you people are following their preachings in the name of islam. Shame on you…..

291. # Punjabi Soldier on 16 Jan 2009 at 10:55 pm

     Monis i am a Proud INDIAN first then a sikh but for muslims its religion first as per quran so they can never be faithful.If u think we mistreat them then why didnt they leave India when they had time.We should treat them just like we are treated in muslim countries in arab we cant even practice or speak about our religion so why should they.In quran it clearly tells you how to hate infedels /non believers means us.It even tells you not to be friends with us.So u r just following a book that is full of hate..Did you ever wondered why all muslim nations are way behind in technology its because they follow quran which was written 1400 years ago but unlike other religions you cant use common sense because mohammad said u cant question his word.I know there are a lot of problems in INDIA but we are fixing them thats the fun part of Democracy.Also u r threatning that you gonna do something to me so here is something tell me one instance where a SIKH ran away from a muslim..google it.Man we were born to kill you…You cant touch India as long as we are alive to protect our Hindu brothers.I openly challenge you to find any thing negative in Holy Vedas or Guru Granth Sahib that says dont respect other religions or to forcefully convert or kill non believers.You dont know India we are silent killers you ,your media and your public can live in a myth that you will defeat India …You are like vultures who prey on weak..We are like eagles who kill for their prey we sit quitely and then pounce with 100% success.Thats the difference between India and pakistan.We gave you a piece of our Mother Land but you still doing terrorist activity in Mother Land..A few verses (suras) of quran for your knowledge that tells you to kill pagans(Idol Worshipers):-
     Qur’an 8:55 Surely the vilest of animals in Allah’s sight are those who disbelieve.

     Qur’an 22:19-22 “fight and slay the Pagans, seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem” “for them (the unbelievers) garments of fire shall be cut and there shall be poured over their heads boiling water whereby whatever is in their bowels and skin shall be dissolved and they will be punished with hooked iron rods”

     Qur’an 48:13 Those who “believe not in Allah and His Messenger, He has prepared, for those who reject Allah, a Blazing Fire!”

     Qur’an 3:54 “‘Lord, we believe in Your revelations (the Torah and Gospels) and follow this Apostle (Jesus). Enroll us among the witnesses.’ But the Christians contrived a plot and Allah did the same; but Allah’s plot was the best.”

     Qur’an 8:12 “Your Lord inspired the angels with the message: ‘I will terrorize the unbelievers. Therefore smite them on their necks and every joint and incapacitate them. Strike off their heads and cut off each of their fingers and toes.”

     Qur’an 8:58 “If you apprehend treachery from any group on the part of a people (with whom you have a treaty), retaliate by breaking off (relations) with them. The infidels should not think they can bypass (Islamic law or the punishment of Allah). Surely they cannot escape.”

     Qur’an 8:7 “Allah wished to confirm the truth by His words: ‘Wipe the infidels (non-Muslims) out to the last.’”

     Qur’an 8:39 “So, fight them till all opposition ends and the only religion is Islam.”
     so my dear pakistani please prove me wrong

292. # nofal on 16 Jan 2009 at 11:15 pm

     @VK

     Muslims are famous you just have a blind eye towards them and the list above are either a figment of the west’s imagination or India’s imagination and AQ Khan did nothing wrong.

     too many people (mostly Indians) are giving their opinion, being sarcastic, making jokes like immature silly kids who don’t know what a discussion is of Pakistan and showing and spreading the hate please stay on topic (India pakistan military strength) this page is useless if your just to share your opinion. please stay on topic.

     @ all

     terrorists are bad, evil, stupid and useless but al-qaeda is a terrorist group so much as the Indian army and Israel slaughtering Muslims in Gaza strip, Palestine and Kashmir and don’t go deneing it because it’s the truth and the slaughter continues.

     Pakistan are providing lots of support for terrorists so much that they have killed near about 5,000, some western countries especially bush’s government don’t realise the situation in Pakistan and realise that terrorists seek shelter in Pakistan because NATO and the US have full control of their area and if anyone thinks Pakistan hasn’t done enough either they hate pakistan or they have a censored media along with a blind eye to the truth.

     @Aby

     This site is really good and i love leaving my comments here and i think you are doing a good job of it.

293. # Punjabi Soldier on 16 Jan 2009 at 11:16 pm

     Monis all the shit we Indians including your fore fathers went thru read this you are one of us come back dont follow this evil religion …How islam was spread in INDIA:-
     The world famous historian, Will Durant has written in his Story of Civilisation that “the Mohammedan conquest of India was probably the bloodiest story in history”.
     India before the advent of Islamic imperialism was not exactly a zone of peace. There were plenty of wars fought by Hindu princes. But in all their wars, the Hindus had observed some time-honoured conventions sanctioned by the Sastras. The Brahmins and the Bhikshus were never molested. The cows were never killed. The temples were never touched. The chastity of women was never violated. The non-combatants were never killed or captured. A human habitation was never attacked unless it was a fort. The civil population was never plundered. War booty was an unknown item in the calculations of conquerors. The martial classes who clashed, mostly in open spaces, had a code of honor. Sacrifice of honor for victory or material gain was deemed as worse than death.

     Islamic imperialism came with a different code–the Sunnah of the Prophet. It required its warriors to fall upon the helpless civil population after a decisive victory had been won on the battlefield. It required them to sack and burn down villages and towns after the defenders had died fighting or had fled. The cows, the Brahmins, and the Bhikshus invited their special attention in mass murders of non-combatants. The temples and monasteries were their special targets in an orgy of pillage and arson. Those whom they did not kill, they captured and sold as slaves. The magnitude of the booty looted even from the bodies of the dead, was a measure of the success of a military mission. And they did all this as mujahids (holy warriors) and ghazls (kafir-killers) in the service of Allah and his Last Prophet.

     Hindus found it very hard to understand the psychology of this new invader. For the first time in their history, Hindus were witnessing a scene which was described by Kanhadade Prabandha (1456 AD) in the following words:

     “The conquering army burnt villages, devastated the land, plundered people’s wealth, took Brahmins and children and women of all classes captive, flogged with thongs of raw hide, carried a moving prison with it, and converted the prisoners into obsequious Turks.”

     That was written in remembrance of Alauddin Khalji’s invasion of Gujarat in the year l298 AD. But the gruesome game had started three centuries earlier when Mahmud Ghaznavi had vowed to invade India every year in order to destroy idolatry, kill the kafirs, capture prisoners of war, and plunder vast wealth for which India was well-known.

     MAHMUD AND MASOOD GHAZNAVI

     In 1000 AD Mahmud defeated Raja Jaipal, a scion of the Hindu Shahiya dynasty of Kabul. This dynasty had been for long the doorkeeper of India in the Northwest. Mahmud collected 250,000 dinars as indemnity. That perhaps was normal business of an empire builder. But in 1004 AD he stormed Bhatiya and plundered the place. He stayed there for some time to convert the Hindus to Islam with the help of mullahs he had brought with him.

     In 1008 AD he captured Nagarkot (Kangra). The loot amounted to 70,000,000 dirhams in coins and 700,400 mans of gold and silver, besides plenty of precious stones and embroidered cloths. In 1011 AD he plundered Thanesar which was undefended, destroyed many temples, and broke a large number of idols. The chief idol, that of Chakraswamin, was taken to Ghazni and thrown into the public square for defilement under the feet of the faithful. According to Tarikh-i-Yamini of Utbi, Mahmud’s secretary,

     “The blood of the infidels flowed so copiously [at Thanesar] that the stream was discolored, notwithstanding its purity, and people were unable to drink it. The Sultan returned with plunder which is impossible to count. Praise he to Allah for the honor he bestows on Islam and Muslims.”

     In 1013 AD Mahmud advanced against Nandana where the Shahiya king, Anandapal, had established his new capital. The Hindus fought very hard but lost. Again, the temples were destroyed, and innocent citizens slaughtered. Utbi provides an account of the plunder and the prisoners of war:

     “The Sultan returned in the rear of immense booty, and slaves were so plentiful that they became very cheap and men of respectability in their native land were degraded by becoming slaves of common shopkeepers. But this is the goodness of Allah, who bestows honor on his own religion and degrades infidelity.”

     The road was now clear for an assault on the heartland of Hindustan. In December 1018 AD Mahmud crossed the Yamuna, collected 1,000,000 dirhams from Baran (Bulandshahar), and marched to Mahaban in Mathura district. Utbi records:

     “The infidels…deserted the fort and tried to cross the foaming river…but many of them were slain, taken or drowned… Nearly fifty thousand men were killed.”

     Mathura was the next victim. Mahmud seized five gold idols weighing 89,300 missals and 200 silver idols. According to Utbi, “The Sultan gave orders that all the temples should be burnt with naptha and fire, and levelled with the ground.” The pillage of the city continued for 20 days. Mahmud now turned towards Kanauj which had been the seat of several Hindu dynasties. Utbi continues: “In Kanauj there were nearly ten thousand temples… Many of the inhabitants of the place fled in consequence of witnessing the fate of their deaf and dumb idols. Those who did not fly were put to death. The Sultan gave his soldiers leave to plunder and take prisoners.”

     The Brahmins of Munj, which was attacked next, fought to the last man after throwing their wives and children into fire. The fate of Asi was sealed when its ruler took fright and fled. According to Utbi, “…. the Sultan ordered that his five forts should be demolished from their foundations, the inhabitants buried in their ruins, and the soldiers of the garrison plundered, slain and captured”.

     Shrawa, the next important place to be invaded, met the same fate. Utbi concludes:

     “The Muslims paid no regard to the booty till they had satiated themselves with the slaughter of the infidels and worshipers of sun and fire. The friends of Allah searched the bodies of the slain for three days in order to obtain booty…The booty amounted in gold and silver, rubies and pearls nearly to three hundred thousand dirhams, and the number of prisoners may be conceived from the fact that each was sold for two to ten dirhams. These were afterwards taken to Ghazni and merchants came from distant cities to purchase them, so that the countries of Mawaraun-Nahr, Iraq and Khurasan were filled with them, and the fair and the dark, the rich and the poor, were commingled in one common slavery.”

     Mahmud’s sack of Somnath is too well-known to be retold here. What needs emphasizing is that the fragments of the famous Sivalinga were carried to Ghazni. Some of them were turned into steps of the Jama Masjid in that city. The rest were sent to Mecca, Medina, and Baghdad to be desecrated in the same manner.

     Mahmud’s son Masud tried to follow in the footsteps of his father. In 1037 AD he succeeded in sacking the fort of Hansi which was defended very bravely by the Hindus. The Tarikh-us-Subuktigin records: “The Brahmins and other high ranking men were slain, and their women and children were carried away captive, and all the treasure which was found was distributed among the army.”

     Masud could not repeat the performance due to his preoccupations elsewhere.

     MUHAMMAD GHORI AND HIS LEUTENANTS

     Invasion of India by Islamic imperialism was renewed by Muhmmad Ghori in the last quarter of the 12th century. After Prithiviraj Chauhan had been defeated in 1192 AD, Ghori took Ajmer by assault.

     According the Taj-ul-Ma’sir of Hasan Nizami, “While the Sultan remained at Ajmer, he destroyed the pillars and foundations of the idol temples and built in their stead mosques and colleges and precepts of Islam, and the customs of the law were divulged and established.”

     Next year he defeated Jayachandra of Kanauj. A general massacre, rapine, and pillage followed. The Gahadvad treasuries at Asni and Varanasi were plundered. Hasan Nizami rejoices that “in Benares which is the centre of the country of Hind, they destroyed one thousand temples and raised mosques on their foundations”.

     According to Kamil-ut-Tawarikh of Ibn Asir, “The slaughter of Hindus (at Varanasi) was immense; none were spared except women and children, and the carnage of men went on until the earth was weary.”

     The women and children were spared so that they could be enslaved and sold all over the Islamic world. It may be added that the Buddhist complex at Sarnath was sacked at this time, and the Bhikshus were slaughtered.

     Ghori’s lieutenant Qutbuddin Aibak was also busy meanwhile. Hasan Nizami writes that after the suppression of a Hindu revolt at Kol (modern day Aligarh) in 1193 AD, Aibak raised “three bastions as high as heaven with their heads, and their carcases became food for beasts of prey. The tract was freed from idols and idol worship and the foundations of infidelism were destroyed.”

     In 1194 AD Aibak destroyed 27 Hindu temples at Delhi and built the Quwwat-ul-lslam mosque with their debris. According to Nizami, Aibak “adorned it with the stones and gold obtained from the temples which had been demolished by elephants”.

     In 1195 AD the Mher tribe of Ajmer rose in revolt, and the Chaulukyas of Gujarat came to their assistance. Aibak had to invite reinforcements from Ghazni before he could meet the challenge. In 1196 AD he advanced against Anahilwar Patan, the capital of Gujarat. Nizami writes that after Raja Karan was defeated and forced to flee, “fifty thousand infidels were dispatched to hell by the sword” and “more than twenty thousand slaves, and cattle beyond all calculation fell into the hands of the victors”.

     The city was sacked, its temples demolished, and its palaces plundered. On his return to Ajmer, Aibak destroyed the Sanskrit College of Visaladeva, and laid the foundations of a mosque which came to be known as ‘Adhai Din ka Jhompada’.

     Conquest of Kalinjar in 1202 AD was Aibak’s crowning achievement. Nizami concludes: “The temples were converted into mosques… Fifty thousand men came under the collar of slavery and the plain became black as pitch with Hindus.”

     A free-lance adventurer, Muhammad Bakhtyar Khalji, was moving further east. In 1200 AD he sacked the undefended university town of Odantpuri in Bihar and massacred the Buddhist monks in the monasteries. In 1202 AD he took Nadiya by surprise. Badauni records in his Muntakhab-ut-Tawarikh that “property and booty beyond computation fell into the hands of the Muslims and Muhammad Bakhtyar having destroyed the places of worship and idol temples of the infidels founded mosques and Khanqahs”.

     THE SLAVE (MAMLUK) SULTANS

     Shamsuddin Iltutmish who succeeded Aibak at Delhi invaded Malwa in 1234 AD. He destroyed an ancient temple at Vidisha. Badauni reports in his ‘Muntakhab-ut-Tawarikh’:

     “Having destroyed the idol temple of Ujjain which had been built six hundred years previously, and was called Mahakal, he levelled it to its foundations, and threw down the image of Rai Vikramajit from whom the Hindus reckon their era, and brought certain images of cast molten brass and placed them on the ground in front of the doors of mosques of old Delhi, and ordered the people of trample them under foot.”

     Muslim power in India suffered a serious setback after Iltutmish. Balkan had to battle against a revival of Hindu power. The Katehar Rajputs of what came to be known as Rohilkhand in later history, had so far refused to submit to Islamic imperialism. Balkan led an expedition across the Ganges in 1254 AD. According to Badauni,

     “In two days after leaving Delhi, he arrived in the midst of the territory of Katihar and put to death every male, even those of eight years of age, and bound the women.”

     But in spite of such wanton cruelty, Muslim power continued to decline till the Khaljis revived it after 1290 AD.

     THE KHALJIS

     Jalaluddin Khalji led an expedition to Ranthambhor in 1291 AD. On the way he destroyed Hindu temples at Chain. The broken idols were sent to Delhi to be spread before the gates of the Jama Masjid. His nephew Alauddin led an expedition to Vidisha in 1292 AD. According to Badauni in Muntakhab-ut-Tawarikh, Alauddin “brought much booty to the Sultan and the idol which was the object of worship of the Hindus, he caused to be cast in front of the Badaun gate to be trampled upon by the people. The services of Alauddin were highly appreciated, the jagir of Oudh (or Avadh - Central U.P.) also was added to his other estates.”

     Alauddin became Sultan in 1296 AD after murdering his uncle and father-in-law, Jalaluddin. In 1298 AD he equipped an expedition to Gujarat under his generals Ulugh Khan and Nusrat Khan. The invaders plundered the ports of Surat and Cambay. The temple of Somnath, which had been rebuilt by the Hindus, was plundered and the idol taken to Delhi for being trodden upon by the Muslims. The whole region was subjected to fire and sword, and Hindus were slaughtered en masse. Kampala Devi, the queen of Gujarat, was captured along with the royal treasury, brought to Delhi and forced into Alauddin’s harem. The doings of the Malik Naib during his expedition to South India in 1310-1311 AD have already mentioned in earlier parts.

     THE TUGHLAQS

     Muslim power again suffered a setback after the death of Alauddin Khalji in 1316 AD. But it was soon revived by the Tughlaqs. By now most of the famous temples over the length and breadth of the Islamic occupation in India had been demolished, except in Orissa and Rajasthan which had retained their independence. By now most of the rich treasuries had been plundered and shared between the Islamic state and its swordsmen. Firuz Shah Tughlaq led an expedition to Orissa in 1360 AD. He destroyed the temple of Jagannath at Puri, and desecrated many other Hindu shrines. According to ‘Sirat-i-Firoz Shahi’ which he himself wrote or dictated,

     “Allah who is the only true God and has no other emanation, endowed the king of Islam with the strength to destroy this ancient shrine on the eastern sea-coast and to plunge it into the sea, and after its destruction he ordered the image of Jagannath to be perforated, and disgraced it by casting it down on the ground. They dug out other idols which were worshipped by the polytheists in the kingdom of Jajnagar and overthrew them as they did the image of Jagannath, for being laid in front of the mosques along the path of the Sunnis and the way of the ‘musallis’ (Muslim congregation for namaz) and stretched them in front of the portals of every mosque, so that the body and sides of the images might be trampled at the time of ascent and descent, entrance and exit, by the shoes on the feet of the Muslims.”

     After the sack of the temples in Orissa, Firoz Shah Tughlaq attacked an island on the sea-coast where “nearly 100,000 men of Jajnagar had taken refuge with their women, children, kinsmen and relations”. The swordsmen of Islam turned “the island into a basin of blood by the massacre of the unbelievers”.

     A worse fate overtook the Hindu women. Sirat-i-Firuz Shahs records: “Women with babies and pregnant ladies were haltered, manacled, fettered and enchained, and pressed as slaves into service in the house of every soldier.”

     Still more horrible scenes were enacted by Firuz Shah Tughlaq at Nagarkot (Kangra) where he sacked the shrine of Jvalamukhi. Firishta records that the Sultan “broke the idols of Jvalamukhi, mixed their fragments with the flesh of cows and hung them in nose bags round the necks of Brahmins. He sent the principal idol as trophy to Medina.”

     THE PROVINCIAL MUSLIM SATRAPS

     In 1931 AD the Muslims of Gujarat complained to Nasiruddin Muhammad, the Tughlaq Sultan of Delhi, that the local governor, Kurhat-ul-Mulk, was practising tolerance towards the Hindus. The Sultan immediately appointed Muzzaffar Khan as the new Governor. He became independent after the death of the Delhi Sultan and assumed the title of Muzzaffar Shah in 1392 AD. Next year he led an expidition to Somnath and sacked the temple which the Hindus had built once again. He killed many Hindus to chastise them for this “impudence,” and raised a mosque on the site of the ancient temple. The Hindus, however, restarted restoring the temple soon after. In 1401 AD Muzaffar came back with a huge army. He again killed many Hindus, demolished the temple once more, and erected another mosque.

     Muzaffar was succeeded by his grandson, Ahmad Shah, in 1411 AD. Three years later Ahmad appointed a special darogah to destroy all temples throughout Gujarat. In 1415 AD Ahmad invaded Sidhpur where he destroyed the images in Rudramahalaya, and converted the grand temple into a mosque. Sidhpur was renamed Sayyadpur.

     Mahmud Begrha who became the Sultan of Gujarat in 1458 AD was the worst fanatic of this dynasty. One of his vassals was the Mandalika of Junagadh who had never withheld the regular tribute. Yet in 1469 AD Mahmud invaded Junagadh. In reply to the Mandalika’s protests, Mahmud said that he was not interested in money as much as in the spread of Islam. The Mandalika was forcibly converted to Islam and Junagadh was renamed Mustafabad. In 1472 AD Mahmud attacked Dwarka, destroyed the local temples, and plundered the city. Raja Jaya Singh, the ruler of Champaner, and his minister were murdered by Mahmud in cold blood for refusing to embrace Islam after they had been defeated and their country pillaged and plundered. Champaner was renamed Mahmudabad.

     Mahmud Khalji of Malwa (1436-69 AD) also destroyed Hindu temples and built mosques on their sites. He heaped many more insults on the Hindus. Ilyas Shah of Bengal (1339-1379 AD) invaded Nepal and destroyed the temple of Svayambhunath at Kathmandu. He also invaded Orissa, demolished many temples, and plundered many places. The Bahmani sultans of Gulbarga and Bidar considered it meritorious to kill a hundred thousand Hindu men, women, and children every year. They demolished and desecrated temples all over South India.

     AMlR TIMUR

     The climax came during the invasion of Timur in 1399 AD. He starts by quoting the Quran in his Tuzk-i-Timuri: “O Prophet, make war upon the infidels and unbelievers, and treat them severely.”

     He continues: “My great object in invading Hindustan had been to wage a religious war against the infidel Hindus…[so that] the army of Islam might gain something by plundering the wealth and valuables of the Hindus.” To start with he stormed the fort of Kator on the border of Kashmir. He ordered his soldiers “to kill all the men, to make prisoners of women and children, and to plunder and lay waste all their property”. Next, he “directed towers to be built on the mountain of the skulls of those obstinate unbelievers”. Soon after, he laid siege to Bhatnir defended by Rajputs. They surrendered after some fight, and were pardoned. But Islam did not bind Timur to keep his word given to the “unbelievers”. His Tuzk-i-Timuri records:

     “In a short space of time all the people in the fort were put to the sword, and in the course of one hour the heads of 10,000 infidels were cut off. The sword of Islam was washed in the blood of the infidels, and all the goods and effects, the treasure and the grain which for many a long year had been stored in the fort became the spoil of my soldiers. They set fire to the houses and reduced them to ashes, and they razed the buildings and the fort to the ground.”

     At Sarsuti, the next city to be sacked, “all these infidel Hindus were slain, their wives and children were made prisoners and their property and goods became the spoil of the victors”. Timur was now moving through (modern day) Haryana, the land of the Jats. He directed his soldiers to “plunder and destroy and kill every one whom they met”. And so the soldiers “plundered every village, killed the men, and carried a number of Hindu prisoners, both male and female”.

     Loni which was captured before he arrived at Delhi was predominantly a Hindu town. But some Muslim inhabitants were also taken prisoners. Timur ordered that “the Musulman prisoners should be separated and saved, but the infidels should all be dispatched to hell with the proselytizing sword”.

     By now Timur had captured 100,000 Hindus. As he prepared for battle against the Tughlaq army after crossing the Yamuna, his Amirs advised him “that on the great day of battle these 100,000 prisoners could not be left with the baggage, and that it would be entirely opposed to the rules of war to set these idolators and enemies of Islam at liberty”. Therefore, “no other course remained but that of making them all food for the sword”.

     Tuzk-i-Timuri continues:

     “I proclaimed throughout the camp that every man who had infidel prisoners should put them to death, and whoever neglected to do so should himself be executed and his property given to the informer. When this order became known to the ghazis of Islam, they drew their swords and put their prisoners to death. One hundred thousand infidels, impious idolators, were on that day slain. Maulana Nasiruddin Umar, a counselor and man of learning, who, in all his life, had never killed a sparrow, now, in execution of my order, slew with his sword fifteen idolatrous Hindus, who were his captives.”

     The Tughlaq army was defeated in the battle that ensued next day. Timur entered Delhi and learnt that a “great number of Hindus with their wives and children, and goods and valuables, had come into the city from all the country round”.

     He directed his soldiers to seize these Hindus and their property. Tuzk-i-Timuri concludes:

     “Many of them (Hindus) drew their swords and resisted…The flames of strife were thus lighted and spread through the whole city from Jahanpanah and Siri to Old Delhi, burning up all it reached. The Hindus set fire to their houses with their own hands, burned their wives and children in them and rushed into the fight and were killed…On that day, Thursday, and all the night of Friday, nearly 15,000 Turks were engaged in slaying, plundering and destroying. When morning broke on Friday, all my army …went off to the city and thought of nothing but killing, plundering and making prisoners….The following day, Saturday the 17th, all passed in the same way, and the spoil was so great.that each man secured from fifty to a hundred prisoners, men, women, and children. There was no man who took less than twenty. The other booty was immense in rubies, diamonds, garnets, pearls, and other gems and jewels; ashrafis, tankas of gold and silver of the celebrated Alai coinage: vessels of gold and silver; and brocades and silks of great value. Gold and silver ornaments of Hindu women were obtained in such quantities as to exceed all account. Excepting the quarter of the Saiyids, the Ulama and the other Musulmans, the whole city was sacked.”

294. # nofal on 16 Jan 2009 at 11:30 pm

     @Punjabi Soldier

     so racist i don’t think such racial hate and discrimination should not be allowed.

     what would you know about Islam i can say lots of things about other religions but i choose not to and has anybody ever thought that maybe terrorist fight for freedom and equality because for years of watching their brothers and sisters burn around the world (Bosnia, Israel 24/7, and IOK) and hate against powerful western nations for not even trying to stop and in some cases encouraging the massacre and then crying over minor attacks and launching war on terror which been raging on and if you do not believe Muslims are fighting for freedom then here is some proof, Osama Bin Laden quiet until he saw innocent blood being poured over the streets of Gaza like rain.
     and in India a modern process of what Muslims allegedly done, Hindus are doing in India today.

295. # Punjabi Soldier on 17 Jan 2009 at 12:23 am

     Monis stop crying here is an honest evaluation of India as well as pakistan military:-
     Manpower and Ground Forces

     India has the second largest manpower in its military globally - at 3,773,300 personnel (2005), next only to China. Pakistan has a much smaller manpower of 1,449,000 personnel which is proportionally higher than India in terms of their population ratios. Pakistan’s ground forces are equipped with American or Chinese weapons like FIM 92 Stinger SAMs, BGM-71 TOW anti-tank missiles, T-82 tanks and other equipments. Indian ground forces are equipped mostly by home-made or Soviet technologies like IR guided 9K35 Strela-10 SAMs, 3rd Gen IR guided Nag anti-tank missiles, UAVs and a large inventory of tanks and support vehicles. In terms of numbers and equipments, both Indian and Pakistani ground forces are on an closely equal footing.

     Comparison of Air Forces

     As of 2006, Indian Air Force (IAF) has over 170,000 personnel and 3,382 aircrafts of which 1,330 are combat aircraft operating off 61 airbases - making it the fourth largest air force in the world. India’s strike fighters consist of Russian and French aircraft like Mikoyan MiG-29, Dassault Mirage 2000, Sukhoi Su-30 - the last one developed under dual licensing by HAL, India’s aerospace industry in Bangalore. In addition to these, India’s air force owns ground attack aircraft, reconnaissance aircraft, UAVs and support helicopters - a majority of them either of Soviet or French origin. Pakistan Air Force (PAF) has about 530 combat aircraft and over 65,000 active personnel, operating out of 9 airbases. Its strike fighters consist of US, Chinese and French fighters like F-16 Fighting Falcon, JF-17 Thunder and Dassault Mirage ROSE-III. It also has transport aircraft like Lockheed Martin C-130 and Airbus A310, however there are no UAVs or reconnaissance aircraft in the Pakistani Air Force.

     Naval and Sea Based Forces

     After the overwhelming losses in the 1971 war against India, Pakistan rapidly increased the size of its naval fleet which doubled in the 1980s after a massive 3.2 billion dollar military and economic aid by US President Ronald Reagan. At present, Pakistan’s navy owns over 45 vessels , most of them of US or European origin which include submarines, destroyers, frigates, patrol and mine warfare boats. It operates from its sole naval port in Karachi and naval facilities in UK, USA and France. It had recently been involved in various humanitarian operations during the 2005 Tsunami in South East Asia. Indian Navy on the other hand, is a three dimensional naval force consisting of missile-capable warships, an aircraft carrier, mine sweepers and a host of marine aircrafts; most of its warships indigenously built in its own dockyards. The navy operates from its major naval bases in Visakhapatnam, Mumbai, Goa and the Andaman Islands. Indian Navy has significant capabilities of being a true blue water Navy and is experienced both in war and peacekeeping operations in the Indian Ocean.

     The Nuclear Club

     India tested a nuclear bomb in 1974 using materials from Canada and technical help from Soviet Union. However the embargo in heavy water export from Canada after the test stalled India’s nuclear ambitions till 1998, when it shocked the world by conducting five nuclear detonations termed as Shakti tests. The highest yield was by a 48 kiloton staged fusion device, which India claimed was a thermonuclear bomb but seismic data on the tests proved otherwise. In the same year 1998, Pakistan conducted a series of six nuclear detonations in a test termed as Chagai. The highest yield was reported to be about 25 kiloton from a two stage boosted device. At present Pakistan’s nuclear stockpile is slated to be around 30-40 warheads while India possesses 70-100 warheads. The nuclearisation of India and Pakistan became a turning point in the history of conflicts between these two countries with high tensions but no war, not very much unlike the US vs USSR Cold War.

     Ballistic and Cruise Missile Proliferation

     In the nuclear delivery front, both India and Pakistan have a series of ballistic and cruise missiles in addition to ground attack aircraft. The maximum range among India’s operational ballistic missiles is 2000 km achieved by Agni-2. India’s Agni ballistic missiles are indigenously developed by its own missile defence industry known as IGMDP. The maximum range among Pakistan’s missiles is by Hatf V Gauri which is reported to do over 2200 kms. Pakistan’s Hatf missiles are based on North Korean No-Dong series of IRBMs. Both Pakistan’s Hatf and India’s Agni ballistic missiles are nuclear capable. India has also developed a supersonic cruise missile BrahMos which is by far the fastest cruise missile at Mach 2.6 and maximum range of 290 km. It is reported to be nuclear capable but it is not confirmed yet. On the Pakistan side, its Babur cruise missile has a reported range of 700 km and a maximum speed of 880 km/h (Mach 0.7). As with India BrahMos, Babur is also reported to be nuclear capable but there is no confirmation yet.

     The Final Verdict

     Both Pakistan and India are almost evenly matched head to head in nuclear and missile fronts, however India has strategic and technological superiority over the conventional forces of Pakistan. Indian Navy is larger in fleet and personnel size with a more varied range of ships including an aircraft carrier while Pakistan’s Navy is smaller and has no aircraft carriers. Indian’s IAF is equipped with highly capable fighters like 4.5th generation Su-30s and 4th gen Mirage 2000s which are technologically superior to Pakistan PAF’s F-16s and Mirage IIIs. Additionally Indian pilots are better trained and more capable in air combat than Pakistani forces as was demonstrated by its various wars with Pakistan or joint exercises with US and UK. In the area of conventional ground forces both the Indian as well as Pakistani Army is well equipped and highly trained to survive in extremities of topography and climate in combat conditions, like wars in the high Himalayas.

     If a purely conventional war were to take place between both these countries, India will overpower Pakistan very easily owing to its superior military technology and infrastructure, larger manpower, more territorial area and a strategic advantage in its sea and air forces. It must also be noted that a war between these two countries will matter more than India’s conventional superiority as both these nations are nuclear powers on an equal deadlock. India has maintained a ‘no first use’ nuclear policy on the lines of a similar policy by China while Pakistan does not have any such policy, considering their only hope against India is in nuclear deterrence. It would be risky for India at the present scenario to go into any aggressive war against Pakistan as the repercussions would be serious a nuclear devastation for both countries especially Pakistan which will be totally wiped out.

296. # VK on 17 Jan 2009 at 2:04 am

     Nofal….so you are telling everyone that al-qaeda is an islamic army that is meant to protect the muslim world? Indian Army is a recognised body and it is a part of the armed forces of India.
     Don’t try to link Al-Qaeda (shit) to a recognised body like Indian or Israeli Army. Al-Qaeda is a bunch of cowards, idiots who are always running and hiding from getting killed by NATO and US Army. They think they are the messengers of allah which is again a bull shit. If they are a recognized army why don’t they come out openly and fight a war against the US, NATO and Indian Army? Why are they always on run?

     To your first point, I do agree that there are famous muslims and i can pick so many from India itself, AR Rahman, Shahrukh Khan, Amir Khan, Mohd. Rafi, Gulzar, Javed Akhtar, Dr. APJ Abdul Kalam etc. What do you mean “the list above is either a figment of the west’s imagination or India’s imagination”? Are you telling me that Kasab is innocent, or you think Osama is innocent? If that is the case why did it took so long for pakistan to accept Kasab? Why was Maulana Masood Azhar asked to be released in exchange of hostages of IC-814? They are all terrorist. You guys know it but you won’t accept it because they are your religious brothers. They should be hanged with their genitals chopped in the middle of the square.

     The whole world can’t be wrong about Al-Qeda, Osama, Pakistani sponsored terrorism. Just because these ass-holes are muslims, you people admire them. I have said it earlier and I will say it again, all the radical islamic millitants are bunch of idiots.

297. # Punjabi Soldier on 17 Jan 2009 at 5:50 am

     nofal Hindus are only doing what was done to them for the last 100o years or so..You reap what you sow.If if muslims hate India so much what r they still doing there we gave them pakistan and bangladesh .Most of the Hindus and Sikhs were murdered during the partition.We never asked for muslim brothers to stay in India.Our war is not with muslims or islam .We want peace the best way to do that is ask your brothers to leave India and move to an islamic country then there will be no issues and we will all leave peacefully in India .And you are free to do whatever you want in u r country no issues.If something is not done soon muslims in India will ask for islamistan…Wont do cant do.So all you pakistanis unless u stop messing with us we will go to the border and will pee in u r direction and pakistan will become peeistan

298. # Punjabi Soldier on 17 Jan 2009 at 5:52 am

     nofal Hindus are only doing what was done to them for the last 100o years or so..You reap what you sow.If if muslims hate India so much what r they still doing there we gave them pakistan and bangladesh .Most of the Hindus and Sikhs were murdered during the partition.We never asked for muslim brothers to stay in India.Our war is not with muslims or islam .We want peace the best way to do that is ask your brothers to leave India and move to an islamic country then there will be no issues and we will all leave peacefully in India .And you are free to do whatever you want in u r country no issues.If something is not done soon muslims in India will ask for islamistan…Wont do cant do.So all you pakistanis unless u stop messing with us we will go to the border and will pee in u r direction and pakistan will become peeistan.Also stop dreaming about Kashmir dont even look at that direction cause its not u rs doesnt belong to u.Doodh Maangoge to kheer denge Kashmir maangoge toh cheer deenge

299. # Monis on 17 Jan 2009 at 7:10 am

     @ punjabi soldier
     tu apnay piyo da puttar aye ya kisi khotay da…

300. # Monis on 17 Jan 2009 at 7:16 am

     @ punjabi soldier
     cum’on… oo teray 12 baj gaye kya sikh…….

301. # Monis on 17 Jan 2009 at 7:19 am

     @ punjabi soldier
     Teri maa di phuddi sikh

302. # VK on 17 Jan 2009 at 8:17 am

     Monis…finally you have proved who you are? Tum Pakistaniyon ne apni aukat dikha hi di….This only shows how frustrated you people are. I won’t balme you, it is not your fault. It is your upbringing, the environment that you live in that only teaches hatred, abuse, killing innocent people who don’t believe in your ideology. By abusing others you might be able to take out your frustration but you cannot change world’s opinion on pakistan. You are a failed nation. Now keep on abusing as much as you want cuz no one really cares about what you have to say. It’s been 60+ years since both India and Pakistan became independent, and since then both the countries have fought 3 wars on kashmir and in all 3 wars pakistan was badly beaten. It’s high time for pakistan to stop dreaming about kashmir and focus more on their internal problems. Kashmir is an integral part of India, and pakistan can never be strong enough to conquer that part of our mother land.

303. # NEEL on 17 Jan 2009 at 9:25 am

     by da way guys have something to say, actually i was wondering why Israel hate muslims and Islam and i got some facts out of it which so so interested,the first man in Islam name Abraham have 2 son name Isaac and Ismail. Isaac from the abraham’s real wife Sarah and the jews or Israeli are followers and son of Isaac while Ismail comes by the relation of Abraham with his Egyptian maidservant Hagar which became Muslim or Islam :)) now think the real peoples not muslims or Islamic they are out of maidservant :)) real are only Isaac’s followers we can call them Jews or Israeli.And yeh onemore thing how quaran came, and who is mohommad so called khalifa of islam.
     Islam was begun early in the 7th century by a man named Muhammad. He claimed to have been visited by the angel Gabriel. During these angelic visitations, which continued for about 23 years until Muhammad’s death, the angel purportedly revealed to Muhammad the words of God (called “Allah” in Arabic and by Muslims). These dictated revelations comprise the Qur’an, Islam’s holy book.Now Allah is not their god the name allah actually given to mohommad so called founder of quaran and who is the one who started this thing like if somebody not accept Islam do Jihad and any how by saying or by physical extortion convert them to Muslim and this is Jihad :D:d the man Mohhommad only the real start of these bloody terrorists. and he is the one who seperated Islams and muslims and made terrorists.

304. # Punjabi Soldier on 17 Jan 2009 at 10:45 am

     Hey monis u showed u r aukaat just like a typical porky who cant handle criticism .Regarding your threats because of you there is panic all over the world what else u want u should be happy.Teri maa di ___ .I can cuss too but wont be useful to do.Like i said threats dont mean anything show me one instance in History where a Sikh ran away scared of Muslims i am sure you tried but u couldnt find also i openly challanged you on this great blog to find anything hateful in Holy Vedas or Guru Granth Sahib.I am sure u tried but couldnt find it.so get back to work i can give you hundred of examples about the propoganda of hate quran is trying to spread and you cant even find me

305. # NEEL on 17 Jan 2009 at 2:20 pm

     @Punjabi Soldier
     are Punjabi chhodo unlogo ko Indians ke saath compare mat karo:)) there is no balance between India and paksiatn , the word imbalance will be better that time:))paki’s pahele achha bolte hai aur jab unko unki aukat pata chalti hai they start abusing on any forum:)) because logically they can’t prove pakistan superior than India so at last they have only one weapon that is their reality abusing language:))

306. # amit on 17 Jan 2009 at 2:31 pm

     monis why don’t you become a suicide bomber!!!!
     your frustration have exceeded the limits…

307. # aryan on 17 Jan 2009 at 4:32 pm

     Hey Monis

     Whatever u say to punjabi soldier or threaten him the fact is islam is the most violent religion where not only men but also women are taught violence.

     All of you are disgrace to the humanity. You guys need some of the likes of hitler to punish
     as what he did to jews.

308. # aryan on 17 Jan 2009 at 4:40 pm

     Amit

     Dont worry all muslims are destined to become terrorists because islam has told them so.

309. # nofal on 17 Jan 2009 at 7:47 pm

     is this a glitch because my last comment did not reach

310. # Nitin on 17 Jan 2009 at 7:50 pm

     monis
     dude ur frustrated .u need rest…take a break.Stay far from this forum for 2-3 days.And we right back!

311. # Punjabi Soldier on 17 Jan 2009 at 8:50 pm

     Monis main tey apne pyo da puttar hi haan par tu apne mame da putt hai since muslims screw their own sister .According to Science that porkies dont know much about when people has off spring by incest like muslims do they r retarded just like u r.I challanged u to find one thing in Holy Vedas or Gur Granth Sahib and i will accept my defeat.Show me one place where our religious books say kill non believers…..Agar apne mama ki aulaad hai then show it..U have been brainwashed by islamic cult.Challange is open.

312. # Punjabi Soldier on 17 Jan 2009 at 9:04 pm

     Monis compare your country to MINE:-
     Something about my Great Country India
     Read this and please tell me if it is worth debating or comparing India and pakistan?
     If yes please tell me in which sector pakistan can compete with India

     1>India Largest Democracy in the world-: Population: 1.1 Bn

     2>India 10th most industrialized country

     3>The world’s biggest back office

     4>Among world’s largest skilled workforce

     5>Largest english speaking nation by 2010

     6>800 movies made anuualy–bollywood overshadows hollywood

     7>6 Miss Universe / Miss world titles in last 10 years

     8>Low per capita income US $550 ; 26% live in poverty, literacy levels at 68%

     9>The Indian Diaspora
     38% of Doctors in AMerica are Indians
     36% of NASA scientists are Indians
     34% of Microsoft employees are Indians
     28% of IBM employeesare Indians
     17% of Intel employees are Indians
     13% of Zerox employees are Indians

     10>India will eventually become world’s third largest economy after China and the USA –Goldman Sachs

     11>India among fastest growing GDP’s in the world

     12>India’s GDP will exceed that of Italy in 2020, France in 2020, Germany in 2025 and Japan in 2035 — Goldman Sachs

     13>India’s Foreign exchange reserves history
     1990-91 $4 billion
     1995-96 $20 billion
     2001-02 $60 billion
     2002-03 $76 billion
     2003-04 $100 billion
     2004-05 close to $150 billion

     14>Indian Economy
     Robust growth of manufacturing, agriculture and services
     Low external debt
     250 Fortune 500 companies outsource IT work to India
     Increased disposable income, increased wealth
     Large emerging affluent middle class

     15>Indian Aviation
     Air deccan–1 st low cose domestic carrier
     Most international carriers now target India for network growth and profitability
     $5 bn capital infusion in govt owned carriers
     Airport privatization

     16>India will be the second fastest growing travel and tourism market over 2005-2014 at 8.8% — WTTC

     17> Size of indian tourism is 330 million as of 2004

     18>Indians going abroad as of 2004
     Singapore — 375,658
     Saudi Arabia — 373,636
     UAE — 336,046
     Kuwait — 293,621
     Thailand — 280,641
     Bahrain — 268,383
     USA — 257,271
     China — 213,611
     U.K — 205,065
     Hongkong — 193,705
     NewZealand — 16,862

     19> India growth projections
     1999 — 2.7%
     2000 — 3.4%
     2001 — 3.6%
     2002 — 4.2%
     2003 — 4.5%
     2004 — 5.9%
     2005 — 6.9%
     2006 — 8.0%
     2007 — 9.4%
     2008 — 11%
     2009 — 12.8%
     2010 — 15%

     20> Drivers of outbound growth
     Increased charter operations
     Upper middle income group will remain largest segment
     potential consumer pie will grow to 300 Mn
     Age group of 15 to 49 likely comprise 62%
     Self-employed who account for over 40% will emerge as
     high potential target market
     Holiday finance will become popular

     21> Over 50 million Indian’s will travel overseas by 2020 — WTO

     I WOULD LIKE TO ADD MORE! Q. Who is the co-founder of Sun Microsystems? A. Vinod Khosla Q. Who is the creator of Pentium chip (needs no introduction as 90% of the today’s computers run on it)? A. Vinod Dahm Q. Who is the third richest man on the world? A. According to the latest report on Fortune Magazine, it is Aziz Premji, who is the CEO of Wipro Industries. The Sultan of Brunei is at 6 th position now. Q. Who is the founder and creator of Hotmail (Hotmail is world’s No.1 web based email program)? A. Sabeer Bhatia Q. Who is the president of AT & T-Bell Labs (AT & T-Bell Labs is the creator of program languages such as C, C++, Unix to name a few)? A. Arun Netravalli Q. Who is the GM of Hewlett Packard? A. Rajiv Gupta Q. Who is the new MTD (Microsoft Testing Director) of Windows 2000, responsible to iron out all initial problems? A. Sanjay Tejwrika Q. Who are the Chief Executives of CitiBank, Mckensey & Stanchart? A. Victor Menezes, Rajat Gupta, and Rana Talwar. Q. We Indians are the wealthiest among all ethnic groups in America, even faring better than the whites and the natives. There are 3.22 millions of Indians in USA (1.5% of population). YET, 38% of doctors in USA are Indians. 12% scientists in USA are Indians. 36% of NASA scientists are Indians. 34% of Microsoft employees are Indians. 28% of IBM employees are Indians. 17% of INTEL scientists are Indians. 13% of XEROX employees are Indians. Some of the following facts may be known to you. These facts were recently published in a German magazine, which deals with WORLD HISTORY FACTS ABOUT INDIA. 1. India never invaded any country in her last 1000 years of history. 2. India invented the Number system. Zero was invented by Aryabhatta. 3. The world’s first University was established in Takshila in 700BC. More than 10,500 students from all over the world studied more than 60 subjects. The University of Nalanda built in the 4 th century BC was one of the greatest achievements of ancient India in the field of education. 4. According to the Forbes magazine, Sanskrit is the most suitable language for computer software. 5. Ayurveda is the earliest school of medicine known to humans. 6. Although western media portray modern images of India as poverty striken and underdeveloped through political corruption, India was once the richest empire on earth. 7. The art of navigation was born in the river Sindh 5000 years ago. The very word “Navigation” is derived from the Sanskrit word NAVGATIH. 8. The value of pi was first calculated by Budhayana, and he explained the concept of what is now known as the Pythagorean Theorem. British scholars have last year (1999) officially published that Budhayan’s works dates to the 6 th Century which is long before the European mathematicians. 9. Algebra, trigonometry and calculus came from India. Quadratic equations were by Sridharacharya in the 11 th Century; the largest numbers the Greeks and the Romans used were 106 whereas Indians used numbers as big as 1053. 10. According to the Gemmological Institute of America, up until 1896, India was the only source of diamonds to the world. 11. USA based IEEE has proved what has been a century-old suspicion amongst academics that the pioneer of wireless communication was Professor Jagdeesh Bose and not Marconi. 12. The earliest reservoir and dam for irrigation was built in Saurashtra. 13. Chess was invented in India. 14. Sushruta is the father of surgery. 2600 years ago he and health scientists of his time conducted surgeries like cesareans, cataract, fractures and urinary stones. Usage of anaesthesia was well known in ancient India. 15. When many cultures in the world were only nomadic forest dwellers over 5000 years ago, Indians established Harappan culture in Sindhu Valley (Indus Valley Civilisation). 16. The place value system, the decimal system was developed in India in 100 BC. Quotes about India. We owe a lot to the Indians, who taught us how to count, without which no worthwhile scientific discovery could have been made. Albert Einstein. India is the cradle of the human race, the birthplace of human speech, the mother of history, the grandmother of legend and the great grand mother of tradition. Mark Twain. If there is one place on the face of earth where all dreams of living men have found a home from the very earliest days when man began the dream of existence, it is India. French scholar Romain Rolland. India conquered and dominated China culturally for 20 centuries without ever having to send a single soldier across her border. Hu Shih (former Chinese ambassador to USA) ALL OF THE ABOVE IS JUST THE TIP OF THE ICEBERG, THE LIST COULD BE ENDLESS.

313. # NEEL on 18 Jan 2009 at 2:34 am

     hey hey hey guys leave this here, see Indians never said anything bad about any religions , so forget it , just leave it, these pakistani never understand this thing even u guys wasting your time . They will never understand this thing like India not against Islam or Muslims but we against Terrorist and their propaganda to convert non muslims in muslims by physical assertion ,and weapons. to understand Indians they need to understand Indians policy and India’s culture first and they ill not enough intelligent to study indian culture , they only read their quaran which edited by some terrorists and making these all muslims terrorists on name of allah and god.

314. # Well-Wisher on 18 Jan 2009 at 7:41 am

     @Punjabi Soldier
     Whatever I studied in history subject in my school, you put up all those true facts in this blog. Well done! You are Great and I appreciate for your hardwork to dig out all those historical facts.

     @all
     Even for a human being, a Father who is having numerous sons and some of them deny to accept him as their father. In this case, what will be a true father’s duty? He has to show more love, affection, and kindness on them and try to prove he is their father. Instead, Father is telling believing sons to kill all the non-believing sons, what will be the final result? The believing sons also later scared of their Father, and won’t expect love from a killing father and go away from him.

     If any religion is telling about killing its non-believers, which is truely insulting its own God.

315. # VK on 18 Jan 2009 at 9:13 am

     To all my Indian Brothers, it looks like we have won yet another battle against our failed neighbors. To me it looks like they cannot win this argument that their failed nation is no match to our great country. They have started losing their temper, have started using abusive language, they and their nation has been humilated thousands of time on this blog and across the world. Pakistan and it’s people cannot match the intelligence, the economic and military superiority of India. It’s pretty much evident from this blog that our pakistani counterparts cannot defend their lies about their ties with the terrorists. Mission Accomplished…..JAI HIND!

316. # Aryan on 18 Jan 2009 at 9:29 am

     Hey punjabi soldier

     It a waste of telling about our great country to those cheap pakistanis. They are cheap shots and they know nothing but violence as taught their holy book.

     Isn’t it totaly meaningless where they are allowed to eat calf, goat but not pig.

317. # Well-Wisher on 18 Jan 2009 at 12:19 pm

     @Punjabi Soldier
     All Pakistanis forefathers are Hindus and Indians. As you wrote all the facts that during the second millennium many Islamic tyrant king’s invaded and converted forcefully many Hindus to Muslims. These Pakistanis are offsprings of that converted people (the Muslim population in India as well). Nobody is there to teach them our ancient greatness. What all they know now are Quran and the hatred, nothing else.

318. # Well-Wisher on 18 Jan 2009 at 12:30 pm

     @Aryan

     Pigs & Dogs are lucky and got more grace from The Almighty God Allah. The other domestic aminmals somehow lesser grace and treated as human stomach filling stuffs by them. But in China, all domestic animals are unlucky (including pig & dog) , everything is considered as good food.

319. # Nofal on 18 Jan 2009 at 1:59 pm

     I challenge all you Indians to show me the evidence that Islam or the Quran shows people hate, violence, terrorism etc.

     You always talk about terrorism and Islam, because you guys have been Islamic scholars for how long.

     this page has become completely useless you might as well change it to hate comments against Islam!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

     Until you show solid evidence of Islam and terrorism please keep your comments as racists as they may be to your self.

     @Punjabi soldier

     you listed a lot of things about India all of which are positive. you forgot that India holds one of the worlds largest amount of people that live below the poverty line.and India would only have the greatest number of literate people because they have a huge population and even if a small percentage of people in India speak English it would still have one of the worlds largest.so the fact is that India doesn’t have a large HDI but it has dangerously large population.one more thing India has largest amount illiterate number of people in the world too.India is the worlds largest democracy because it has too many people and that is nothing to be proud of.

     Islam is not a violent religion it just has to protect itself from racists who hate Islam and don’t want it to exist

320. # Punjabi Soldier on 18 Jan 2009 at 3:21 pm

     Nofal i would lie to recommend u to read my earlier comments about hate in islam and read about my challenge…..

321. # Punjabi Soldier on 18 Jan 2009 at 3:21 pm

     Nofal i would like to recommend u to read my earlier comments about hate in islam and read about my challenge…..

322. # Aryan on 18 Jan 2009 at 5:59 pm

     Nofal

     Your statement indicates that you have to read quran a lot which teaches violence, rule of islam all over the world
     and complete eradication of human being who doesn’t believe or who is not willing to take up islam.

323. # Desiguy on 19 Jan 2009 at 1:01 am

     WHY Indian are comparing themselves to Pakistan?

     people we should compare ourselves to china and other develop countries.

324. # INDIAN on 19 Jan 2009 at 8:40 am

     @Aryan
     Mr. Aryan I completely vary with u.
     In India we lives as an Indian character not as Hindu, Muslims, or any of the other great religion. I personally a Muslim and a proud Indian think my country is bliss where our forefathers born and gave our motherland as tradition where all our people lives in peace and are united to work for our dream of becoming a world power. I don’t understand why some people tow Islam in between. India is a proud country with 2nd largest Muslim population in the world, even more than Pakistan Muslim population. I feel affection for India as much u does. I understand ur sentiments, I think we need to prove ourselves as a patriotic Indian like Sikhs proved them.
     Suggestion for Pakistanis.
     As there is a saying….
     The one, who try to throw others down, finally falls itself….
     There was no Pakistan during the freedom movement a nation with no history formed on the beams of abhorrence will fail for sure. Pakistan is going to have the same fate. It tried to balkanize India during all its existence. But now its own existence is threatened….

325. # pooja on 19 Jan 2009 at 10:28 am

     To all pakistanis,just to say one thing.
     first try to solve your countries matter and then thought about INDIA’S matter.and all the reports u r talking about ,comes just from pakistan.we also hear so much news about fights going between two groups in pakistan(i think there name is sia and sunni).but u know what we never read that news,beacause we have no interest in reading pakistan news.you are such a small country,all are from same religion then also NO UNITY.so dont talk about INDIA ,who is not only much bigger than u but also having a lot number of religion.first go and unite yourself.pakistan is surviving just from the money given as MENDICANCY from world bank and money given from US goverment since you are selling your motherland to them.so first safe your land and then talk about our land.also also u r having just 30% of kashmir.india is having maximum.and if next war starts then whole is ours

326. # amit on 19 Jan 2009 at 11:24 am

     one thing is for sure..pakistan cannot defeat India by conventional weapons..
     they will use nuclear weapons..then viceversa..ultimately pakistan wil be declared a nuclear fall out region and humanbeings will be prohibited to enter that country for some decades..

327. # amit on 19 Jan 2009 at 11:29 am

     hats off to u INDIAN…

328. # Monis on 19 Jan 2009 at 3:29 pm

     @ punjabi soldier
     I’m never impressed by your posts in which you copied data from here n there and really other Indians are far better than you in all manners. You know why I reply you or why I address you again and again because of your fake comments about Islam and the Holy Quran. Whatever you wrote in your previous comments about Islam and preaching of Islam and the Holy Quran is completely bogus. You don’t know even 1% about Islam because you don’t have your own research on Islam and you are depending upon the different sources which are against of Islam. Consciously or unconsciously you are doing the same work which is previously done by other non-believers and they all wiped out ignominy. Now, can you tell me your exact location? Your city, street exact postal address, phone no. etc etc. I want to give you a present. I hope you will never ever forget it.

     @ Animesh
     You think that you are smart but not enough you are still backing punjabi soldier but I don’t care. Whatever you, punjabi soldier and other are claiming, I really damn care. I know the one thing which is very much clear to me that you are never ever be our friends because you genetically hate us and don’t want our existence since the separation. Well! After reviewing all your posts after my last post on 17th of January 2009, I concluded that there are two kinds of people. The people belongs to the first kind have honor and dignity and they are brave heart. They do not compromise on their principals they will let down their lives but did not bear the humiliation. The second kind of the people believes on only one principal which is “Change the principal according to the situation”. They love only themselves. They are followers of “Might is Right”. I’m sorry to say most of the Indians including Sikhs, Hindus and Muslims are proudly belonging to the second kind of people.

     punjabi soldier I firmly believe on one thing that if I want to do any thing I can do it so my dear if I want to answer you via disgracing your Religious Scriptures I can do this. Please don’t think that I couldn’t dig out something embarrassed you which is not fake like you mentioned in your posts but all will be true.

329. # Monis on 19 Jan 2009 at 4:18 pm

     @ All Indians
     Just give me the answer of my one question. If India is such a big power as you all are claimed then why whole India is screaming like a weak child? I know because you can do nothing but shattering the propaganda that Pakistan is behind all your weaknesses, separation movements, dreadful politics, Killing of Muslims and Christians by Hindu Zionists organizations etc etc. if it is true that Pakistan is behind all them then why you did not step up to cut the root cause once and for all? Can you do this? The answer is NO. Because firstly you know very well that you are not such a big power as you claimed and secondly you are also acquainted that it is just because of your own wrong policies.

     So, all my dear Indians don’t try to fly over the sky, just keep it down other wise… everyone knows what happened with “The great USSR” unfortunately your ally. Russians were also thought that they are far better than illiterate Afghan, they are far Powerful than weaker Afghans as you think today about your self.

     @ MS. Pooja, Mr. Amit, Mr. Aryan, Mr. Vk, Mr. Desiguy and rest of all

     You all have complexed people, some have Inferiority complex and some have Superiority complex. Those people who have inferiority complex are abusing Islam/Muslims. Those who have superiority complex showing their muscles but both types of people are basically scared.

     @ Amit
     “one thing is for sure..pakistan cannot defeat India by conventional weapons..
     they will use nuclear weapons..then viceversa..ultimately pakistan wil be declared a nuclear fall out region and humanbeings will be prohibited to enter that country for some decades”.
     Hey Amit wow, what a sketch you drawn on Nuclear War. Why you did not join Bollywood as a story writer? what are you doing here? you are really a mama’s boy, go and play fun games.

330. # Punjabi Soldier on 19 Jan 2009 at 4:21 pm

     Monis my challenge still stand find me something hateful in Any of Holy Vedas or Gur Granth Sahab and i will accept defeat and will convert to a muslim .I swear that on my life.Now regarding my address unless u want to send your sister over as a present or what?
     Now one thing i would like to point out again is that u keep ignoring my earlier posts like all muslims do when they cant fight anymore .I challenged you a few times but u always ignore it??????All the things i wrote about islam or quran are facts i gave suras numbers with each reference.also i told you to prove one Historical Instance where a Sikh ran away from a Musllim??Also i expected you to try defend quran by proving me wrong regarding the hateful verses???? know y u r mad??Because you know that i am right …Also i gave u so many examples of hate in quran but you couldnt prove me wrong till now….mohammad screwed 9 year old aisha also his own daughter in law zainiab.Had sex with slaves and wives of people he conqured.He promise u guys 72 virgins and and ittle boys after death as a reward of u r so called holywar.Smart guy he knew sex sells……….If u r a real man prove me wrong

331. # Well-Wisher on 19 Jan 2009 at 4:49 pm

     @all
     We all no need to use nukes for any reason. Once the major powers like USA, USSR, CHINA are totally give up thier nukes, India also sure will remove all its idea about nuke making. Using nuke against any country is equivalent to against total humanity.

332. # Monis on 19 Jan 2009 at 5:03 pm

     Well just visit http://www.irf.net to get some knowledge about Islam. And if you have some self respect then give me your address. (Please give me the real one not as fake as you mentioned in your posts.)

333. # aryan on 20 Jan 2009 at 6:38 am

     Monis,

     The link which u have mentioned in your post has been built by terrorists and is full of terrorists.

     Everyone know about the reality of Islam where a woman is stoned to death.How insane is that??? Shame…..Big Shame

334. # Monis on 20 Jan 2009 at 7:28 am

     @ Aryan

     chchchchch…. shame on you man how proudly you speaking lie…. I think you are also belongs to that group who is best for their sham propaganda.

335. # Punjabi Soldier on 20 Jan 2009 at 8:58 am

     Monis my challenge still stand find me something hateful in Any of Holy Vedas or Gur Granth Sahab and i will accept defeat and will convert to a muslim .I swear that on my life.Now regarding my address unless u want to send your sister over as a present or what?

336. # Animesh on 20 Jan 2009 at 8:27 pm

     Dear Monis,

     You have said in your last blog that “You dont Care”… thats quite apparent.. as all this while you have argued with as many people as possible without making any substanial point.. Think about it how many points have you made… there are more abuses than something that you can argue about…. You dont care because you dont have enough knowledge to get into an argument… You dont care because till now you have not proved anything that you have stood for…. you dont care because the posts that seems to heavy of tough to reply gets ignored… And this is the attitude of “I dont Care” that has taken Pakistan to docks… Because in Pakistan whether its the politicians, or Army men, or Bueaurocrats or intelligence personnels or terrorists or citizens like you… nobody cares… when things are not the way you would have wanted… you start abusing…
     This careless attitude has made pakistan a nation to with unfullfilled desires and aspirations. Congratulations because “You Dont Care”

     As far as me supporting Punjabi Soldier is concerned, I feel he has lot of love for his motherland as well as equal amount of hate for Pakistan… for which he is not to be blamed… As he is just reverting back to you guys in the language you will understand (Especially you)…
     However I still have reservations on his interpretations about Islam… I believe Islam is a religion of love and peace and it can certainly coexist with any other religion… However the misinterpretations are many… that is why these terrorists and there so called religious gurus misguide muslims quoting verses, As far as I know these verses where written for a particular time in Prophets Life when muslims here subjogated… Non belivers essentialy are people who were against you and your faith… It never encourages people to go and kill people from different religious beliefs…

     Monis in my earlier entries I had tried to clarify it a little bit… however I feel you would be the right person to do it…

     Why dont you tell us what is the real meaning of these verses?

     However the possibilty is very less as “You dont Care”

     You have also written that ther are two kinds of people.. one who live in honor and dignity and braveheart… and others who cahnge the principles according to situation…

     You are right but I guess you and your country belongs to the later category…

     eg “Kasab is not a Pakistani” however as the condition & situation changed…
     ” Kasab is a Pakistani”…
     I guess according you you guys his name was Amar Singh. What happened to the great conspiracy theory by Zaid Hamid and others.

     Examples like these are many… but I just dont wanna waste my time because… I certainly am not looking forward to an intelligent reply… and also because nothing to prove to a person who “Doesnt care”

337. # NEEL on 21 Jan 2009 at 10:41 am

     hey hey guys leave Monish and Pakistan a side, lets start some latest technology discussion in Indian military,New fighter jets in air force ,new technology in Army.

338. # Vinay on 21 Jan 2009 at 12:53 pm

     I had posted some links which answered all questions being posed by NOFAL and Monis. Why has my post not been published? I did not use abusive or vulgar language, unlike several others on this page. Can the site administrator please explain what the reason was, for not publishing my post?

339. # V kurian on 22 Jan 2009 at 4:51 pm

     Dear Pakistani friends,

     This is not to prove any one wrong just what a Indian on the street feels.

     I feel you have a very strong reason to think and feel the way you do. Most of us are post partition generation and it is not fair to say that Indians have any anti feelings related to partition. If I look back it was good as a united India may not have held together as one nation. Also you should stop blaming us for partition of East Pakistan I don’t deny our role but the formation of Bangladesh was inevitable with or without our support. Look at the huge cultural difference that exists between Pakistan and erstwhile East Pakistan (Bangladesh). This break up affected you very much in terms of your ideology of united in faith as it blew the lid of a Islamic state the other losses were very marginal as not many Pakistanis were in Bangladesh.

     To avenge this you set out to claim Kashmir to settle the score and are dedicated to that cause as a official stand again the logic is its a predominantly Muslim state. We in India have the second largest Muslim population in the world so how can that logic hold good. The fact on Kashmir is we will not give and inch of the Kashmir that is with us nor we should think of taking an inch from that is there on your side.Isn’t this a fair argument and if we sort out Kashmir what else do have to fight with each other. Both of our countries have huge domestic concerns and it needs to be addressed on war footing.

     Pakistani media is going gung ho about Shrikant Purohit for his role in samjhauta express bombing believe me friends if he is found guilty he will be prosecuted as per the law of the land. We didn’t arrest him to please any one or on complaints from some other country. Please look into the process also not just the result….even after the whole world has recognized role of Pakistani citizen’s role in the attacks in Mumbai you continue to live in denial. Now this is the difference between two countries as we feel their is no place for terrorist or terrorism in our society. If you don’t act now your country is in danger as there are thousands of Kasabs being trained and armed. Please empower your Judiciary and parliament. Don’t let Zaid Hamid’s of the world hijack your polity and civil society.

     As a Indian my head hangs in shame for what happened in Gujarat’s am also a Christian born in India and lived in different parts of the country for last 35+ years not once have I faced any discrimination any where all religious violence in India have a socio economic root which is then actively converted to religious lines by our ever greedy and corrupt politicians to encourage vote bank politics. On the economic front we have made some progress but still have a long way to go and all the credit to the enterprising sprit of our people. Roti ,kapda, makaan are still the core issues of majority of our people. Yes Muslims as a society have not moved up the socio economic ladder as other societies but they have only themselves to blame. Lack of family planning, no investment in proper education are the major reasons and those Muslims who have been able to plan their families and invest in education for their children are some of the brightest people in the country and have a bright future to look forward to you. Their is problems of being multi cultural, lingual, region & religion and our country allows us to be all this and above all INDIANS.

     You are one of the only two nations in the world carved out on religious lines other being Israel. Still it is sad to see so many differences among yourself and all this fear of the country breaking up. We would be happy to see an economically strong and vibrant Pakistan so that you can be confident. This will not be possible until you cleanse your political system of all military generals past and present. These guys have a feudal mental make up and their children only get the best of education and have a good life at the cost of the millions of Pakistanis. They are never ready to come out of the war scenario so that their existence is not questioned and the only source of keeping the country united is not lost. Yours is the only government who talk of nuclear bombs as if it is a fire cracker if you are a nuclear state behave like one don’t keep on reminding it always to all “as one of the American generals said you are the only people who always negotiate with a gun pointed to your own head”.

     We understand you are a nuclear state and that is a very good deterrence as we have a lot to loose if you bomb us and we still loose if we bomb you as all those costly ammunition will be spent on the mountains and caves as happened to Americans. Be assured a war is a remote possibility and in case one happens we will have factored the reality of being nuked and planned our response. I will be honest no one in India loves a Pakistani but we don’t hate you either. We don’t teach our children in schools to hate Pakistan & Pakistanis. There is a strong feeling in India and the world that since you can’t fix your country want to screw-up other countries in the region. I request you to stop acting and reacting thru state and non-state actors as this will be counter productive for you.

340. # Adnan Jawaid on 22 Jan 2009 at 10:07 pm

     Pakistan can fire missiles in only 10 minutes notice on all Indian cities, while India needs 30 minutes for initial ignition. And in today’s war, even a single second counts India’s atomic explosion was OF 50% success while Pakistan was OF 100% SUCCESS.

     If war imposed, Pakistan can successfully fight for four months with its year to date amo resources. No doubt, one of the highest one in world , Pakistan is the 4th country in the world having Cruz missiles. Pakistan has SHAHEEN, GHAZNAVI, GHAURI, SHAHEEN2 missiles as well Pakistan’s missile accuracy is considered the most accurate in the WORLD TO hit the target. (1 meter dia. target) India can hit 1500Km and Pakistan’s missile range is 3500Km (SHAHEEN 2) so if India takes surgical strike, whole India will be on fire…

     “CHUK DE” India mamoon”
     PAKISTAN ZINDABAD ——— GOD BLESS PAKISTAN.

341. # PRITESH on 23 Jan 2009 at 9:51 am

     Adnan bhai!!

     Why do u want to fire missiles on India.

     Lets live in peace.

     I will give u some points. Think on it!!

     Ur government is spending almost half of your GDP on military.
     If some amount of this money is spent in developing pakistan.
     Dont u think pakistan can become a wonderful and great nation.

     As a responsible citizen. I think u should concentrate on making the lives of ur people better.

     And give them good education.

     V indians also are trying to make india a developed nation. V dont support our government if its wrong. V critisize our government if something goes wrong.

     U pakistanis also should revolutionize the people.

     Think on it!!!

     And Do reply……

342. # NEEL on 23 Jan 2009 at 6:17 pm

     1)India’s Proud on Dr. A.P.J Abdul Kalam- ex President of India - Muslim
     2)10% Scientists in India - Muslims
     3)Bollywood super hit actors(shahrukh,Salman,Amir,Fardin,Firzkhan,Yusuf khan-dilip)- Muslims
     4)India’s Pride Lal killa- built by muslims
     5)7th wonder Taj Mahal- Built by muslim
     6)20% Indian millitary men- Muslims
     7)30% pollititions - Muslims
     8)Hindu and Muslim both praying - Hajiali - A muslim god(Pir)
     9)Indian Cricket team- moh.Ajr,Irfan pathan,Yusuf Pathan,Munaf Patel,moh. Kaif-many more muslims…
     10)19% top surgens and doctors muslims.
     Many more to count but lets these 10 enuph for these pakistanis to know India..
     -> Now tell me u pakistani guys , how many Hindu,Sikh or Christian in Pakistan’s
     -Government body?
     -entertainment body?
     -millitary body?
     -Scientists?
     -top Doctors?
     -any famous hindu temple in pakistan?
     -any temple or gurudwara where muslims pray in pakistan?
     -how many hindu,sikh or christian crickets in pakistan cricket team or hocky team?or any other sports?
     => this is the straight forward answers for all ur questions u bloody pakistanis , just try to see in ur country first , solve prob between shiya and sunni then come to India. and yeh Indian Muslims know this fact so they dont need ur advice :))

343. # Animesh on 24 Jan 2009 at 6:00 pm

     Radheya
     Why i am kept away from this blog , my question is to the person who own this blog….

344. # Wise Man on 24 Jan 2009 at 7:57 pm

     Since the beginning of this thread , there has been lot of pointing from both sides ( and also from outside ). It is good to see that there’s been a good exchange of opinions..

     having said that….

     fault lies on both sides…

     India’s fault: After partition Pakistan was literally left with nothing (not to mention the main control of water/rivers flowing towards Pakistan was in control of India).
     Pakistan was going through difficult times, it has to build a country from scratch.
     During those difficult times , Neither India nor any other country came to rescue/help.
     India should have put aside all the conflicts and helped Pakistan to cope-up and hence the chance of friendship n brotherhood. That could have brought peace for ever between us. Unfortunately that never happened as a result Pakistan fell into hands of dictatorship many a times due the helplessness of the state and things got worse and worse for different reasons , but still Pakistan kept on moving forward. To see where Pakistan stands now , everbody has to say “its impressive” but could have done better.

     Pakistan’s fault: People should have and should become more aware and bring in a perfect system and process to help itself and challenge the present and future situations.This could be a challenge in itself but united by good will and in the best interest of the country it is possible. as citizens its a duty ever asked by country.There needs another Revolution to completely change the face of the country.

     India does have problems but its people are enjoying more freedom than any other country, but its difficult and disturbing to see that trouble is sent from outside the country and common citizens have to suffer

     In the present situation , its really useless to talk about the numbers,years,defeats,victories etc.,

     It seems to me that , whatever disputes exists should be resolved and coming to the Kashmir issue , any country would feel ashamed to let go part of its land even its of few inches… but we could work out a solution so perfect and effective and terrorist free solution ……that we could dissolve the boundaries not only pertaining to Kashmir but entire boundary line between Pakistan and India , just like the European nations (EU region) .

     I hope that day comes… and show the rest of the world , what India and Pakistan is capable of… though divided we stay united by thought…..

345. # Nitin on 24 Jan 2009 at 9:34 pm

     Adnan Jawaid
     “Pakistan can fire missiles in only 10 minutes notice on all Indian cities, while India needs 30 minutes for initial ignition. And in today’s war, even a single second counts India’s atomic explosion was OF 50% success while Pakistan was OF 100% SUCCESS.”
     A->.Well pakistan has no phalcons or any anti anti millsile traking system ,but India has! So evn if you respond in one mins..the Missile are not gona reach any target.Dude Indis is a neuclear state since 70z and since then research was constantly done to develop it better and , god knows who told you this info that 50% sucess and 60 %sucess Dude these test are either failure or either sucess ..there is no such things like 50% sucess or 100 % sucess.And Up til now India has never seen a failure in research then let it be domstic missile programs or Space program! You sound like a kid having “0″ go to web site wwwDOTdefenceDOTpk you wil get info what ur country actualy has

     “If war imposed, Pakistan can successfully fight for four months with its year to date amo resources. No doubt, one of the highest one in world , Pakistan is the 4th country in the world having Cruz missiles”
     A-> If war is imposed pakistan wil be destroyed right away!no need of months its just matter 2,3 days! India is 3rd largest military on earth! in al aspects pakistan is no 7 ..far away!
     “Pakistan has SHAHEEN, GHAZNAVI, GHAURI, SHAHEEN2 missiles as well Pakistan’s missile accuracy is considered the most accurate in the WORLD TO hit the target. (1 meter dia. target)India can hit 1500Km and Pakistan’s missile range is 3500Km (SHAHEEN 2) so if India takes surgical strike, whole India will be on fire… ”
     A->Dude India has deadly weapons than pkistan and for you kind information agni 4 millise has a rango of 6000kms(go to google and search for agni IV range ul get ur answer) that self is enoff for you i dont need to mension others, but if you wanna talk about acuracy looks like you havent hurd about bhramos, [just go on youtube and in search box type in" bhramos test "you find the acuracy . (1cm dia. target) ]
     Final conclusion:- you seem to look like a teenager having zero knowledge about defence system!what u need to do is
     1-grow up
     2- lear to make proper use of internet
     3-Enough of fariy, unicrorns & demons wake up! its time to get out of dreams and start living in reality!

346. # tony sebestian on 25 Jan 2009 at 12:03 am

     @Adnan Jawaid

     Pakistan can fire missiles in only 10 minutes notice on all Indian cities, while India needs 30 minutes for initial ignition. And in today’s war, even a single second counts India’s atomic explosion was OF 50% success while Pakistan was OF 100% SUCCESS.

     If war imposed, Pakistan can successfully fight for four months with its year to date amo resources. No doubt, one of the highest one in world , Pakistan is the 4th country in the world having Cruz missiles. Pakistan has SHAHEEN, GHAZNAVI, GHAURI, SHAHEEN2 missiles as well Pakistan’s missile accuracy is considered the most accurate in the WORLD TO hit the target. (1 meter dia. target) India can hit 1500Km and Pakistan’s missile range is 3500Km (SHAHEEN 2) so if India takes surgical strike, whole India will be on fire

     where d u get all these information from….pak only da 4th country having cruz missile??what about 5 permanent members plus india and israel and N.korea etc…
     Agni-2 is 3500+range…india need 30 min initial ignition time??do u even know about missiles….india’s atomic explosion had 50%success??hav u got those information from ur madrassa…if u r sooo expert in military hardwares than i invite u to pakdefence forum or in defenceforum.com and want u to write these same things…i assure u everybody will thank u 4 a good joke…surgical strikes???d u know wat it means…pak missile accuracy the most accurate in da world???man where r u living right now,u seems 2 b living in a fools world

347. # VK on 28 Jan 2009 at 1:38 am

     One thing I would like to ask all pakistanis on this blog, you people claim to have won 1965,1971 and 1999 Kargil War. Do you even have a single war movie that can defend your false claims of winning any of these wars. Bollywood has made several war movies like Border, LOC Kargil, Lakshya etc. that are dedicated to the brave soldiers of the Indian Army who sacrificed their lives while defending their motherland from your coward army and terrorist organizations backed by the ISI and Pak Govt. India is proud of its young soldiers who fought hard defending their nation against your ridiculous, fucking army. India won all three wars convincingly a proof of which is very well documented all over the world wide web. Infact, during the kargil war, your army left its injured and dead soldiers on the Indian side of LOC, this shows how selfish you people are. It was Indian Army who buried the bodies of your people with all muslim rights. It surprises me how you pakisatnis can believe in your army, it is because of your army, your country has become a failed nation. Your army and the govt. has been trying hard to sabotage India’s economic growth, and that is where they have failed as a nation. As a nation it is your responsibility to create a peaceful atmosphere internally as well as with the neighboring countries. Your country should focus on creating an economic environment where the foreign multi-nationals can invest, set up industries, create jobs and stimulate growth. Giving a safe harbor to terrorist organizations, supporting them and engaging them into a war with the other nations only shows Pakistan’s bad intent. Your country is already on the brink of bankruptcy, your economy is at its worst in the history of Pakistan, you people are surviving on the money that you are getting as an aid from other countries. Don’t force the world to isolate Pakistan otherwise you will be the next Afghanistan or Zimbabwe.

348. # Tallen Lu on 28 Jan 2009 at 6:33 pm

     India has more people, more weapon, and better tech. so Pack a Stan will be screwed if a war happens. They still have to deel with bin ladin.

349. # VK on 02 Feb 2009 at 7:30 am

     Aby, is this blog live anymore?

350. # Chinese threat to Indian space assets - Pakistan Defence Forum on 02 Feb 2009 at 5:40 pm

     [...] Military Budgets and Economic Impact Pakistan�s defence budget for the year 2006-07 was $4.1 billion (~3% of GDP) in response to India�s hike in defence budget of 2006-07 at $20.11 billion (~ 2.5% of GDP). Pakistan�s hike in military budget would be partially funded by its government coffers and partially by borrowing whereas India�s military spending would be entirely off its own funds. India�s ambitious budget prompted Pakistan to up its own military budget, despite the country�s widespread poverty and socio-political problems. Apart from its GDP, Pakistani military also gets a considerable funding from United States. Considering that India has a far larger economy overall, its military budget is also several times larger, despite being a smaller share of India�s GDP. India vs Pakistan - Evaluation on Military Strengths | Aby The Liberal [...]

351. # SmarterOne on 02 Feb 2009 at 11:03 pm

     Hey guys there is no point in discussing nething with the pakistanis. They’ll never ever accept the facts. We Indians atleast know we have problems & are fighting hard to eradicate them. Our economic success is for the world to see (except for pakistanis).
     My friends Kurien, Md. Javed, Imran, Tony, Punjabi Soldier, Nitin, Animesh etc (sorry to the guys who r left out being named & gt included in “etc” as i wanted to hv an example of our religious diversity & unity by including the names above) have tried hard to convince the pakis & mr. robinson (whom i really suspect as being british as the account he has so far presented is very similar to wt the pakis r taught) but it seems to have gone unheard. hv u guys noticed tht the things you pakis r blaming on India is itself being proved wrong in this thread as ppl frm all religions & regions are supporting wt India is all about. I’m a regular to many defence forums (Indian, Paki & the rest of the world) and have a very good knowledge of military hardware around the world. The claims made by many pakis here are not even supported in their own defence forums. All these paki guys know is to oppose India blindly and flaunt themselves as superior. They will distort history to prove their point. There is also a research paper on wt shit is taught to ‘em in schools (all tht stuff is anti-India, anti-hindu & distorted to an unamendable extent) and tht research is done by pakis only. For example - Pakistan existed 5000 years ago & India was carved out of Pakistan. Will ne one tell these guys tht Islam is the most newest of religions - only 1400yrs old so how come muslims hv existed 5000 yrs ago. And ditto with wt Mr. Robinson said tht Indus valley was Buddhist. Its only laughable tht even before Lord Buddha was born a Buddhist civilisation existed that prayed Lord Shiva & animals.
     Also I’d like to ask my esteemed frnds not to refer things in the context of Hindus & Muslims but only in the context of India & Pakistan as we hv more muslims than Pak and Muslims living in India are by far the happiest & peace loving muslims newhere in da world(as stated on abc - an american news channel).

     I’m pasting below my comments on a defence forum which somehow are also relevant to this thread. Please read in context.

     ———————————

     Hey guys thr is no point discussing with the pakistanis. They’ll never agree n’ will never accept a fact with an open mind. They make stupid allegations against us they point to our “poverty”, our “starved” people and things like that as if they are some developed country in europe. They want to close their eyes on the poverty in pakistan, areas getting out of control from the so called ’strong’ pak army into the hands of taliban, financial bankruptcy, medical facilities compared to some african country…the list is endless. They will still close their eyes on the support India provides to ‘em frm time 2 time. ex are the recent IMF loan which Indian lobbied for Pakistan, BCCI coming to rescue of PCB and above all 1000s OF PAKISTANIS GETTING FREE TREATMENT IN INDIA FOR MEDICAL COMPLICATIONS only available in advanced countries. They can also deny these facts - I’ll not be surprised at all if they do.
     US Army takes guerilla training from CIJWS (Indian Army’s CI ops & Jungle Warfare School). Why havent they chosen the pak army or the chinese if they are so superior.
     I come from dehradun - home to the IMA. Many foreign cadets take training here - y not PMA? In COPE India excercises USAF pilots were stunned when they faced IAF (IAF used jaguar and Su30 & not the MKI). They on record said that if ever they’ll hv to encounter India there only hope will be F-22 Raptors, no other AC can take the IAF.
     As for MBT Arjun, LCA & for that matter ne DRDO project - we develop it from scratch not steal or borrow. And dear paki friends geniune developments take time. Ask US how many years it spent for F-22 even the now lowly F-16s. When you develop you are bound to face problems. How come Pakistan which never even developed a scooter on its own develop sophisticated military equipment without ne failures? As far as missile programme is concerned - do my paki friends know India has a sophisticated space program going on since ages. Even NASA today use ISRO for their satellite launches. A country which can make a rocket to go up in space (soon will be on the moon - though we already are but m talking abt a manned mission) will have ne difficulty in making missiles? Dont you know we are the only country in the world to have a supersonic missile. Even russia havent inducted BrahMos. We are the only Blue Water Navy in Asia. Even yer friend China is jst a brown water navy (hope u understand the difference) We are the only one operating aircraft carriers & amphibious ships in the region (again china is nowhere) We are (supposedly) the only one after the french to have completely stealth frigates (even US doesnt have one).
     We are a major IT power and the world acknowledges it.
     I remember Mush once saying in the US - We will establish BPOs in pak & beat india in dat as we spk better english than the Indians. Poor Mush, he had to call Indian BPO experts to setup BPOs in pak (my pak friends may disagree but I’ve frnds who visited Pak for the same) and as far english is concerned - Indian are tutoring the Brits and the Yankees on the language - that too online sitting here in India.
     Have my paki friends ever seen the monitoring center at Infosys - it brings the mighty NASA to shame. And from there they control every damn computer that the IT giants like MS, Intel…the list is endless, use in their offices. Why dont the pakis get to do that?
     You only do things like creating viruses (after all the paki brain was the first virus to be discovered) & terrorism - The two gr8 exports of Pakistan.

     Lets now come to the topic of LCA & JF-17
     If JF-17 is so superior why is the chinese PLAAF not keen to use it themselves? Where ever you read abt JF-17 on the net (except for the biased paki sites) u’ll notice on thing - “The JF-17/FC-1 is designed to be a cost-effective aircraft which can meet the tactical and strategic needs of air forces of developing countries” - the last two words say a lot abt it.
     And the Paki claim of it being an indigenious product goes with their previous claims of their missiles & nuclear bombs. dont be surprised if after a few years they’ll call F-16s too indigenious.
     And btw guys do u have ne answer for the LCH & Brahmos - u guys never talk abt ‘em coz yer chinese frnds n’ still not capable of such things (they cudnt steal one as it is difficult to get one out frm India).
     Talking abt problems in our country - first see yerself and then point fingers at others. At least we are a vibrant democracy with a functioning institutions. Even the US has its share of problems. wt abt you? We are an emerging power and you - a failed state with a begging bowl in hand. just 4 Indians can buy whole of pakistan dont believe me - read dawn (which u pakis keep telling is to read so often) which will tell u more abt our economic might. n’ the militant organisations u listed (though u repeated them with diff names)- they are militants and are sponsored by yer ISI, we keep killing them and btw they r not holding our land n’ running parallel govts as in FATA in Pak.
     come out of ignorance n denial my paki frnds or else one day u’ll be the target of the US and meet the same fate as Afghanistan & Iraq. Do something for the upliftment of your country instead of keep thinking on how to fight india.
     We no longer consider you an enemy. We have plans to be another major world power along with US, Russia & China. So u must know by now tht to be a world power you hv to be at par with the best in the world n’ not to be at par with the PEST (yes it is pest n’ i’ve not mis spelt best) of the world. So our military programme is in accordance with that my frnd n’ if u behave well with us we may even save u frm an impending US attack. n’ hey btw why r yer JF-17 “Thunders” not doing nething abt US drone attacks???
     We’d problems but we overcame them n’ in the process of eradicating the other ones. wt abt u - yer economy was better than us in the old days even the literacy rates but now… its 4 d world 2 see. Its high time consider us yer friends if not brothers - we can have a very bright future together. We can even assist u to eradicate the Taliban frm yer country & save u guys too frm d daily attacks u hv all over yer country.

     and an addon abt the news channels no sensible person in India watches India TV - hv u ever watched NDTV 24×7, NDTV India, Times Now, CNN IBN, CNBC Awaaz?? there are 100 news channels in india so obvl’y a few will be dishing out stuff like India TV after all having a free press does hv some disadvantages n’ for yer info on Indian co-operation to pak - TV-18 of india devotes an hour programe for Pakistan on CNBC-TV18 as they dint had a business channel there.

     For INS Tabar (its not tawar - pakis will never learn to properly spell n’ pronounce) hitting Thai trawler - The fact remains tht the trawler was captured by the pirates, who fired at INS Tabar which in turn sunk them. Pakis read only the news tht suits them for anti-India propaganda. y not also talk abt so many ships which INS Tabar saved frm being hijacked.

     C-130J Super Hercules is smaller than IL76 but not one of the “smallest”. It is a heavy lift aircraft. dunno which aircraft this paki guy saw. “smallest” aircraft doesnt run with 4 engines. A wing span of more than 132 ft is nowhere considered smallest.

     Abt the comparison abt JF-17 & Tejas (and for tht matter ne other development) - Pakis always say that how can u compare the two as one is inducted & another is on paper. This repeated statements already prove that pakis never did ne development work in their lives coz they dont know how a thing is developed. u create prototypes, u run them & evaluate them. under-development doesnt mean it is on paper. & failures doesnt mean the whole project has failed or the kaveri engine in this case never even cranked up. failures mean that the team is still not able to achieve the goals setup in the draft. for ex. if i set out to make a car engine tht will exceed 200mph & still give 20kmpl and while developing i only achieve 180mph with 20kmpl doesnt mean i’ve completely failed. but yes the test will fail. i may hv to go back to my drawing board to make basic changes or just tune-up a few things and can get a better result next time.
     Do these pakis even know the specs of Arjun - which they criticize so much. It is pitched against the best in the world - Abrams M1, Leopard2 & d like not like yer shady Al-Khalid. Arjun has an armour which cannot be peirced by the normal armour peircing explosives. The parameters for Arjun are so high that none of the world’s existing tanks can match up. The Army wants a Gold Standard tank. The problem most critisized with Arjun is the weight though less than the Abram & Leopard, but the army insists on lighter tank. Its actual ground pressure is far less, even less than the lighter T-90S. Heatup had been an issue but hv been solved to a gr8 extent. Its gun can fire even HESH explosives which no other tank in the world can with APFSDS, HE & HEAT. And with Israeli LAHAT it is one of the deadliest tanks in the world. & btw Arjun has been inducted in the Indian Army.
     Also read this

     http://frontierindia.net/dissimilar-combat-arjun-mbt-vs-t-90s-specs

     You shud also keep in mind that there is a very strong lobby of defence manufacturers who do not want indigenious development to happen in India as it affects them badly. It is these manufacturers & their supporters in our establishment which create so much hue n’ cry abt standard test failures which are part & parcel of any development. I know it very well as I am a developer myself (though not of the defence kind apart frm a few miniscule defence projects) I was even approached once to work for the ADA (agency which develops the LCA) but my qualifications at that time prevented me frm applying.
     As of this paki guy telling us whr will we keep our MKIs as we dont hv d money - so pakis hv d money - after all u do, :p u keep going frm country to country with a begging bowl in both of yer hands. India is the 4th largest economy in the world & where does pakistan stand - No.50. We dont need a certificate on d money we have frm u my li’l paki frnd. We have more than 7 times purchasing power than u do. Read the article below, it is written by a pakistani journalist Dr. Farrukh Saleem.

     http://news.rinkiss.com/politics/india-in-the-eyes-of-a-pakistani-journalist/160

     It is for that money u’re letting the yankees kill yer own ppl in FATA. y’day only US VP said they will attack pak if there is intelligence. y dont u send yer ‘mighty’ paf & army to fight the US in FATA who r killing innocent pakis. y doesnt yer ‘mighty’ army take on the Taliban & other terrorists? we finished terrorism in Punjab & in the South. do u hv one example of such sorts? & tht too was done by the police itself. u made a long list of corruption & bad things going on in India (though the facts you brought up were 13 yrs old - a hell lot hv been changed since then) . hey man we atleast acknowledge our problems and therefore are able to solve them n’ progress. wt abt u. u r ruled by Mr. 10% who seems to hv bcome Mr. 100% now. Your rulers run out of the country when there is a problem. not ours, no matter how corrupt or bad our politicians are - there is not a single instance where ne 1 of them ran away and when things bcame favourable returned back. Our politicians will go to jail & face indian justice than to run away from the country. deny this too my paki friend.
     Our human rights record is far better than pakistan - even better than many in the western world. And you know wht not just the Pakistanis (the rich & the poor alike) flock India for medical services. Even ppl from the US, UK and almost all European countries come here for treatment - not just Ayurveda but highly complicated Western medical procedures and tht too at a fraction of the cost in their own country. Our PM din went to US for his heart surgery (as all of paki leaders & high officials do). He had it done in a Govt. run hospital.
     I sincerely hope u’ll be able to deny n’ ignore all this too.

     WE DONT COMPARE OURSELVES WITH THE PAKISTANIS. WE PITCH OURSELVES AGAINST THE BEST IN THE WORLD. SO PAKI FRIENDS PLZ STOP PLAYING THIS GAME. LEARN FROM US (INDIA NOT U.S.) & MAKE LIFE BETTER FOR YER FELLOW PAKIS. WE WANT PEACE & PROGRESS FOR EVERYONE IN THIS WORLD & THAT INCLUDES PAKISTAN.

     ——————————————-

     There maybe a few things going out of context with the thread but the essence is the same.
     Waiting for an honest reply from my frnds.

352. # SmarterOne on 02 Feb 2009 at 11:04 pm

     @ Wiseman
     just an addon - India did give around a 100 crores to Pakistan on the Mahatma’s insistence in 1948 which they used the same year to attack India to avert succession of Kashmir. Water resources are controlled by India but there had never been a single instance when India blocked the resources, not even during ne of the wars & even not after 26/11 though defence experts are strongly of the view.

     Also friends just give this thing a thought - Wht if Pakistan had been in d place where India stands today - thr wud hv been no India, only Pakistan.

     Though I’d like peace between us but it is very unlikely coz as opposed to India the feeling of hatred towards India runs too deep in Pakistan. Elections are fought on anti-India sentiments, children are taught to percieve India as an enemy, the list goes endless. On the contrary even the RSS run schools (the Shishu Mandirs) in India dont teach hatred against Pakistan

353. # rahul on 09 Feb 2009 at 5:05 pm

     If Pakistan is in a state of turmoil and bankruptcy today the people are solely to blame. They vote for the wrong people and fall prey to false government propaganda. The Pakistan govt. has always tried to divert public attention to Pakistan’s real issues of poverty, unemployment and under development by calling India the enemy. It has been doing this for decades and will continue to in the future.

     The government spends nearly 40 percent of the country’s GDP on defense which is ridiculous considering Pakistan is one of the poorest nations in the world. Even money received as aid from other countries is squandered in the name of defense. The people of Pakistan need to wake up and take their govt. to task. Can you imagine where Pakistan would have been today if all that money was used for development, creating infrastructure, business opportunities and jobs?

     Even children with heart disease come to India for surgeries because of the pathetic condition of hospitals in Pakistan. All surgeries on Pakistanis in India (running into lakhs) are done free of cost and even drugs are provided free because they can’t afford it. These surgeries are done on a humanitarian basis and as a goodwill gesture despite the fact that Pakistan has been constantly trying to destabilize the country. In fact, there was a child at Escorts hospital in Delhi even during the Mumbai attacks. Do you think western countries would open their door to Pakistanis even if it were for medical treatment?

     Take the Swat valley in Pakistan which is completely under Taliban control. Even the police and civil administration has fled the place. Can you imagine what would happen if the Taliban captured more territory or more importantly gained control of Islamabad, Karachi and other major cities? Would your wives be able to move around freely and would your daughters and sisters able to attend school? Think about it.

     The Pakistan govt. and the ISI want all Pakistanis to believe that India is the enemy so that they can pursue their own agenda. It is time the Pakistani people called their bluff and tell them to concentrate on economic reforms. The people need to start a mass movement against the establishment and make it abundantly clear that Pakistan cannot afford to waste money on defense when the country is on the verge of bankruptcy.

     Trust me…its not very difficult. If we could rise against the might of the British Empire, the ISI is small fry. Do not indulge in India bashing…it won’t help you in any way. The establishment in Pakistan has been brainwashing Pakistanis into thinking that India is the enemy. I can assure you, it is not. The enemy is within. Wrong policies. Bad governance. Wrong deployment of scarce and much needed resources. The reasons are many and if anyone can change Pakistan, it is not America or Great Britain or the United Nations. It is the people of Pakistan themselves. It is important that you force your government to change its policies and create a thriving, prosperous Pakistan. I wish you the very best.

354. # kumar on 12 Feb 2009 at 4:56 am

     As an Indian, it is none of my business to say something about “internal Pakistani politics”. I have would like to tell something to the (adeel wali)( according to adeel wali, the people of Pakistan don’t have the power to take the politicians down because they pay and earn alot. 2nd why we dont take action against politicians is because our politicians have no power, you might belive Mr. President Asif Ali Zardari is in power but let me assure you He’s not. General Perveiz Musharraf is still camoflauged behind the army and still under control for the army and Our army runs the nation, the politicians are just there to show! ). If you are right about Pakistani political situation, might all Pakistani people need to do reconstruct their constitution. People of Pakistan need to take all power from Pakistani military by changing constitution. There are so many way to do that. British replaced their king as main power. French killed their king and put constitution which is friendlier to citizen. More recent example is Nepal. They changed their system by taking all power from their king. They are running country by “Constituent Assembly election”. As Not Resident Indian, I always hear only one thing and that is terrorist activities. There can be few people who(current rulers of Pakistan) encourage terrorist activities. It damage status of country and all citizens have to tolerate that. More than that some nations get chance to attack on Pakistan like attacks on Afghanistan and Iraq. Today you may get help from international institution. According to this situation, people of Pakistan need to do a big change. If people of Pakistan change today‘s situation, it will help Pakistani and Indian economy.

355. # Sairaj on 25 Feb 2009 at 3:09 am

     Why you all fight among yourself………..the military has been made for defense and not to attack. I read some Posts and I could understand that many were talking about religion. Let me say, I am a Hindu, but many of my friends are muslims and we never find a difference between us. Hence, I would like to say all these social differences has been turned into social division only because of politics and it would be better if we understand that and act accordingly.

356. # vishnu on 28 Feb 2009 at 2:44 pm

     @M Robinson

     I am hardly surprised with your nonsensical views given that your are a English man. Wherever the english went, they divided people in terms of race, religion, cast, creed etc. and created hatred in minds of people. Many of the current world’s problems are the work of the imperial British empire. And yet you go around pretending to be bearers of civilization. It would be much better if you people stop meddling into problems which your ancestors created in the first place.

357. # junaid on 28 Feb 2009 at 7:44 pm

     I just read one line and I can understand the writer has no clue about his subject.
     ” indian pilots are better because of their past performance in wars with Pakistan” … that could not be further from the truth… World record for kills by a single pilot was a Pakistani pilot in the 1965 air war against Indian jets…Research it if you don’t accept it.
     thank you

358. # G.Vinod on 03 Mar 2009 at 11:11 am

     The players of the Sri Lankan team, which visited Pakistan, were attacked by
     terrorists. It’a disturbing but not a surprising news considering the fact that the
     Talibans are slowly occupying the country. Only God can save the people of
     Pakistan from these deadly terrorists.

359. # Baba Farid on 05 Mar 2009 at 8:15 am

     @Junaid and sundry other Pakistanis. Dear all, Air Commodore Muhammad Mahmood Alam (M.M. Alam) was a great soldier and an ace Pilot - all kudos and salute to this braveheart. He gave his all for the P.A.F. and Pakistan and do you all know how he was treated for all these? Since he was a Bengali Muslim, the west pakistanis(especially punjabis) couldn’t tolerate his success and removed him from command shortly after the 1965 war on the pretext that he was not ‘literate enough’ (meaning he was not a product of elite western institutes), his combat skills not withstanding. For the same reason he and all other Bengalis in P.A.F. were grounded during the 1971 war. Guess what happened? Most of the technical personnel of P.A.F. were bengalis and they were shunted out during the war resulting in the P.A.F. getting a drubbing at the hands of Indian Air Force. If they treat their war heroes like this…. you can well imagine how the armed forces dominated by Punjabis treat others. Pakistan will be doomed for these double standards.

360. # Mayank on 13 Mar 2009 at 8:17 pm

     These Pakistanis are supporting terrorism from way back 20-25 yrs and making a negative comment on Kashmir the integral part of India. By doing this they want to disturb unity and integrity of India as they have a long tendency to interfere in the internal affairs of India. They wont be able to succeed in their mission and will be taught a tough lession which they will be going to remember till their next generation. Pakistan use to comment and deteoriate peace among different religions specially Muslims but they should know that Indian Muslims are purely indian by heart.

361. # Rustam mirza on 16 Mar 2009 at 4:11 am

     Dear Pakistanis and Indians,

     Although I am from Pakistan but I have to say that why we guys (pakistanis and Indians) argue so much and make fun of each other. Every person wants pride and dignity, so do we in our class rooms, everywhere then we argue that punjab is better than Bihar or Karachi is better than lahore. Its a human nature.

     Regards

362. # Kundan Bhakuni on 02 Apr 2009 at 1:38 pm

     Hi,

     Ok I am not going to personally comment on anyones argument cause I believe the whole point of this forum is to compare the current conventional military powers of India and Pakistan.

     So my questions as on 2nd April 2009 to some mature people are:

     1.> Which country has better airforce as of present?
     2.> Which country has better ground military force at present?
     3.> Who has stratigical advantage over Naval capabilities?

     Please enlighten me and ensure:

     1.> No past data…
     2.> No politics…
     3.> No future predictions…

     If you can’t adhere to them then you are an immature Indian or Pakistani who can’t behave and thus by Western world make the majority of us look like D*ck Heads.

     Regards

363. # URVASHI on 19 Apr 2009 at 10:56 pm

     HEY HEY HEY, Mr.junaid who said you that we will not believe that World record for kills by a single pilot was set by Pakistani pilot in the 1965 air war against Indian jets…we can believe that sir because thats what pakistan can lead in, in killing. But sir let me tell you that India won that war, Research it if you don’t accept it.
     thank you

364. # Ash on 20 Apr 2009 at 5:29 am

     I read the article and few comments, I would like to state few facts,
     i) India never was a single major one country but split into dozens of mini independent states ruled by separate Rulers often engaged with each other before Muslims came and finally engulfed most of the sub-continent as one country. So I think Indians should at least be reasonable enough and acknowledge this and admit to this fact.
     ii) In this article it clearly says Indian airforce is much way too much updated then ageing Pakistani PAF but I disagree with author that Indian airforce performed better in two previous battles of 1965 and 1971. even in 1971 one can verify from independent sources that it was 3-1 shoot ratio and PAF out performed IAF, but how it performs in todays world it might be otherwise but in past it wasn’t like that only time will decide.
     iii) India is more than 3 times bigger in land, 6 times bigger in population, had all the main resources since birth, Pakistan wasn’t given its due share that was agreed on creation of both countries, still in 1948 Pakistan took half of Kashmir, deferred mighty Indian attack in 1965, and in 1971 it was civil war inside Pakistan between Bengali’s and west Pakistanis that India covertly supported but you can’t call it that India won it cause it was civil rest inside East Pakistan. It was result of suicidal decision of Pakistani politicians. With a country which is 5 times bigger and had a better start at its creation if Pakistan still survived what else you need to know that Pakistan is strong nation to resist any attempt of Indian dominance, forget China they are way ahead, Indian can never walk over even Pakistan. Believe it or not.

365. # urvashi on 21 Apr 2009 at 8:07 am

     MR.Ash i agree that it cant be said that India won that war but why dont you understand that if circumstances ever lead to war then India will not only destroy pakistan but it will smash pakistan and as per the question that Indian can never walk over even Pakistan, so you are right but you are expressing it in a wrong way its not that India can not walk over pakistan the matter is that India dont want to walk over pakistan because India has much more necessary matters to think about. And your analysis are some what incomplete let me tell you that India has 2nd largest army of the world and is one of the top 5 countries with strongest defence, but the thing is that we dont missuse our power. Oops i forgot to mention to mention that India is now one country whose citizens posess one country citizenship and i think that we should now learn now to live in present and should leave the past behind.

366. # maruf on 30 Apr 2009 at 1:09 pm

     muslim are now ina state which had jews back 200 years ago. i dun blame any non believers for this . its we muslims who are responsible for this . we are giving punjub soldier and many more anti-muslims lyk him by violating the rules of islam. jews were maltreated and were abused for thousands of years . hitler massacre them . bt now they punishing muslims for the fault of hitler. during 2nd world war the jiews of middle east were safe from threat . bt the selfish jiews are creating anarchy in the which were a safe place for them in their rainy day. now we muslims are approaching in a way which is wrong . islam prohibits all terrorism . bt no daud that the illiterate muslims are creating anarchy. and for this punjab soldier a( a extrimist) is blaming and calling us name . bt we all muslim know the rights given to non-believers in islam. in fact our prophet equied 10 uneducated muslim with 1 educated non-muslim. and so b4 telling anything i request everybody plz go through quran . if cant afford to collect it contact me . them shut ur mouth up

367. # Nofal on 11 May 2009 at 8:39 pm

     I used to be debating on this site before and a lot has changed.

     i think India cant take over pakistan and Pakistan cant take over India, IT IS Impossible.

     now that we got that cleared we should make relations stronger, start a good friendship, put the past behind us and head towards a better future.

368. # urvashi on 13 May 2009 at 9:13 am

     I just dont understand that what the problem is with u people, muslims are also human beings just like any other person following any other religion and believe me if u would have followed prohet Mohammad then u would have never said like that Mr. Maruf. why u people always keep on shrieking we muslims we muslims do u think that any true muslim will keep him up to any other religion. u are in a mere misunderstanding that you are a muslim, a muslim is one who sees god in every living being not the one who point fingers at others and before telling anybody else to go through Quram u are yourself suppose to do the same. But its appreciable that u accept your backdraws.

369. # digitalborealis on 24 May 2009 at 7:07 am

     I wonder why United Kingdom or England never apologized for this massacre. this war and future ( i hope it does not take place) is the product of their politics when they ruled. I believe they should apologize for it

370. # Faizan on 25 May 2009 at 11:13 pm

     I am a Pakistani and have read many of the above comments and am very impressed by remarks of Robinson.

     @Robinson: you are right with most of the points, but the problem is that people these days are more driven by media and its perception management tactics.

     Although i am a pakistani, but sitting on the fence i would say that Pakistani media has failed to project the right image of Pakistan and its people, or in other words i would say it has failed to deliver its role of perception management. But then why is it so?

     Thanks to one of the media channel of Pakistan that gave me the answer.

     I have witnessed the birth and establishment of Free Electronic Media in Pakistan, i have witnessed the up rise and downfall of President Musharraf, who actually gave freedom of speech to its media.

     But unfortunately his honest decisions hit him back in 2007 when the same media started creating propaganda against him.

     I used to believe that journalists and media always speak the truth. But this propaganda against President Musharraf, who was doing a fair job for the country, started creating doubts in my mind. And then one day we heard news that President Musharraf has ordered to shut down the transmission of of some media channels, not all. This was a surprising news for me. The reason given was that some media channels are projecting a wrong image of the country and are trying to create a situation of anarchy. The very next day i read a statement of one of the ministers of India in dawn news, saying that GEO TV should not be banned.

     Now the question raised in my mind was that why would an Indian minister be so much interested specifically in GEO TV broadcast? this created further doubts in my mind and then with time i came to know that GEO TV, with its office in Dubai, is being funded by Israel, India and America, and most of the popular TV anchors of GEO TV are being given instructions from CIA.

     Since then, i have noticed that a lot of Indian anchors often give references of news broadcast on GEO TV in creating baseless propaganda against Pakistan.

     A current example is of Mumbai attacks, when GEO TV declared that Ajmal Kasab is a Pakistani, which was later proved to be wrong (although many Indians won’t agree to this since their Media is managing their perceptions in a very professional way, but the fact is that, that the language ajmal kasab spoke is not spoken in Pakistan).

     The story made by indian media was that Ajmal kasab and his team came from Pakistan to mumbai on a boat through arabian sea and ISI was backing them. Yes its a funny story, but even if anybody considers this to be true, then i would say that ISI has been too kind with india since many years. Because if ISI can send a group of handful people in a boat and can get them cleared of all the security hurdles of proud indian navy and its Intelligence, and then it can those handful of people can shake the whole mumbai, then think of what Pakistan army can do, under which ISI operates, with its full force? i think they wont take much time to break India into pieces.

     May be this story was written and directed by Bajaj Telefilms :p

     Anyways.. the conclusion of my post is that its all perception management and indian media is trying to make good use of it, may be the storytellers in the indian media are doing fair job, but they are lacking support from their authors who are not writing realistic stories, as if they are still in bollywood….

371. # Hasnain on 27 May 2009 at 10:58 am

     @ All Non Belivers

     Acctually discussion on any religion on this blog is useless because non of us has sufficient stuff to discuss. just leave it on scholars like Doctor Zakir Naik, Doctor Ahmed Dedat, Shri Ravi Shanker etc to discuss in open forum, then leave it on audience and compare how much peoples are embracing Islam and how much are converting from Islam. Dr. Zakir Naik has no weapon and he never enfroce any one to accept Islam. Inspite of that people are embracing Great Islam in your Country, from your Religion and in front of global.

     @ All Muslims @ Monis

     Monis wat are you doing ? dont you read Verse of Quran in which All mighty Allah says “dont blame any other’s religion may be he blame your Religion”. so plz dont discuss our great Islam with these idiot nonbelivers.

     Regards,

372. # irfan sayed on 28 May 2009 at 8:35 pm

     i am visit relatives here in India, and i see how bad there woman is dress and naked. Also peoples stupid.

373. # Karthik on 30 May 2009 at 5:43 pm

     India & pakistan will be join together with joining be a one country it will be a very power full country in the world please try to co-operate pakistan , India was very Nice country , Just think this message guys.

374. # maruf on 31 May 2009 at 7:49 pm

     i totally agree with kartik. muslim and hindus are living side by side i this continent for 1 thousand years. it was the stupid british who created an artificial riot and thus broke the subcontinent. emagine if all south asian countries were one single country how rich and mighty i would be. bt after the great mutiny british approach in devide and rule policy.and now this situation.bt i think indians should be tolerant. there are riots in this country. bt u wont find any riot in bangladesh and pakistan . in our country hindus are very safe and like our brother. my fav teacher is a hindu . some of my friends are hindu . actually we very often realise they are hindu. we consider them as human first. bt in india we have seen the gujrat tragedy the babri mosque tragedy. bt they done nothing for the helpless muslim . u indian guys always call pakistan by name . bt can u show an example like gujrat in pak. in bangladesh nobody will dare to break any temple. we muslim get 7 days vaccation in eid and hindus get 5 in durga pooja . last of all hindus are safe and considered as human here (i dont deny some unusuall hapenning which are strongly disappreciated by us). bt are muslims safe in india ? i guess no.

375. # suhas on 01 Jun 2009 at 12:03 pm

     Dear all,

     This goes To every idiot who is saying that my religion is better and my country is.I am an Indian but i will also say that i am proud of my culture and history.I also am aware that this history and culture also bears a contribution from Pakistan as well(no body can deny that). India is a great country, a country of tolerance, of peace and of religious harmony. true there may be instances where there have been injustice towards a few communities, but we do not need an outside interference to point out these things, rather what my Pakistani friends should concentrate on is their own political and economic situation. Like what is happening to their own Muslims in the swat valley than break their heads on the conditions of Indian Muslims. Indian Muslims are a proud tribe, my best friends are Muslims, we live in religious harmony. we eat together, work together, feel bad when our temples or our mosques are attacked, but the difference is we fight these evils together…and thats why we will move ahead of you (pakis)! I am not saying that i am getting the information that my muslim friends are happy from the media, but i am living and typing this in consultation with them by my side. We will and will always move ahead, together, Hindus, Muslims, Christians, Sikhs, jains…try stopping us, you cannot!!! cause we no longer look at each other as Hindus and Muslims and Christians, but as INDIANS! Attack mumbai, attack Bangalore attack Delhi…but you cannot attack our spirit, you cannot attack our beliefs that we are one, you cannot attack our hopes, you cannot attack the freedom that we enjoy! Try shaking our spirits, we will shake the world, the new Indian is awake, the new Indian is here and to stay, we are coming to concur the world in every aspect, try stopping us! we have no time to waste thinking and fighting about our religions, about who said what, we just have one goal….taking the burden of this great country called India forward and we the youth promise we will!

     Vande mataram, jai hind!

376. # G.Vinod on 01 Jun 2009 at 12:39 pm

     Hasnanin
     Who are you to say that non-believers of Islam are idiots? First learn to respect
     other religion, which Islam preaches, if you are a true Muslim.

377. # Hasnain on 13 Jun 2009 at 12:11 pm

     Vinod

     just refer the remarks of Punjabi soldier, through out disscussion, then revert back with your views

378. # Sansky on 14 Jun 2009 at 6:31 am

     A possible related post may be this

     http://enewsreport.blogspot.com/2009/05/is-pakistan-playing-with-world.html
     its about how Pakistan is doing a trick, how it is diverting the american aid against India

     Also This
     http://enewsreport.blogspot.com/2007/11/india-pakistan-are-they-forgetting.html

     The discussion is about how India and Pakistan (the two brothers) can defeat terrorism and also how can they make South Asia blooming and an important region if they work together

379. # Ambarish on 21 Jun 2009 at 1:56 am

     Hi friends,

     Don’t fight but try to save. This should be in our mind. If we want peace and progress.

380. # Ganny on 25 Jun 2009 at 10:33 pm

     Guys…Just to remind you….This forum is for evaluation on Military strengths b/w India and Pakistan…. Stop from being carried away from the topic…..

381. # ramesh on 05 Jul 2009 at 12:54 am

     People like M. Robinson should know the full history of kashmir. After independence of India and pakistan during 1947AD, it was pakistan army which first infiltered inside kashmir and looted, slayed even raped the innocent people of kashmir. This is history. You can confirm this with any native kashmiri, they will let you know the truth. By the request of both Maharaja HariSingh and Sheik Adbulla to rescue the people of kashmir, Indian army entered inside kashmir and started chasing away the Pakistani army. With the full support of local kashmiris Indian army chased out the Pakis, and regained around 65% of the land.
     Those days US was with Pakistan and with the help of US, Pak voiced this to UN, and their claim was/is “Kashmir is muslim dominated area, so it belongs to Pakistan”. With the mounding pressure from UN, India halted the operation. It was kashmiri people who wanted Inadian army their, to save them from Pak army. Over a period of time Kashmiri people wanted and ready to merge with India. There were some personal ego clash between the then Indian prime-minister Nehru and Sheik Abdulla which cast the dear, and the process was delayed.

     Pakistan used this opportunity nicely, and played tactics politics. One side with the help of US and UN, it put pressure on India to leave kashmir. Other side it propagandize the Kashmiris with the religious strings. With time the new generation kashmiris forget what pakistan did to them early, and they started approaching this problem as Hindu army vs Muslim army problem. The rest is once again history.

     If pak is really interested in Kashmiri people, then why did it donate a part of occupied Kashmir to China?
     What Pak wanted is China’s support, and not the welfare of kashmiris. Pak sheding crocodile tear for kashimiris, is just a farce. If pak really wanted peace in kashmir, let them leave the POK. Kashmiris will be happy about it.

     No civilians like army in their area. Kashmiris are no exception. If pak go away from Occupied kashmir, Indian army will return to their barracks and the problem will be solved amicably.

382. # Jai Hind on 18 Jul 2009 at 12:55 pm

     Hi, however we(india) did a big mistake to let them allow with one third of kashmir, we should ve demolish the snake before it could grow his teeth.Not a big deal yet- lets ve a war once more and than god swear we ll conquer the whole pakistan and changed its name to fukistan.

383. # Seth on 21 Jul 2009 at 8:55 pm

     State if it sounds True or False (We’ll count just one vote per country or religion):

     If all muslims from the world are transported to a new planet (or if all non-muslims leave earth and settle on a new planet), muslims would still be propagating that their religion and existence is under threat from others. Who knows, somebody flies a spaceship and crashes into the planet where all non-muslims are living.

     Stop it you preachers of hate! Learn to exist peacefully.

384. # Goutam on 27 Jul 2009 at 8:31 pm

     India has launched its first nuclear-powered submarine, becoming only the sixth country in the world to do so.

385. # loged on 28 Jul 2009 at 9:39 pm

     Lets take recent development in kashmir….. few woman’s were raped (I am sorry but fact is fact one cannot deny them) the separatist made hue and Cry morchas dharnas….

     and militants killed family member (one of our brother) 3 year old KID killed along with the father and 60 yr old mother, the separatist when in nut shell….. where are morchas and Dharnas, Road blocking public property destruction which usually done by them….

     I really feel pity for these guys support by pakistan and ISI to carry out such act…. hope they have there brains in right senses they would be a work force which would have changed peoples life in Kashmir…..

     just want to gain power under leader ship pakistan…. they should learn lesson from that state of POK…. where kashmir would be gifted to some nation for Money or Missiles (Which they cannot make) by pakistan

386. # Sunder on 29 Jul 2009 at 3:15 am

     Hello all,

     If there is any bias from my side please excuse me. I am an American naturalized and originally from India. Being said that I am trying to be as much as un-biased as possible.

     Indians say Pakistan is nothing but a terrorist state, Pakistanis say India given the size and economic power is mending the way world looks at Pakistan. Well I am quite confident truth lies somewhere in between. But what puzzles me is why kill innocent people? Be it in Kashmir or Bolochistan (excuse my spelling). Although I am not really sure if there was any loss of human life because of RAW induced insurgency as claimed by Pakistan. See the problem lies in people. Pakistan’s one of the top military officers has accepted that they were able to rally people by having propaganda that Thaliban is Indian financed now and so it is an enemy. That is nothing but pushing the virus killing Pakistan to a higher level. And what happened because of the recent anti-indian propaganda? Civilians were rallying behind government. It is the big boy decisions affecting common people.

387. # Al Khalid on 11 Aug 2009 at 12:30 am

     I would like to pen down my views here on this blog
     1- India no doubt having big army strong economy and many so called friends all over the globe,
     2- India was rewarded with a good infrastructure tons of money and many more un countable blessings by English empire in 1947

     Since 1947 when Pakistan and India came into being, Pakistan is surviving under enormous pressure,(Russians, Israel, US and India)
     1- People migrated from India came to Pakistan were in very bad condition
     2- No infrastructure provided to Pakistan in means of technology, education health, Army even financially,
     3- Pakistan came into being as a Muslim state and this was the key factor where even Muslim countries did not accept Pakistan as a country

     Pakistan had a very hard time to prove itself as a country,
     One can imagine the condition of Pakistan by knowing that there was only 1 typewriter with Pakistan Govt in 1947 on which they use to type all kind of letters,
     Once Quaid-e-Azam Muhammad Ali Jinnah (founder of Pakistan) was ill and some body from Govt send him a pair of socks as a gift which cost the treasury dept 2 rs at that time, Mr Jinnah return the gift with the complement saying that I am a leader of poor nation and I cannot afford these kind of luxury at this time.

     Keeping these factors in mind don’t you think that this is a real miracle that Pakistan is still available on the globe, and still going on an on and on,

     As India always claims that they are much bigger than Pakistan and in fact this is not false even, why they are comparing them self always with Pakistan and running a media war all over the world that Pakistan is a threat not only to India but all over the world.
     We as a Muslims programmed by default to live in piece and harmony,
     Considering the following factors one can easily point out who is right and who is wrong,
     1-What happened to Bosnian and Serb Muslims, in late 80’s and early 90’s (Pakistan army was the one who went there to diffuse the situation)
     2-What happened in Somalia, Sudan and other African countries with Muslims,
     3-What is happening with Palestine since last 60 years,
     4-What happened to east timour
     5-What is happening to Kashmiri Muslims since last 60 years
     6-What happened in Gujrat India with Muslims in early 2000
     7-What happened in Iraq with Muslims,

     Now this is time for Pakistan,
     Pakistani nation is kept busy with the following problems
     1- Electricity
     2- Water problems
     3- Kalashnikov Culture
     4- Lack of basic necessities of life
     5- Lack of life saving drugs
     6- Guantanamo Trained terrorist been deployed in the tribal areas
     7- Pressurizing from both sides India and Afghanistan
     8- Dividing the nation
     9- No sincere leaders’ e.t.c

     In the light of above I would say that if Pakistan is still available on the globe this is a real Miracle and Pakistan will remain to lead the Muslims all over the world

388. # Bushy on 16 Aug 2009 at 9:23 am

     @Al Khalid,

     I did not have enough motivation to read your entire post, but I did find some statements by you worth pointing out.

     1. Lahore was educational hub of entire pre-independence India. And then you say Pakistan had only one typewriter.

     2. Mohammad Ali Jinnah returned socks worth Rs. 2. - Yeah, I can understand that, he was so sympathetic toward the poor Muslims, that he spent merely Rs. 2 Lakh in building his private residence (excluding the land cost) - now known as Pakistan House in Mumbai.

     3. About Pakistan’s existence, the whole world knows it lives on Zakat paid by the ‘non believer/infidel’ U.S.A. so it can kill more Pakistanis. The three major sources of Pakistan’s finances are the U.S., Saudi Arabia ($5mil a day) and IMF (The conditions of which have not been disclosed fearing the resulting public outcry).

     If you read my post carefully, you will realize that I am not dissing at Pakistan, rather I am pointing out the lies in your post. Now I know you will go at lengths to show the flaws in India. Well, you don’t need to. I already know about them. I live here and I know we are yet to do so much to eradicate evils such as poverty and illiteracy, that are still quite rife in India.

     However, if you still feel great zeal to do something, please do it for the good of the poorest person you saw today. The same goes for all my Indian fellows too.

     Finally, I’d like to say that the article is comparison of Military strength of the two countries, so please stick to the topic - And I appeal this not only to the Pakistanis, but also to all the Indians here.

389. # Sansky on 18 Aug 2009 at 6:51 am

     since the two countries got dependent till now we can see where India is today and where Pakistan is. India tested nuclear bomb in 1974, India has 3 science research bases in Antarctica, India now also launches satellites of US, Israel, Belgium, Germany, Italy and many more much advanced countries than India. India provides wheat and Rice to the whole world. India has its presence on moon.Yes India has problems like poverty, illiteracy, but India is doing much better than Pakistan in that direction and India has better records. Pakistan on the other hand is busy in destabilizing India. They talk about dividing India when they attacked Kashmir by saying this they agree that the POK is a part of India. They forget how India broke them into two parts creating Bangladesh in 1971. in wars they couldn’t achieve any victory, thats why they have chosen path of terrorism in the name of religion they are spoiling Pakistani poor citizen’s life. Fearing of the India’s economical development ISI is pushing fake currency in Indian markets to create a hole in India’s economy. They enjoy doing this, after independence they have been doing this thats why today there is so much difference in India and Pakistan.
     ISI has proposed to destabilize India by 2020, stating North India as Islamic republic of Pakistan http://enewsreport.blogspot.com/2009/08/pakistan-proposed-making-india-as.html

390. # Hitman on 19 Aug 2009 at 12:20 pm

     @ all Indians

     with all your fake propaganda and so called military and technical strength and off course with the RUSSIA and Israel, you can’t even ruin 0.1% of Pakistan. ch ch ch ch you can do just claiming about your so called strength, blogging and propaganda and stuff like these and in the end u were always beating your own chest with great depression. Lollz hey Indians cum’on do something like a men….. come and fight us why u always like barking street dogs?? shame on you you are the world most coward nation in the world since your very existing. you always fucked by the invaders…

391. # ganesh on 20 Aug 2009 at 9:45 am

     @khalid

     i think you are very much wrong mainly because if u read the above military powers of the two countries you can observe that most of the equipments in india are indigenious where as most of the equipments of the pakistan military is donated by U.S.

392. # Ketan on 21 Aug 2009 at 1:39 pm

     @ all who think hindus terrorize minorities in india

     most of you guys have given references to
     1) BJP (a hindu party elected to power)
     2) Gujrat riots
     3) Attacks on Christians in orrisa and other south indian states.
     4) caste systems in hindus (Upper castes and lower castes).
     5) Terrorizing Muslims in Kashmir.

     I will like to clarify that these incidents are just situational and dont exactly potray the right image of hindus.
     1) BJP (i support the developments scheme of BJP) was founded in 1880 and was a weak party till late 80’s. Ironically it was this time when reports of cross border terrorism into kashmir made headlines. Indias biggest party at that time Congress (a secular party) failed on many aspects and india needed a strong alternative. The terrorist angle made BJP as a top contender for that alternative. The politicians from BJP grabbed the opportunity with both hands and spearheaded few hardliners (hardliners are common in all religions) into demolition of babri mosque. The then congress government failed to control the situation and congress was in a serious leadership problem. This congress govt was followed by two more congress backed failed govts. With no clear leadership from congress and backed by good performance in few states BJP came to power.
     But the party failed to do what it promised. It failed to take control of Gujrat riots. And now is out of power and on the verge of end leading india in search of another strong opposition to the ruling congress govt.
     “SO ELECTION OF BJP IS NO PROOF OF INDIANS IN FAVOR OF A RELIGIOUS PARTY”

     2) Gujrat riots :- It is a sad part of indian history. A very good example of how some hardliners can spoil name of complete religion. It was not the normal hindu who went on a killing spree against muslims, they were some psychos, most of them are the same one involved in babri mosque demolition. And ruling BJP paid a price for it. They are out of power and are now termed as a sinking ship. Some may say BJP is still in power in gujrat. For that credit goes to local leadership which lead to a strong development of the region.

     3) Attacks on Christians in orrisa and other south indian states. It is true and unfortunate that christians were attacked in some states in india by hindus but i will not put the entire blame of that on hindus. For this the missionaries (Christian) are equally responsible and so are the local secular leaders. The missionaries as per neural reports (check for BBC documentary on you tube) went on a conversion spree in villages in south, some forced, some lured.
     Any religion will not tolerate attack on its support be it muslims or christians or hindus.
     And these incidents were also responsible for poll debacle of religious parties in those states.

     4) caste systems in hindus (Upper castes and lower castes). I really feel sad for this. Unfortunately its still prevalent in most of india. Tough with fast modernization of cities the upper caste atrocities are reducing in cities but are still prevalent in rural india. For this we need strong social reformers like the one we had before independence. Social reformers must stand above the political leaders like ML king Jr. , Nelson Mandela.
     But trust me on this the upper caste hypo crates are facing the consequences of years on injustice done to others. I am a Brahmin and i am facing punishments of what my ancestors did. With reservations in education and govt run institutions we find it difficult to find place good educations institutions and good jobs (may be termed as reason for such high migration of students to USA for education and jobs)
     So indians are not hypo-crates, they are trying (even USA is not free from racial discrimination against color). Or else they would never have termed obama as black president (cmon a president is a president there is nothing like black president or white president).

     5) Terrorizing Muslims in Kashmir. Will not say much on it as i know very little of it. I guess a person who stays there and sees it all first hand is only capable on commenting it.
     Just few a note to pakis :- All your allegations are based primarily
     a) your leaders claim:- they have their political and monetary gains for such allegations (i again refrain from saying whether they are right or baseless).
     b) some small section of foreign media:- Yes the section of foreign media that supports pak claim on it is small. obviously we indians wont agree to that. just like very very little section of americans will ever agree to the videos and claims of some foreign media and local american media which claims 9/11 to be a conspiracy of US govt.

     I feel a strong reason for india (hindustan for most pak political leaders, I am clueless to why) not to be a pro hindu nation is the mildness of hindu religion itself. Hinduism is just like a small guidelines which one hindu may follow. Its neither forces hindus to worship regularly nor forces them to recite gita or listen to it. So many hindus are becoming more liberal and you will be surprised to see that in india valentines day is a bigger occasion than most of indian gods birthday.

     I feel if all religions just follow the same liberalness than war for religion will be a no issue because nobody will be so inclined to lay life in the name of religion.

393. # subhayu on 28 Aug 2009 at 12:18 am

     Guys, both from pakistan and India,

     We know that all the problems that we have are because of

     1. lack of education, which sprouts as misguidance in childhood
     2. Lack of social infrastuctures,
     3. Poverty, unemployment and other such issues,

     No ordinary citizen is interested in hating people from other religion, or pakistan, when at work, and earning daily wage. Its all about the unfed, and idle minds, which are in majority in both the countries, and hence are utilized by the politicians.

     And to be frank, history is always modified t meet the countries interests, and to the the interests of the people, who were in power when history was made.

     As we all agree, pakistan with its current state, will surely fail as a sovereign nation, has it not been the resistance from US/NATO, who are actually blamed by pakistanis.

     Ofcourse, the west is not doing favour to pakistan, but servin their own interst, but pakistan is saved too, as a byproduct.

     Again, religious fanatism, is for those who dont want development, education, awareness, as it can remove them from power, and to those( majority) who are misguided so as to make them human pests.

     Counting hindus and Muslims, will not solve any problem. Ofcourse, the arm race will continue, as from history, in India, we can never trust pakistan leaders. They can initiate attack, whenever it will serve them, but people who will die , will be ( majoriy) pakistani and Indian citizens, who wish to get two times, food, clothing, and shelter.
     Publicly counting the no. of BPL people of each others countries, is a shame for both of us. This comparision is unhealty in nature, and nothing to be proud of.

     Again, India can overpower pakistan ifconventional war is concerned, but then when nuclear option steps in there is destruction for all.

     To all fellow Pakistanis, it is nothing to be ashamed of in accepting that pakistan is militarily weaker than india, as India is with China. Knowing facts only will help you, and also us grow furthur.

     But to remind people of both countries while we are competeing with our strenths, sitting in cozy bed, and laptops, people in both nations are regularly dying of hunger, disease, and suffering from gross injustice.

     For Pakistanis , Please forget about islam for a time being and consider yourself as a citizen of a nation, you will feel how much you need to grow. Religion is the alcohol of the society, and Hinduism is no better than Islam int his regard. I am proud to be an Indian, not a hindu/mulim/sikh. Try to be proud of being a pakistani, not a muslim

     Its a fact that muslims all over the world are recieving hatred, becoz of a few micreants. Would you have been a different person, if u were born a cristian?
     You are great people, and you have equally fought with us against british. We are proud of you, but not your leader, or religeous preachers or ISI.

     For Indians, all discussions of our disintgration and freedom movements, are either based on vested interests of BIG hands, amalgamted with poverty stricken, angry people, with no education, guidance, awareness, employment, and infrasturcture. Our problem doesnt reside in different language, or culture, so dont worry about those comments.
     We still have to grow a long long distance to go. Dont be proud of our achievemet. Supeiority complex never helps.

     British, have you forgotten about your DARK AGE? Norman attacks? the american war of independence, the German air strike, which wud have buried you underground had it not been for USA/USSR.

     Its no doubt many of your etiquettes have been copied as they are good, but you lack one thing, empathy. You are not great, let me say. yes, you colonized India, but you do you know, that you landed in 1601, and fought ur fist war in 1757? for those 150 years, you wer the slaves of Mughal Durbar.

     Your attitude led to the world wars, not the Germans, let me tell you, you can never tolerate others matching you by any means. You are great as a culture, but others are great too. Learn to respect others. There is no credit in drawing borders of India, see your own size first.

     and let me tell you one more thing, Colonization is nothing to be proud of, it is something to be ashamed of, same as terrorism, perhaps, lower as it is state sponsered.

     I do not have any bad feelings bout british citizen, as again they are general people, running in the day for job, and going t sleep tired at night, but your history is nithing to be proud of, dat is the only message I wud like to give you.

394. # raghu on 08 Sep 2009 at 12:27 pm

     Its one hell of a discussion, i dont understand why we Indians have to waste time talking to Pakistanis, they have nothing to prove now, there nation is almost in the verge of vanishing, there bread and butter is been provided by US, they go and stand in front of US president scratching tehre head asking for some money…hahaha…. US wil keep on funding them till War of Agghanistan is going on, after that dont be surprised if u see Pakistani president coming to India for some help ;)… Every pakistani must be feeling that there life would be beter if they had not been partioned from India, but we every Indian think that Partition was a huge bonus for India, or else imagine if all those blunders in pur country…..

395. # Varun on 11 Sep 2009 at 8:10 am

     We are not answerable to anyone in this world. We saw the biggest mistake by Nehru family about going in UN and we having to give up Pakistan Occupied Kashmir. 2nd mistake after war with pakistan we came bak. Thats what make india differnt from pakistan cant c ny1 in pain. Now Pakistan needs 1 war to get out from world map. Everytime pakistan lost even in Kargil They tried what happnd a loss though stratagically they were @ way better position. Well you know wat pakistan do what ever you can. Elastic is strechable And it gets back but 1 day it dont get back That day will be end for pakistan.

396. # Akashwan on 13 Sep 2009 at 10:04 am

     Pakistan has many misconceptions of history. The first is that India never existed in history. Invaders of India may indeed want to believe this. Emperor Ashoka in 300 B.C. created the concept of a united Bharat, which stretched from Arunachal all the way to Tajikstan. From Kashmir to Kanya Kumari. His empire created by his grand father and father and brought to full zenith by him. He spread Buddism all over the known world. And his edicts and symbol the Tri-Murti are the philosphy behind and the symbol of modern India. Pakistan is what has never existed and will cease of exist. Islam is not an India or Aryan religion. It has no reason to be on Indian soil. Iran is the example of an empire which has achieved no greatness because it’s people were force converted to Islam from Zorastrianism. Since the savage Arab invasion in the 600’s Iran has not been able to rise as great empire again. Pakistan has followed this path. It does not acknowlege the violence which made it Muslim, nor it’s Hindu and Buddist past. The fact that they speak a Sanstkrit based language not an Arabic based one. The fact that Iran was a Zorastrian country, who’s ancient text the Avesta is written in Avestan. Avestan a language which is 99% the same as Santskrit. And yet Pakistan thinks they are Arab. And they believe the cult of Muhammad is a religion worth more than the Aryan religion of their ancestors. This is the root of why Pakistan will never survive as a state. It has no future other than destruction.

397. # NavBharat on 15 Sep 2009 at 2:48 pm

     @Akashwan

     If Pakistanis feel great about their religion and origination from Arabia, its OK, let them migrate back to Saudi Arabia, a big piece of undeveloped empty land piece are available there for their new inhabitation and settlement. The current land of Pakistan is purely Indian who are the one long inhabited and developed that land for many millenniums years. So the name Pakistan will cease to exist in the future.

398. # faiz on 16 Sep 2009 at 12:31 am

     From the last ten years, I have heard from Indians in thousands of forums like this one, how they are going to destroy Pakistan with their paper tiger army, air force, navy & their state of the art weaponry.
     After hearing all those rants from Indians for the last ten years, I came to one conclusion:

     Indians are either cowards or they are idiots.

     They are cowards because after 15 years of saber rattling against Pakistan, they didn’t do anything to teach Pakistan so called lessons. They didn’t destroy any so called terrorist camps within Pakistan; they simply put their tails between their legs.
     Or Indians lack in planning attack on Pakistan because they are idiots. We the Pakistanis can help Indians in this regards. We can help you idiots in planning what you idiots are dreaming for long time that is how to attack Pakistan. Just put ads in your newspapers requesting us for help in this regard. We will do all the planning for you idiots. Please don’t waste anymore time, we are waiting for you. We will accord you the same welcome like you got from Mohammad Ghazvani. Please, please don’t be a paper tiger anymore, attack Pakistan.

     So Indians, are you cowards or idiots, or may be both?

399. # G.Vinod on 17 Sep 2009 at 1:08 pm

     During the Kargil war the Pakistanis were not even brave enough to
     receive the bodies of their dead soldiers and so we know who the real
     paper tigers are. The former president of Pakistan has admitted that
     they have utilised U.S aid for upgrading their defence. We can only
     feel bad for the people of Pakistan as the aid should have actually
     gone to them but instead it went for building missiles and guns.

400. # NavBharat on 17 Sep 2009 at 5:17 pm

     @Faiz

     By using the word “idiot” manytimes in your blog which came out from your mind indicates that really you are that one.

     It is not destroying Pakistan, just disappearance of that name which means converting Pakistan people back to original Indians and rejoining both countries together. It will take sometime. It is no so easy since two huge mass of people with different religious thoughts had been seperated by someone’s poison which worked efficiently due to our our lack of understanding, determination, and poor integration.

     If you talk about cowardness, standing one to one and do the sword fight is the braveness. All the latest technological fights are really a act of cowardness. Standing few hundred kilometers away and throwing a fire onto others is really a cowardness, flying few thousand kilometers high to drop a bomb on others and escape away in supersonic speed also a type of cowardness. Killing poor public without any humanity using human or any kind of bomb is a utter cowardness. Killing other religion’s people in the name of never seen God is an absolute cowardness.

     The reason and the way of Pakistan & Bangladesh separated from India was nonsensical, ridiculous, and arrogance. That reason will lose power over the time and people in Pakistan will realize in the future of their mistakes.

401. # amit on 18 Sep 2009 at 12:04 pm

     @ Faiz,

     FAIZ BOUGHT A SECOND HAND LAPTOP FROM SCRAP DEALERAND DECIDES TO PUT COMMENTS ON INDIA……..

     India will kill the DOG pakistan at its wish ,whenever if feels like we, before we destroy pakistan we want to see pakistan in a situation where a man eats man and see its happening, It doesnt takes an effort to destroy a weak country like pakistan. I think we are waiting for the right time…..why does India has to waste efforts in waging a war in pakistan when the same job is done by pakistani’s themselves…….

     And for Ghaznavi……when Ghaznavi came to India and converted most of them forcefully to Islam so there were lot of people at that time who lost their real identity which a few centuries later lead to creation of pakistan and now those people got courage to speak against their ancestors…..So guys help Faiz to regain his identity.

     faiz it appears that you live in the states, you would know it better how a pakistani is accepted in US or UK, they must be calling you a Paki(a derogatory word in itself)

402. # Zeeshan on 25 Sep 2009 at 4:56 am

     Dear Brothers.
     I have read all comments the informations provided by Pakis and Indians are different.. I think no one among us knows the truth. Indians have info according to which they r heros and Pakistanis have info according to which they r heros.
     First we need to confirm all informations me have not only frm our countrymen but 4rm neutral which knows about history of sub-continent..

403. # Raj on 25 Sep 2009 at 9:26 am

     The major powers are successful in keeping the heat up between these two countries and making the most out of it. U.S, China, Russia and other developed nations are selling billions of worth Military goods to these countries carrying the cash. These are hard earned money by you (my friends in pakistan) and me. The money worth of spending on education, health and other necessity instead of putting them on unused missiles and jets.(it applies for both countries). Pakistan always talks about treatement of muslims in india by non-muslims. Why dont they raise their voice with China on their treatement to muslims and condemn the violent act of the chinese. Many muslims are silently executed and still some are on trial. China would always want pakistan to be rogue nation in its hands to keep this region unrest. They didnt allow pakistan to take their share of the IT revoultion (poor pakistanis). All that is needed is a serious change in the attitude of the leaders and security installations. Hope peace and prosperity prevails in this region.

404. # NavBharat on 28 Sep 2009 at 4:33 pm

     The most life enjoying Muslims are living in India. We created numerous rich, powerful, popular, and scholar Muslims in our country, and we allowed them to proliferate from 5% to 15% in the last 60 years of independance. On the other hand in Pakistan, 25% of original Hindu population disappeared and reduced now to 1%. Most of the Hindu temples demolished, and country itself declared as Islamic State. They have no rights at all to talk about Muslims in India.

     Pakistan fell in the hands of China’s grip and they can’t get out from there anyway. Pakistan is not going to realize its blunder mistake of friendship with China. China is using Pakistan as a puppet to threaten India. Who are the Pakistanis and who gave their current living place? They are ex-Indians and their land is ours. They are getting knife from the neighbor to kill their own mother and brother. These people are the most sinful people on the earth.

     Jinna betrayed Gandhi by getting bribe from British for the separation of the country. His evil decision caused hell on Indian land during separation. He put hatred fire in everybody’s heart against India. Pakistan is going to be destroyed by the same fire in the future. Irrespective of whatever the weapons they possess, their fate can’t be changed by anyone or any country (esp. China).

405. # Dan on 29 Sep 2009 at 3:30 am

     I think you guys are maiisng the big picture,it is in the interest of both nations to prosper and grow by bonding together as was the link historically 60 odd yeaqrs of estrangement is no big deal in thousands of years of togetherness. Let everyone forget about the past bad blood and start fresh,what say you?? Is there hope still?? I think that combined together we can be the biggest social,cultural,economic and political power block in the world,this is good both for India and pakistan. More of our neighbours would then want to join the bandwagon. So cheers,be positive!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

406. # indian masiha on 30 Sep 2009 at 6:25 pm

     @Every One
     I am reading so called comparitive blog of India-Pakistan armed forces capabilities. I would like to divert your attention towards a report named “ASIA 2025″ published by US Dept. of Defense.The report logically provide the upcoming situations in the conflicted indo pak terittory. It states that Pakistan will be adversely affectedby its own civil war and afhan border battles.Worse, by a decade, Pakistan will be vanished from the World Map and a large part of North West Pakistan Frontier and POK will br run under Indian Autononous Body.
     Please visit or download Official US Deptt of Defense report:

     http://www.dod.mil/pubs/foi/reading_room/967.pdf

407. # jason on 01 Oct 2009 at 10:58 am

     i think Pakistan is better coz Pakistani is using the American weapons and American trained Pakistani army and they look likes American but Indians army still look old if you have world best training and latest weapon than you can defeat every country.

408. # RedRussian on 06 Oct 2009 at 1:12 am

     Yo guys if the need was great and dire India woudl be able to take Pakistan. However It is not a desperate situation so they are chilling for now. However IF it did break out i belive indias major advantage in population/hardware would over take pakistan. and also gusy how can pakistan win??? please tell me how pakistan woudl be able to take over india?? its a race to the bottom for pakistan because all they can do is defend. my opinion

409. # HC on 06 Oct 2009 at 4:43 am

     You guys are crazy. Forget the past. I am an NRI and have tons of hatred for the nationalist hindus that run the country. Indira kuthi maro juthi. Let’s not forget the Golden Temple, let’s not forget Babri Masjid. Fanatic hindus are no different than other extremists.

     Back to warfare. Conventionally, Pakistan would be destroyed within a week. India has nearly 1000 more fighter jets of which some are new SU-30 MKI variants. They have nearly 2000 more tanks than Pakistan of which India is making 1000 more Russia T-90 tanks which are the best in the world.

     India already is building 2 aircraft carriers and Russia is giving another which will make 4 aircraft carriers for India. Not to mention they have already made their first nuclear submarine which serves as a second-strike nuclear capability. If Pakistan nukes India, India can nuke back from the sea now.

     Pakistan’s only hope would be China. But China wouldn’t risk everything they have accomplished to help Pakistan fight India. You think US or Russia would like China attacking India? You think the Chinese in Beijing want to see millions of their countrymen die for Pakistan?

     All Pakistan has left is a nuclear deterrence of which India will soon have the capability to destroy before any nukes are launched thanks to radar and warning systems from Israel.

     Just like Pakistan is inferior to India, India is inferior to China, which is inferior to Russia, which is inferior to the US.

     If any way happened, it would be a 1-2 week of solid fighting before a cease-fire is declared. India defence budget is now at 40 billion USD while Pakistan barely affords more than 6 billion.

     Instead, let’s be brothers like we were for thousands of years before the british. Pakistan should fight internal poverty and terrorism while India should fight poverty also.

410. # RedRussian on 08 Oct 2009 at 7:31 am

     Yo man cause you hate em doesnt eman they are bad. And cut your inferior crap out cause no country is inferior. But ya on teh topic Pakistan can not win. There is always a chance fr miracles but a conventional war will be lost by pakistan but so will a nuclear. The fighting over teh Kashmire will continue until China starts acting. But otherwise Pakistan coudl get help from otehr countries but whome? America? i dont belive that would be aproved by the goverment. That could create alot fo tension and if enough is made it coudl hurt the US economy. Russia is a weapons provider to India and China doesnt care as much. So unless UN wakes up Pakistan will disapear

411. # message on 09 Oct 2009 at 8:15 am

     Dear Readers and viewvers and others

     I am proud to be Indian Muslim first, we in india we have learned the how live and let live and the difficulties and solutions. in other neighbouring countries only problems and no solutions crime rate is high in them , look the pakistanis and pak sports teams are involved openly in Bettings and match fixings , is this the attitue of the national teams if this is the attitute of the teams to get the match fixed for personal and monetary gains what about the pak army tomorrow they fix the crime, terrorism, war etc look the corruption in the judiciary , look at how mr choudary stick for his seat rather than his duty, most of the pak people accepted british cultures and tradition and the poor people let for misery and harship, no nationalsim in their hearts and minds if they fix the matches tomorrow they fix the crimes , judgements etc look at indian systems we have strong ethics and integrity and national values and consenses for the nationalism, we have learned the co existence and development .compared to our neighbouring countries, we never accept the involvement of their country in our internal affairs and international affairs it is decided by the people of India only, see navaz sharif conducted the conference in dubai for security reasons at home, he staryed in exile in SA what are their sacrifices for the nation and what are their concerned towards people, you people lost one arm alredy, due to their bad administration and diplomacy

412. # Soumyadeep Dey - Indian on 09 Oct 2009 at 12:40 pm

     I have been watching this thread for quite a long time now. Thought of giving comments earlier but did not.

     My humble request to all of you… first of all please stop fighting… it won’t solve anything… we in the sub-continent always talk about our history and forget about our future in doing so…

     To all the Pakistanis: Please do not try to alienate the Indian Muslims or any other minority communities for that matter. They are as much as Indian as rest of the others. Indian Muslims are Indian too, some of them are misguided, some of Hindus are also misgiuded which doesn’t mean the entire community is wrong. You guys poke around our internal problems and use them as your shield, I want to say that each and every country in this world has problems. India has it, Pakistan has it (Baluchistan, FATA), Even China, US, UK… all of them have it. So leave it to individual countries. Let us solve our own problems, keep your nose out of it. If you are talking about war, India is much more superior to Pakistan. But war will never help. It will take both the countries to stone age. So let us put the word “WAR” aside. I love my country as you do so please talk some sense.

     To all Indian Brothers:
     Fight is not the solution brothers!!! And I think we don’t have to accentuate the fact who is mightier and who is great. Each and every country is great for its own citizens. And for my lovely country… the whole world knows where we are heading. Time has and will tell what we are capable of doing (please don’t take this comment otherwise). We will be a major global player very.
     Pround to be an Indian!!! JAI HIND!!!

     To all of us:
     I am totally agree with Mr. Dan’s comments. We are estranged since birth, time has come to put the differences apart. There are so many problems in and around the world… Global warming, Season change etc to name some. All of us should work together to make this world a better place. If we don’t do so the existence of entire living species in the world will be in danger. AND we won’t be there to fight a war even… lol.

413. # HC on 11 Oct 2009 at 9:25 am

     After seeing how 5 militants were able to infiltrate the Pakistan Army Headquarters and murder 6 soldiers and 2 commandos, Pakistan should focus more on internal terrorism than neighboring india.

     I mean 9 militants attacked and 4 died but 5 got through in which they even killed a Pakistani Brigadier and LT. Colonel.

     Instead of India, focus on fighting terrorism first. Pakistani and Indian brothers and sisters lived as one for hundreds of years. Let’s focus on terrorism and poverty.

414. # Saadat Siddiqui on 12 Oct 2009 at 12:21 pm

     Indian Armed forces are in large number but no sense of warfare…Pakistani Soliders PAF,NAVY and Army are more superior then Indians as it is proved in 1965 war… PAF fighter pilots displayed excellent warfare abilities like M. M. Alam who destroyed 5 indian aircraft in a row with Sabr a low profile aircraft…Pakistan RMY are much prefered in UN peacekeeping mentions all over the world…please correct you knowledge…

415. # A K Afridi on 12 Oct 2009 at 10:06 pm

     Well, I would add that by no mean India would risk its economy to deteriorate, on the other hand Pakistan would not care!
     Pakistan nation is always ready for such risk, but due to internal conflict created by US would take longer to come out of. Its 21 century the should resolve Kashmir issue and establish vast business measures!

416. # Balaji on 14 Oct 2009 at 1:43 pm

     History is history. What we have to do is create our own history with peace and unity!!. That will be the history of the future!!! Consider a small scenario, After 100s of years from now we hear this in lessons for our young!!

     1.Once Pakistan and India were enemies and fighting each other, but now are good friends.
     2.Terrorism is abolished from pakistan soil!
     3.Joined forces of indo-pak army!!
     4.Not even a single army men in border!! and people celebrating the festivals together!!

     Every good hearted people in this world will welcome this!! All these responsibilities are in our hands and we make the future!!!

     If we are still talking about history and start blaming on others again and again, its like a railway track which will never join(even where it ends)

417. # Kamaljeet Singh on 20 Oct 2009 at 1:46 pm

     Correction my friends .. it’s LIVE not LEAVE in previous commnets .. sometime emotions take over …

418. # Vikas on 20 Oct 2009 at 2:29 pm

     I have been following this thread for sometime. I basically oppose the idea of trumpeting own bugle the whole world is looking up to India, So forget about saying that we are strong or great, everyone knows who is who. Let smallers whine and self satisfy themselves.
     At the same time I would like to say rather believe that common public in both the countries shares same problems and living in peace together will help only both of us

419. # Debabrata Bose on 22 Oct 2009 at 11:42 pm

     I think we are drifting away from the real problem. We have not choosen out neighbour and also we can’t do anything about taliban in Pakistan. Pakistan’s citizen never had any say in their own country and are always governed by Military dictators. We Indians should not forget that years of military dictatorship has distroyed its basic cultural and social fabrics. One one side they blame USA for their misery and on other they take Military and monitary help from them. They do not know that they should thank USA or hate them. Their military has created terrorists to keep India bleeding. But they did not know what to do now as the same people has started hurting them. I want to tell all pakistani citizen (not military people) that none of the evidence given by us on Mumbai attack will be acceptable by you and if even Alah tells you that India is right then also you will not believe him. If pakistan do not want our help to help them destroy taliban from their country then it their misfortune. I just want one simple answer from any of the Pakistani friend here, India has a policy of no first use of Nuclear weapon but why Pakistani do not have same policy. May allah and Shiv live in peace up there.

420. # Shrish Singh on 24 Oct 2009 at 6:34 pm

     Pakistani politicians as well as Indian politicians should peacefully talk nd become friends and drop out all the aspects for D war…….

421. # Shrish Singh on 24 Oct 2009 at 6:39 pm

     Pakistan needs to do a lot on terrorism. Pakistan has been facing political crisis for the past 15 years. There is no one person in pakistan who takes moral responsiblity of what is happening. Where is Pervez Musharraff? Where is Nawaz Sheriff. It is hard to believe on Pakistani leadership. According to me only thing that Pakistan can overcome terrorism is stop religious teachings in Schools and colleges and bring a good leader who can work towards maintaining peace in the subcontinent.

422. # R.Duman on 27 Oct 2009 at 1:38 pm

     In conclusion, there is no conclusion. If there was no Hindu and Muslims, there would’ve been other religion to fight over. If there were no Arabs, USA would find some other race to fight(or F***) with. Its not a laughing matter for those who has to fight the war, as for me its simply entertainment. Just look at the bold guy on Discovery channel showing futuristic weapons and all. We all get glued to TV when there is a gun fight or booming of some building. No need to waste anger and hate. Its just entertainment.

423. # Mahendra on 28 Oct 2009 at 3:50 pm

     It’s not politicians but people of country decide real way to move as they select them.
     But I know, as I am from village , that in rural level schools still this India v/s Pakistan is taught but as I grow up and come to city level, I understood that extremist are real danger to respective country. They don’t respect other person’s opinion. India has largest number of muslims. And in one recent bollywood movie named ‘1971′ showed a conversion 2 Indian army men:
     1: Is there Punjabies in Pakistan?
     2: Yes
     1: Is there Shikh in Pakistan?
     2: Yes
     1: Is there Sindhi?
     2: Yes
     1: And these Muslim brothers also live in Pakistan.
     2: So what?
     1: I was thinking that if all these(punjabi, shikh, sindhi) live in India also.
     2: So?
     1: Then why did they created Pakistan?
     2: they made mistake. It won’t happen again.

     Please both countrymen understand this thing. Both countries or there people are not against each other. But some extremist, might be Politician, Army men or spiritual leaders, always try to keep this fight alive as they are getting benefit out of it.

     So it’s our , young generation’s responsibility to prosper out nation and for that help our neighboring country. I always try to tell older generation that this fight won’t help anyone. Although Pakistan is under military rule, a general person should always try to develop his home & village by education(may be in any language). Here in Pakistan, girls can’t learn so his family can’t grow. In India although there is poverty, many are educated and know how to grow and take effective decisions about their politicians.

     Reunite Pakistan n India, you will have great future and
     DON’T FORGET TO TELL YOUR NEIGHBORS REAL SITUATION & TO LOVE PAKINDIAN .

424. # Rushi - an Indian on 31 Oct 2009 at 6:46 am

     I read many of the posts here and they are mind blowing. It really improved my knowledge. I am not here to comment as you guys already did enough. I really appreciate few comments from few british people (as being an indian, I dont want to be biased by indian’s comment), for example comments from Jack and few other people. Those comment do sound geniun to me as being british people, they are not biased, atleast. I just like to say one thing.

     ALL TERRORIST, STOP KILLING PEOPLE. LIVE IN PEACE.

425. # steven on 01 Nov 2009 at 12:33 am

     The truth is that Indian and Pakistani people have very similar cultures, traditions, languages and they have lived as one nation for thousands of years.

     The real problems started when Pakistan decided to go its own independent way, even now india still finds it difficult to accept Pakistan as an indepenent nation.

     Where Kashmir is a big issue for Pakistan. I think if the issue of Kashmir is resolved then there will be no cause for conflict between the two nations.

     But sadly where european countries are removing their borders and becaming much more accessible for people to travel, where as in India and Pakistan close members of families are waiting to see their love ones for thirty or even forty years.

     India is much bigger country than Pakistan and it must continue to act responsibly with care for other smaller neighbouring countries to gain more respect and to be play a key nation rule.

     This contribution is based on my knowledge of both countries.

426. # amy kaur on 03 Nov 2009 at 12:54 am

     I have recently come across this site and seen some of the previous contributors comments.

     We must remember that India and Pakistan are two different size and population countries.

     India must make it comparison with china and prove the world its fighting skills and military strengths but proving its capabilities against much smaller neighbour makes it appear that india is a bully.

     I approve Stevens comments we british are fair minded truth speaking people.

     I am going to conclude by saying every time i visit india its constantly on my mind the word india is for foreign audience but for home audiences are Bharat or Hindustan and what about for other minorities ??????????

427. # Ayman on 04 Nov 2009 at 8:22 am

     I think in case a war will take place (God forbid) both India & pakistan are losers. It is not a matter who is stronger than the other it is a matter who will lose more.

428. # Suresh Dhoni on 08 Nov 2009 at 11:20 am

     @Ayman

     I completely agree with you. India and Pakistan should be focusing on eliminating terrorism. It’s the matter of inferiority which Pakistan keeps blaming India for the self trouble. For one Pakistan NEEDS to get their asses up and start doing something about the terrorists instead of
     procrasinating by using U.S funds.

429. # Steven on 11 Nov 2009 at 12:05 am

     @ Sam
     I am pleased to read that India has started to follow the Chinese stretegy to built up the enconomy.

     That should have been done years ago but India has long away to go before it will catch China. Chineses has advanced a great deal economically and miltarly in recent years and they are investing heavly in developing countries especially in African countries to make profits and win influence.

     China is now seen as one of the world true heavy weights.

430. # Hussainon 16 Nov 2009 at 6:00 pm

     Indian terrorism in Srilanka, Bangladesh and now by supporting terrorist in Pakistan are nothing new.

     India is the biggest terrosit supporter and heaven in the region and corrupt RAW must be banned by Indian government else it will drown whole India.

431. # Sam on 17 Nov 2009 at 3:55 pm

     @Hussain

     Why blame India? The Taliban was funded and supported by the Pakistan govt in the 1980s. Now the chicken are coming home to roost. As they say, if you sow the wind, you will reap the whirlwind. I hope that they will never get capture power in Pakistan, the last thing that any one wants is to let some relegious fanatics get control of nuclear weapons.

     I do agree with you that India supported the “liberation” of Bangladesh (the former east Pakistan), but the “West Pakistan” helped a lot more in the liberation by carrying out massacres of the Bangladeshi civilians (documented by the Blood telegram).

     @Sean
     I agree that India has a long way to go. I am not sure if the Indian democracy is a big help in that. I get the feeling that when one govt wins, it changes all the policies set by the predecessor, and also the parties in the opposition do everything possible to stall the policies by calling on “strikes”. In China, there is no problem with any dissent.

432. # Mohammed India on 18 Nov 2009 at 9:59 pm

     Dear Hussain, The world knows who has terriosm, and people are not stupid ,, I am a muslim (Indian) and proud of being it,, You are saying India is the terrerist supporter !!!,, that means the world is just pakistan for you guys,, be in the world,, Match the preception with others and go ahead,, Else,, the Result will be in the ground ,, and you will see !

433. # Rushi - an Indian on 19 Nov 2009 at 2:30 am

     @Sam
     To be honest with you, I cannot agree with your last comment “when one govt wins, it changes all the policies set by the predecessor”. I dont know about how communism works in china but I do know how democracy work in india. I have seen that happening in US that policies made by George W. Bush have been changed by Barak obama but I have not seen the same thing in india… In US its possible because US is already developed country and they can afford twisting policies but when it comes to india, India wants to develope her country. India cannot afford twsiting with risk. Whichever govt comes, I bet, whatever they do, they do for development of india. (may not be on fast track like china but results are guranteed.)

434. # Zubair Sikandar on 24 Nov 2009 at 9:37 pm

     I just want to clear to all of you that we are Muslims and we are very peace full and kind. those who are doing wrong things in Pakistan or others like (Suicide Bombing terrorist activities etc) they are not Muslims.

     Dear all every body has died and then no nationally so why are you fighting so come together and work for the betterment of humanity.Lets make all the countries beautiful lets make good relations then your are a good man otherwise you are same like militants…………………………………..

435. # Sau on 25 Nov 2009 at 8:57 am

     Pure Democracy is the only solution in pak for which they have to cut their army size (without fearing India, india is not going to attack).

436. # Steve on 25 Nov 2009 at 11:16 am

     Look you all people , each one of us must know that we all are humans ( before associating ourself to any religion or region). I feel instead of talking about history we work on the problem associated with our society at present and share the solution to make the World a better place to live and hope we have a sustainable existence. Both India and Pakistan has too many mouths to feed and economic disparity is large.”Conflicts keep you unaware of basic needs of life”.Whether Indian or Pakistani or Chinese (whatever you call yourself ) instead of enforcing some of your presumption
     try to analysis situation with a human aspect in mind .WE ALL ARE HUMAN AND WE HAVE BASIC NEEDS. HAVE RESPECT FOR EACH OTHER. BE A BETTER PERSON. IF GOD(OR ALLAH OR DEV ) IS HERE HE WON’T BE THAT CRUEL TO DIVIDE US LIKE THIS. I won’t argue with you all.I LOVE YOU ALL WITHOUT ANY CONDITION. HAVE A BETTER LIFE.

437. # Sunil Kairon on 26 Nov 2009 at 2:11 pm

     @Muslim Indians in this post
     You guys are really a proud for us…Don’t associate some assholes from Gujrat to the whole Hindus…due to some pseudo Hindus all hindus were ashamed in gujrat…
     We love you people and all others whih are peaceful and religious..
     you have made us proud in Bollywood,defense,cricket…abd politics also..
     you are the true believers and real Allah’s bande..

     @Pakis
     Most of you guys are very sensible but some are bitter to other religions…
     I agree that Pakistan has traveled a long way from newly born poor country to ‘most powerful muslim nation’…But dont blame India for attacks in your country..
     India was always helpful:
     -India gave Pak first International help in 1947…which was half of India’s 1st budget
     -India never attacked Pak only defended itself
     -India never crossed international border…even when Pak lost battle and 90000 soldiers laid their weapon down..
     -It was India who always started peace talks and bus-train service..

     But Pak always consider India as biggest enemy I don’t know why..

438. # shrikant on 26 Nov 2009 at 2:49 pm

     All intellectuals and politicians in Pakistan should take the terrorism threat very seriously or the country will be split like Somalia by war lords (including some from the army). The strong moderate voice in India has ensured that democracy survives and peoples reactions are kept in balance.

     The Pakistani moderates should take to the streets and educate children in schools, the youth and the villages about the stark realities of daily violence. It is your responsibility to leave a nation for your children, and not create a primitive religious society.

439. # sanjay on 28 Nov 2009 at 8:22 am

     i fully agree with wat shrikant has said. it is in the benefit of the pakistan for the educated section of the pakistani people to come forward and pressurise the govt to take strict actions against all those who r propogating terrorism of any kind, whether it is against india or against pakistan

440. # pakistani on 28 Nov 2009 at 9:01 pm

     At G.VINOD

     Too scared

441. # sanjay on 29 Nov 2009 at 5:02 pm

     to Zubair Sikandar ,
     couldn’t agree with u more. u where absolutely right in saying that we as citizens of our respective countries r responsible for maintaining peace with our neighbours instead of just blaming each others and its people like G.VINOD and pakistani who don’t want this tension to die down

442. # David on 01 Dec 2009 at 4:24 am

     I have been reading comments from many contributors but endorse the comments from Steven and Amy which appear to be fair and interesting!

443. # Rahul on 02 Dec 2009 at 4:16 am

     @ Ayman

     India will never attack Pak… Definitely not with a nuke…

     I mean the Pakis are so excellent in destroying their own country that its not worth for India to waste her artilleries…

     As far as nuclear war head is concerned… it probably takes more money to manufacture one than what the destruction it will cause if used against our western neighbor!!

444. # G.Vinod on 04 Dec 2009 at 4:04 pm

     Pakistani
     Too scared?? Why??

     Sanjay
     Iam not here to create tension and Iam sure that my posts will
     not create any unrest between India and Pakistan.

445. # HC on 05 Dec 2009 at 1:45 am

     Just today, pakistan terrorists killed 40 people inside mosque praying. It was near the capital and many children died. They targeted high ranking officers and their families. 1 major-general, brigadier, colonel, LT. Colonel and many other officers and their families died.

     And yet, Pakistani’s think Indians are their enemies. The very people Pakistan wanted to help them in fighting proxy war in India are now turning and attacking Pakistan itself.

     Their is still hope and time. We all shared one land before 1947 and so we all have to stop this. Innocent children are dying in these bombings in pakistan each day.

446. # anna on 07 Dec 2009 at 12:49 pm

     David/ Amy:

     You Brits seperated pakistan from India. You see a great threat on united india , so you seperated a part from india and named it as pakistan(seperate and rule policy).

     India and pakisthan people are not against each other.
     Firts you(brits and US) stop killing people in pakistan and leave pakistan alone. Then india and pakistan will sit together and resove the kashmir issue

447. # david on 09 Dec 2009 at 5:36 am

     @Anna

     I disagree with your comments.

     The fact of the matter is that Hindus and Moslims were constantly fighting with each other during pre-indepences of India and Pakistan, so what we Brits did was to forfill the wishes of the minority Moslims population and granted them an independent country Pakistan.

     We have very large Pakistani community living in UK and every Pakistani i have met has thanked Brits for giving them independent country, but they also complaint bitterly about the lack of leadership shown by Britain on the issue of Kashmir at the time of partitions.

     Please remember since the indepences both countries have fought three wars and are constantly at each others throats.

     Its an easy excuse to blame it on Britain, i will simply ask why there has not been peace between the two countries and why the issue of Kashmir has not been resolved in over sixty years?………..

     I blame on India more then Pakistan for failing to show the leadership qualities and not genuinely being interested in making peace with Pakistan, after all India is much more stable.

     Once again im happy to admit we Brits are fair minded and tolerant people and we often speak our minds.

448. # RanVeer on 09 Dec 2009 at 2:58 pm

     Further the point regarding military strength, there is no doubt that both at tactical and strategic levels, Pakistan Armed forces are way behind us. On the contrary, this can not become the grounds for any nation to wage a war on another sovereign country. Gone are the days when political bosses could safely sit in their democratic palaces and order there armies to go to war. A full fledged war between India and Pak would mean total annhilation of both the state. And people who talk and challenge others to come and fight would also see there homes being bombed, because this time the battle would not be restricted to a few sectors,but courtsey the modern weapon tech, every nook and corner of both the countries would be effected. I better not talk about the fate of economy

449. # no religion on 11 Dec 2009 at 8:55 pm

     I am from pakistan and read every body coment. When i look into the history of 2 country. I feel shamed. My contry pakistan is one of the courrept contry. Open up my country men ans see what happening in our country. Our political people bring kashmir every time because they don’t have anything better to do. If kashmir want to be independent why we are so much worried bout that. Let india deal with it. But we are sending our people to die there because we have nothing better to do. All reach people in our country are army people. why? Why we are soo much intrested to know that in india so many people die and feel happy when something happen wrong there. What wrong with us. Politically we are not good clean up our beautiful pakistan and stop looking towards india.

450. # sanjay on 12 Dec 2009 at 8:46 am

     david,
     I guess you don’t know what you are talking about. We Indians were under the moghal rule before you brits robbed us out. These moghal rulers were all Muslims who ruled our country for nearly 700 years. And there had not been a single instance of Hindu-Muslim communal riots before the brits came here. It was you guys who used your divide and rule policy to create a rift between us. And in 1947 when you knew that you couldn’t rule our country any more you decided to blow up the country into many pieces. You guys are the creators of a war that started nearly 100 years ago and which is still going on. Thanks to you “tolerant” people that our country got split.

451. # human on 12 Dec 2009 at 2:23 pm

     amy

     i want to tell u a fact that ‘hindusthan’ means ‘the land where sindhu flows’.sindhu is the sanskrit name for the river indus but persians pronounced it as ‘hindu’ and ‘than’ means land.it has nothing to do with hindus or muslims.

452. # The Truth on 13 Dec 2009 at 6:36 am

     There is no comparesion of any sought between India & Pakistan, right from the economy to army, education to progress and development, and politics to socio - economic status. Pakistan is nearly a failed state and is a safe heaven for terrorists and is an International house of terrorism. I do not mean to say all Pakistani are terrorists but MOST of the terrorists are Pakistani. It would be wise for Pakistan to compare itself with Bangladesh, Bhutan, Nepal, Afganistan or Sri Lanka, not to compare with India. A wall lizard or a chamelion can never be compared with a gaint crocodile. Pakistan and India both should be focused on their grass root problems of education, corrruption, malnutrition and poverty to bring up their socio economic status. If Pakistan is INTERNATIONAL HOUSE OF TERRORISM, India is an International house of TUBERCULOSIS and LEPROSY. Though India has found the right way and marching ahead to the right direction it need to focus on health status of its people, where as Pakistan is still following with Taliban to an unknown destination, that certainly will lead them to destruction. And if India fails to irredicate TUBERCULOSIS & LEPROSY, still will remain handicapped, despite its much artificial economic growth. I being an Indian know our grassroot problems and speak openly about them, why you Pakitani don’t accept that terrorism is the grass root problem of Pakistan. Forget any progress unless you overcome terrorism.

453. # G.Vinod on 13 Dec 2009 at 9:29 am

     David
     The issue of Kashmir was not solved at the time of independence
     and that is the reason for the wars between India and Pakistan.
     I would blame Brits for this because they should have solved this
     problem before leaving.

     “I blame on India more then Pakistan for failing to show the leadership qualities and not genuinely being interested in making peace with Pakistan, after all India is much more stable”

     What kind of leadership qualities did Britain show before attacking Iraq??? Did they get the approval of U.N to attack Iraq?? Did Britain show any interest to make
     peace with Iraq?? Britain blindly follows the policy of the U.S as far as the
     foreign policy is concerned and hence I don’t see any proper leadership qualities in them.

454. # Patrick on 14 Dec 2009 at 1:10 pm

     india has never boasted bout its nuclear strenghth as pakistan does always…as indias no first use doctrine barres it from nuking pakistan, had it been non existent pakistan would hav been R.I.P since 27 nov 08..

455. # david on 15 Dec 2009 at 5:10 am

     @ G Vinod

     Being honest open and fair minded people we are, i accept the failing of Britain to resolve the issue of Kashmir before leaving India.
     Kashmir was a majority moslim state and we should have taken the views of the state citizens and should have allowed them to be part of the moslim Pakistan.
     Quite frankly if we Brits had shown the leadership quality on the issue then there would have been millions of happy Kashmiri people and i wouldn’t have been stopped by British Kashmiri people and complaint.

     Regards to the Iraq war, Great Britain is a permanent member of United Nation and this issue was debated in UN several times before the war was finally declared. Great Britain and America have good understanding about each others views and we have common goals unlike Indians and Pakistanis who can’t even discuss the issue of Kashmir without walk outs and India is terrified about Pakistan raising this unresolved and pending issue of Kashmir at the UN! May i ask why is that? when they can’t resolve it amicably between the two countries. The truth of the matter is we are talking about the suffering of ordinary people and how long their suffering will go on until the world will say enough is enough!

456. # Adam on 21 Dec 2009 at 8:42 am

     Ms Amy

     India in 1947 captured the kashmir because the raja was hindu and he requested the indian army to intervene and india captured the same on the other hand there was a state called “Hyderabas” where the Raja was muslim and majority population was hindu. India also captured Hyderabad on the basis that Majority of populatin was hind. This was 180 degree turn from KAshmir policy. India is not a country without flaws. India alls her self to be biggest democracy in world but eher are some facts.

     1- Indian government promised plebiscite in kashmir which never happend to this day.

     2- Indian government killied thousands of Sikh in Golden temple

     3- Hindu extremists destrioyed 500 yuers old BAbro mosque and again killed muslims in 1992. Also indian army burned the HAzrat Bal mosque in kashmir.

     4- 183 christian churches were burned and destroyed by hindu extremists in state of Orissa in India and a christian Australian missionary was burned alive with his two young daughters in his vehicle locked.

     5- Indian state chief minister of Gujrat ( Nirindera Modi) is involved in massacre of Gujrati muslims where more than 5,000 innocent civilans were slaughtered, burned, womb cut and babies thrown out. Also properties of muslimd burned and destroyed.

     6- India at pani pat station the samjhuta express ( train service between Indian and PAkistan) was attacked and train burned where 67 Pakistanis lost their live who were innocent. LAter an Indian army officer ( Col Prohit) was proved to be involved but no action has yet been taken place against accused.

     7- India launcehd the biggest terror campaign against PAkistan in 1971. Indian army trained terrorists, funded them equipped them and pushed them in east pakistan which was the part of a sovereign pakistan. these terrorists disguised as PAkistan army soldiers killed thousands of PAkistan in Bengal. India equipped terrorists so much so that Indian air force provided them their helicopters and jet aircrafts to attack in PAkistan.

     8- After that India lanched Operation Meghdoot to capture no man land between two countries ( Siachen Glacier) in 1980s and Pakistan responded.

     9- Many Indian terrorist are still in prison in Pakistan for example Sarbajit Sing who is on death penalty Indians cant deny it because one such terrorist ( KAshmir Singh) was released by PAkistan after 34 years and he went back to india and confessed that he was on his mission in pakistan when captured.

     10. Even today india is backing terrorists equipping them and using them in Pakistan via Afghanistan where they have more than 15 consulates along PAk - Afghhan border but there is very rare indian citizen in india. US General Mc Chrystal who is Incharge of NATO forces in Afghanistan also accepted that Indian role in backing terrorists must be controlled.

     Having said all this i will say that all above points which i have mentioned are not fabricated, any one can check via any independent source. So India is not a paradise they are also Hindu extremists called SHIV SENA, BAJRANG DAL, RASHTRIA SEVAK SANGH and many more who will not let live any other religion if powered and they get Indian nuclear weapons, because their record shows this. World should worry about this because Islamic terrorism is a so called term invented by Mr BUSH and associates to capture Oil reserves in Iraq and secure oil passage way from Afghanistan and centeral Asian states because neither weapons of mass destruction in Iraq are found till this day nor its is proved in any court of law that TAliban or Al Qaeda was involved in 9/11 tragedy.

457. # H3Khan on 24 Dec 2009 at 7:36 am

     Salams every one.my name is Muhammad Hasan Azhar.i just read all what is being going on in here in this forum. I live in Peshawar. The city considered to be the most dangerous part of the world. Iv lost my uncle and two cosins in terrorist bombing in peoples mandi. I agree the situation is quite worse here. People say that Pakistanis are very shameful people. sorry for any mistake in grammer as I am not quite fond of English. No. we aint shameful and pathetic people. We are very strong. Because we are tolerating this all situation and the situation from last 60 years. I am I think a very reliable source over here. Because I live in the middle of what is happening here. trust me despite of all what is happening here we still go to restaurants, we still arrange street races, we are not that backward people. M a student of bba doing here in this very city. business administration. I know why our economy is suffering so much. We have fought about 3 wars we have been fighting against the foreign agencies and so called talibans who when captured are not even circumsized(all muslim babies are circumsized ) . Whose possessions are American dollars Indian currency and Indian weapons. my cozins are in army and have served in Waziristan operation. You all people sitting far away from the real battle field are arguing for what.i have friends and family members in india. in Darjeeling and Mumbai and I know which kind of life they are spending over there so stop blaming that we are poor and economically poor.
     You know where the problem lies .its there when we both Pakistani and Indians start bluffing without knowing whats the real condition. Pakistanis are terrorists. Its bull. our political system is just 50 60 years old. it will take time to come to the level of the modern world and gain maturity but still we are a nuclear power. We have just in reality 30% of literacy rate and still we are making tanks, sub marines, air crafts etc. dont wana go in detail because I am a military freak. One of the world top eye specialist I think he is in the top 11 is in Peshawar. My father is dead. But we live in a posh area of Peshawar which is called hayatabad and right now m typing on my laptop. my mother is just a teacher. My brother is also studying. How can we afford that. We are not that poor people .we are not that poor. You wouldn’t have seen a car in an ad and its running on the streets of Peshawar a month before the ad is displayed. Terrorism terrorism terrorism for God sake its bull shit. We are not terrorists. We are pathans and having arms and ammunition is our culture. We can die for honour. We cant tolerate and bear foreign rule over us. Its in our history. There was no terrorism before American occupation in Pakistan. In Peshawar there were if 10 % people using drugs like chars before the American occupation now there are 150 % people using chars. Which is original afghan and is being made under American supervision in Afghanistan. to destroy our youth. If you go to Lahore and Islamabad and just see how we guys here in Pakistan spend in outing and enjoyment and shopping you will be astonished. If you even see the phase 2 canals houses in hayatabad Peshawar, the behria model town. Your mouth will remain open. Our government is poor because our currency is fiat and the currency behind that is dollars. not gold. Which sometimes go to that mother fucker zardaris account or that haram zada nawaz sharif. Living in Peshawar we have so much talented people that we can do wonders but we are not given the opportunity.Y? because we are busy in cleaning up the mess and shit America has created for us. Media bluffs so much that you guys cant even imagine. If a person shoots another person over property here media says talib shot an innocent guy.
     Coming towards the military comparison. So there is no doubt india being lucky in gaining tot from the Russia(transfer of technology). It has a big economic budget I agree. But Russian technology is very sophisticated. That’s the only reason Pakistan didn’t go for su-30 being offered to Pakistan. Otherwise we have f7s the mig 21 bisons being made in china. the same technology isn’t a problem. The problem is easy technology in which a pilot is free to concentrate on his dogfight. The su 30 can do wonderful manevours but without payload on slow speeds. F 16 and jf 17 aint that agile but again its not the circus show going on up there or the top gun movie. It’s a real dog fight.in which number of planes, there weapons and again the training depends.if there are 4 su 30s intercepting. And for them 15 jf 17s are waiting fully loaded and being flyed by one of the best pilots. It’s a very tough conclusion to make who will win. Those who say that india will have air superiority should keep in mind that both the countries are going to have awacs. More over the j10s and jf 17s are going to have aesa radars once it will be very hard for india to destroy pakistans airforce. If you see the results of 1965s war. You can judge how a pilot can change every thing. So that country who will be attacking would have to think twice because both the sides are on the safe side if they defend than they offend. Going towards the navy so to be honest I do know the Indian navys accomplishments in 1971 but again they attacked a country which was suffering from internal disintegration to koi teer nai mara.lolz. but I do know that the agasta 90bs are having mesma technology and nuclear weapons capability.and f22p frigates will also prove a very difficult hurdle for them. Jalalat class missile boats are very very agile and a very big threat for the Indian ships. More over those people who have some know how of navy do know that its all about firing the torpedo first. Once it is lauched than there is nothing you could do except abondaning the ship. Now going towards the army so here I can openly say that Pakistan is having an edge in technology. As the tanks here used are t 80s, al khalids which are being indeginiously made and extremely smart in performace, similarly al zarars are also very able.al Khalids have thermal night vision and a 5 meters under water hiding capability. An automatic reloading system for the ammunition and many other cutting edge technologies. Our self made armed personal carriers are way awesum like talha and mohafiz. But on the other hand if you see particularly the arjun tank. Its not even accepted by the Indian army itself. The rest are Russian so again sophisticated technology. India uses insas rifles which are 90 % comparable in performace to the g3s being made in Pakistan. The cruise missile technology is also a threat for india not just for india but also for the Americans sitting there in Afghanistan. If we were that much weaker than why our chief of army staff ordered that any person rather American soldier, nato soldier or afghan soldier entering Pakistani soil should be shot at sight. We challenged America to come on our ground if you have the balls. In that situation in which we were also fighting there agents and so called talibans in our own country. We are not a piece of cake for anyone. What we need is a fearless leader who can change the real of the game. Or else we have destroyed all the hopes of our enemies of destroying Pakistan through terrorism. Think twice before saying that we can crush Pakistan as we did in 1971 . stop living in the past and move up. We know how to survive. And we are surviving. HAPPILY AND PROUDLY.

458. # Brian Jones on 25 Dec 2009 at 11:21 pm

     Usually i dont leave any comments on such topics. However, here i couldnt resist myself. I have read about 20 comments some from Pakistanis and others from Indians. And i have noticed something, ALL Indian comments are either rude, offensive and attacking Pakistan. While comments from Pakistan are more of peace and stability. Despite the fact what the media says for its own gain and what looks good on paper i think this blog itself represents the views of people of both of these countries. The idiots who have nothing but hate filled amoungst themselves and Pakistani people who want peace but are unable to have it due to the conspiracies of the warmongers.

459. # Mudasir on 27 Dec 2009 at 9:13 am

     well it was hectic to real all the converstions. I belong to kashmir & as a kashmiri i want to tell how many of you are really concerned about that STATE TERRORISM by INDIA in kashmir. Well due to sure adavantage of INDIAN media over paki media india is able to taint pakistan as terrorists heaven & magrain to the worl bla bla bla, but it is unfortunate that indian impunity is ot its best on innocent kashmiries & this terrorism has gone unabated for last 61 years this ORGANIZED CRIME ..is done under national interst last 22 years have seen death of 1,20,000 ppl 9840 raped & scores of houses gutted down & hell has been let open on kashmiries.
     Now modern means of subjugation are employed also like cultural, religious, economic onslaght is seen.
     Independent & unbiased reports hve suggested that over whelming majority 89% want a independent kashmir or PAKISTAN. But here largest democracy in the world fails to realize this very fact.

460. # Humair memon on 01 Jan 2010 at 10:51 pm

     The human factor will decide the fate of war, of all wars. Not the Mirage, nor any other plane, and not the screwdriver, or the wrench or radar or missiles or all the newest technology and electronic innovations. Men—and not just men of action, but men of thought. And The Nuclear Warheads will decide the fate of the countries because Pakistan HAs way ore Better Technolgy and ballistic missiles weapons I agree that India has very strong navy but there Air force sucks because of the aging Su kyis and MiG s they can not compete with F 16 of PAF and the new JF 17 of PAF…as well in intellegence gathering ISI is world Recognized and top of the Line spy agency in the world There is no Way RAW can match it ….. wheras the Army is concerned Pakistans AlKhaled and Al ZArrar are wa more faster and advacned thhen Indian Tanks ,,,and APC as well

461. # Nofal on 04 Jan 2010 at 1:55 pm

     @ Brian Jones

     Well done sir but i had tried to tell many Indians here that it is a discussions forum and we are here to debate these topics in an orderly manner.People like Punjabi Soldier and Nitin have wrote things like porkistan.

     @Nitin and Punjabi soldier

     PORKISTAN???? Is this a result of frustration.What are you guys like 5 years old?
     Never have you guys ever replied to my posts in detail or gave any evidence what so ever.It is a discussion forum and not an insult contest.

462. # Ganesh on 05 Jan 2010 at 11:05 am

     @Humair

     You are very right. Nueclear weapons will decide the course of war.
     When India will drop 200 + Nueclear weapons on Pakistan that will be the end of India-Pakistan War forever.

463. # Stonesplitter on 06 Jan 2010 at 2:29 pm

     @Mr Ganesh

     go ahead use nuclear weapons no matter 200 or 500 but remember ‘you may kill us hundred times, we will kill you once’.

     Good? Happy Now?

464. # JaI HinD on 06 Jan 2010 at 5:03 pm

     @brian
     Former indian PM Narasimha Rao described Britain as a 3rd rate power around 15 years ago.At present i dont think u deserve that comment also.today anyone who underestimates Indias power and tries to destabilise us will be planning their journey to grave.

465. # sanjay on 07 Jan 2010 at 9:36 am

     Dear Nofal,
     Sir, please remember that India is a nation of more than a billion people. You can find all different sorts of people here.
     Tolerant, violent and peace loving people. Just by some comments from guys like nitin and Punjabi soldier, it doesn’t mean that all Indians share the same opinion about Pakistan.
     If you would ever take the trouble of coming to India you would see many aspiring and talented Pakistani artists working here in Mumbai. Many singers of Pakistani origin like Adnan Sami and Javed Ali are respected throughout Bollywood. Yes there has been tension mounting around for the last 60 yrs or so. And each one of us want this tension to die sooner rather than later. And many of these comments from some of the guys like Nitin are the effects of hindi movies which are far from reality.

466. # Nofal on 07 Jan 2010 at 5:42 pm

     @Sanjay

     Sir i agree but i apologize for using the word “Indians” and not people and i understand what you mean.
     I would not like for a single Pakistani to represent all Pakistanis.
     Those 2 should behave in an appropriate manor such as you do.

467. # Nofal on 07 Jan 2010 at 6:00 pm

     @Sanjay

     Sir I entirely agree with you.
     And I apologize for using the word “Indians” instead of people.
     I as you would not like one person to represent everyone else.
     I hope those people who like to intimidate other would behave in a more appropriate manor such as yours.

     @Ganesh

     It is people like you that might just lead to another war,
     and as dropping 200 nukes on Pakistan, could you really live with yourself knowing you killed millions.

     @all

     Nukes should never be used, not even for a last option.
     Lets also respect each other as people, learn lessons from History; nobody wants another holocaust.

468. # T-Faz on 08 Jan 2010 at 1:10 pm

     Funny thing actually, after the Mumbai Attack. India was preparing for a limited war with Pakistan and America approved the conflict, however the indian army backed out because there military hardware and capabilities were limited. A report conducted by the indian army stated that pakistan will not only win but can gain territory, so there goes the conclusion that India is military stronger. Look it up its all over the internet.

     M. Robinson is spot on when he says pakistan started with nothing and India got everything, Pakistan has made itself from scratch and can match india today. Though they have had help from other countries but India has also had alot of help. Trust me when this war on terror is over, China and Pakistan will push India for one last fight.

469. # Paki Power on 09 Jan 2010 at 8:54 pm

     This quantity of equipment quoted in this article doesnt seem correct, like the zize of Indian and Pakistani army and the Nuclear stock pile. Most people know that Pakistans stock pile is about 80-120 weapons and No mention of Pakistans shaheen missiles operational capabelity, just cuz its solid fueled and has a range of over 2000 Km. This research seems to be biased in favor of India.

470. # Jadeboy on 14 Jan 2010 at 12:19 pm

     It is not about whether India has overwhelming superiority that is in question. What is in question is whether India can defend itself well against a better armed, better trained, technologically superior China.

471. # Amlan on 18 Jan 2010 at 3:04 pm

     Question: Does anybody knows whats the synonym of Terrorism???
     Answer: Pakistan.

472. # Ali on 19 Jan 2010 at 12:03 pm

     Dear Indians,

     I would like to inform you that you must look at the history.

     First Muhammad Bin Qasim conquerd the Sindh while his army was much lesser than Raja Dahir.
     Than many muslim conquered the India although indians were in great majority and great weapon power like Somnath victory by Mehmood Ghaznawi.
     You also must not forget the times of 1965 war when indian air force and navy were about to be eliminated.
     and after all you also must think that Alexander the Great ruined india and conquered half INdia.

     All those above fact reveals clearly that majority and technology is nothing to do when there is war between right and wrong.

     Whole world knows that Indian RAW and other intelligence agencies are behind the de establishment of pakistan.because you people know you can not beat us if a deadly war will take place between india and pakistan.I am not telling you the defeat of Pakistan in 1971 but it was a political and religious issue because we could not fight with our owb religion brother bangalis.
     but remember the event of 1965.

     Remember that we call only one God who is the real creator of the world and continueing the whole system.IN our believe “only our slogan of “Allah ho Akbar” will be enough for whole indian destruction

473. # a diplomat on 19 Jan 2010 at 4:43 pm

     1. On a visit to Pakistan in 2006 current Chief Minister of Kashmir Omar Abdullah remarked that foreign militants, who had nothing to do with Kashmir,were engaged in reckless killings and mayhem in the name of religion. Also US Intelligence agencies believe that Al-Qaeda and Taliban are helping organize a terror campaign in Kashmir to foment conflict between India and Pakistan. A 2001 report ‘Pakistan’s Role in the Kashmir Insurgency’ of US Think tank RAND corporation noted that ‘More intrinsically, the nature of the Kashmir conflict has been transformed from what was originally a secular,locally- based struggle (conducted via the Jammu Kashmir Liberation Front - JKLF) to one that is now largely carried out by foreign militants and rationalized in pan-Islamic religious terms.

     2. In October 2008 President Asif Ali Zardari of Pakistan called the Kashmir separatists Terrorists in an interview with The Wall Street Journal,these comments by Zardari were protested by Pakistani people.

     3. After the 1971 war and the creation of independent Bangladesh, under the terms of the 1972 Simla Agreement between Prime Minister Indira Gandhi of India and Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto of Pakistan, it was agreed that neither country would seek to alter the cease-fire line in Kashmir, which was renamed as the Line of Control, “unilaterally, irrespective of mutual differences and legal interpretations”.

     4.India don’t believe in Two nation theory neither do believe world’s famous diplomats such as Ahmad Faruqui,Cohen etc.

     5. India holds that the Instrument of Accession of the State of Jammu and Kashmir to India, signed by the Maharaja Hari Singh (erstwhile ruler of the State) on 26 October, 1947, was completely valid in terms of the Government of India Act(1935),Indian Independence Act (1947) and international law and was total and irrevocable.

     6. United Nations Security Council Resolution 1172 tacitly accepts India’s stand regarding all outstanding issues between India and Pakistan and urges the need to resolve the dispute through mutual dialogue and does not call for a plebiscite.

     7. United Nations Security Council Resolution 47 cannot be implemented since Pakistan failed to withdraw its forces from Kashmir which was the first step in implementing the resolution.Now the resolution is obsolete since the geography and demographics of the region have been permanently altered.The resolution was passed by United Nations Security Council under Chapter VI of the United Nations Charter.

     8. i want to point the recent state-assembly elections held in phases in November–December 2008. High turnouts were seen in(arrount 62% while the avarage voting in national elections falls in range of 50 to 55%) spite of calls for boycott by Kashmiri separatists.The pro-India National Conference party emerged as the winner.

     9.The constitution of Azad Kashmir ( part of pakistan) specifically prohibits activities that may be prejudicial to the states accession to Pakistan and as such regularly suppresses demonstrations against the government.A number of Islamist militant groups
     operate in this area including Al-Qaeda with tacit permission from Pakistan’s intelligence.

     10.The Balawaristan National Front has stated its goal of seeking independence from Pakistan. Abdul Hamid Khan Chairman of Balawaristan National Front states that ‘The Pakistani administration has also been involved in efforts to alter the demographic profile of Pakistan-occupied Gilgit Baltistan, reducing the indigenous people to a minority.’

     11.A 2-day conference on Gilgit Baltistan was held on April 8-9, 2008 at the European Parliament in Brussels over the human rights violation in Gilgit Baltistan Abdul Hamid Khan, Chairman Balawaristan National Front
     speaking at the same conference said “no democratically elected representative (from Gilgit Baltistan) was included when Karachi Agreement was signed between Pakistan and Muslim Conference leaders in 1949.”

     12.A report ‘Kashmir: Present Situation and Future Prospects’ which was submitted to European Parliament by Emma Nicholson,Baroness Nicholson of Winterbourne was severely critical of lack of human rights, justice, democracy & Kashmiri represent action in Pakistan National Assembly in Pakistan administered Kashmir.

     14.According to Human Rights Commission of Pakistan Pakistan’s Inter Services Intelligence operates in Pakistan administered Kashmir and is involved in extensive surveillance, arbitrary arrests, torture and murder. Generally this is done with impunity and perpetrators go unpunished.
     The Freedom in the World 2006 report categorized the Indian-administered Kashmir as “partly free” and Pakistan-administered Kashmir as “not free”.

     IF ANYONE FOUND ANY OF THE ABOVE LINES DISAGREEABLE,CAN ASK FOR PROOFS AS I HAVE CREDITABLE PROOFS BY NEUTRAL SITES FOR EACH OF THE SENTENCE ABOVE.

     i am an Indian and i don’t hate Pakistan
     the cause of dispute between India and pakistan is KASHMIR ONLY.
     so it will be meaningless to speak about what India should do on its internal concerns by pakistani’s.
     same applicable for Indians.

474. # John on 23 Jan 2010 at 3:23 am

     One thing I missed: Nuclear bombs. Please… please stop talking about that. Whoever supported that in their comments (to defend whatever) can never ever imagin the impact of a nuclear explosion. It’s beyond your imagination….If you want to see less than 0.0000000001% of the impact, travel to Hiroshima or Nagasaki in Japan and figureout yourself whether you can support that for WHATEVER reasons…If you still do support it after that, I’m sure you don’t have a heart.

475. # sanjay on 25 Jan 2010 at 7:07 pm

     a diplomat,
     I wanted to know what the source of the facts were. It was a fine collection.

     Ali,
     I read your comments and am sorry to say that you are no better than those terrorists who continuously target both India & Pakistan, no matter whatever those groups are Taliban who is your prime enemy right now and LeT for us. It is people like you with your corrupt and inhuman mindset who talk about destruction in the name of religion. I advice you to please read the Quran and tell where is it written to attack any country or specific religion. Please don’t ever mince your violent words in the name of religion. You don’t have an iota of clue to how those comments could worsen the relations and to improve your history the Sindh you mentioned is now in the present day Pakistan. India has more Muslims than Pakistan, so you are no representative of the Muslims all over the world.
     About RAW, it does the same work your ISI does, no worse no better. Even after 1000 years, you will find India way ahead of Pakistan in all terms.
     JAI HIND

476. # Musab on 25 Jan 2010 at 10:39 pm

     A Nuclear War Is Going To Be Like Doomsday For Both Countries…It is regrettable to say that the Indian army chief would use war rheotric to inflate tensions between Pakistan and India… It is also tragic to know that people have so much hatred for each other in both countries…Both countries have so much to do in the field of progress and all we do is talk about annihilating each other…I don’t think India should boast too much about ecoonomic prosperity, it is true that India has shown development in a number of fields but there is still alarming poverty in this enormous country where in the slums of Mumbai you see scores of people living below the poverty line… Why don’t other Indians comment on those things instead of window dressing their blushes with talk of economic prosperity…Pakistan is not an impish state like Srilanka… It is a huge country itself and comments from fellow Indians that conquering Pakistan is a ‘cakewalk’ are baseless and ridiculous…Pakistan is a strong nation with a sophisticated army and responsible nuclear program…Pakistan does not want peace cos it feels inferior but rather cos spilling blood and destroying entire cities is no intention of any sane person however by using annoying and immature propaganda India is always inviting Pakistan to do just that… Why cant the Indian people realize that it is their bull headed politicians that are leading them to their own peril…What would become of India’s progress in IT and Education if a nuclear war head wipes out Kolkatta and Delhi from the map…Would the Indian army cheif distribute roses among the broken relatives of those who perished in the massacre?
     Pakistan too has been marred by internal strife which has been caused by our patheitc and selfish rulers…Pakistan has been harmed by none other than it’s own flawed policies and hostile relations between people…What is the use of uniting against a fake war hysteria created by fraud politicians who want the public’s votes… I urge the people of both countries to wake up and stop pointing fingers at each other… this world has seen enough bloodshed and we should devise a plan to put an end to more blood spilling rather than blaming each other and hurting each other’s feelings… Good luck to all from a Proud Pakistani!

477. # Abhilash on 04 Feb 2010 at 1:56 pm

     Musab,
     I am glad to see your sensible note. I lost my nerves after going through the numerous posts, baseless accusations etc. Neither India nor pak are full of saints. We both have damaged each other enough (Thanks to the seeds implanted by imperial powers). Its high time we realize that and move on as friendly neighbors.

     Those who unnecessarily mix up religion and culture with politics are the real polititions. We both have common problems and need to move on, forgetting the past.

     If kashmir is the core issue (I dont think so. Kashmir is just a core concern highlighted by armies of both the sides to keep escalating their budgets and there-fore associated cuts they recieve in spending it), the solution must be derived based on what the people of kashmir wants. But both the sides wouldnt let that happen, as then they’ll need some new issue to fight on.

     To add spice to the curry, media on both the sides sensationalize the issue (without which, they loose their TRP).

     We love to hate each other, dont we ? We are therefore required by each other. So lets not talk about a war and destruction.

478. # Haider Lodhi on 04 Feb 2010 at 4:16 pm

     For my Pakistani Friends!

     Its useless to talk back on whatever facts there are,ok indian army is much better happy u indians? but being a Muslim its not the material which is important but the faith in Allah which makes us strong.If India wants a war,then start the war we have a army of 18 crore people ready to give their lives in the name of Allah,Allah created the “kaenat” and if we have Allah on our side who can take us over..when 313 Muslims can comeover 10000~ Kufar in Jang-e-Badar,then what else do u need?lol…whatever happens in Pakistan makes us strong day by day..You talk about education and literacy rate,we have the greatest book “Quran” in our hearts..what else do we need…Allah is just testing us and INSHALLAH HE will help us…this was just for Muslims brothers non-Muslims may not bother to reply..JazakAllah

479. # kumar on 04 Feb 2010 at 8:40 pm

     i can see one thing from the above discussions

     indians are not so hard on pakistan ,but pakistanis are unleashing their terrorism even here any one with a brain will know india can easily defeat pak if a war arise ,but there is no pakistani here who accepts the fact.they keep thinking they want to rule the world

     even your go allah would not permit the terrorist act what u guys do by killing thousands and you call it jihad -the greatest foolishness

     there is no enemy for you guys you are an enemy for yourself

     you guys are destroying your own religion and country i a not opposed to muslims
     because i have muslime friends here and they are right next to me while i type this but can any muslim whose out of india show me 1 hindu friend
     we enjoy our democracy and we enjoy the company of our muslim and christian friends you guys are loosing so much in your life
     god bless you guys

480. # Nofal on 07 Feb 2010 at 12:25 pm

     @kumar

     we pakistanis are not so harsh on you indians than you r on us, your a hypocrite and u know it.
     stop relying on ur media for information that is truthful, bollywood is a great film industry but india’s news networks are some of the worst.They insight racial hatred, they give false info and by doing this they just add fuel to the fire.
     India id funding and arming these terrorists and extremists.
     BTW take a look a your own country minorities in india are asking for justice they are and have been oppressed since the day india was made.For people who think all pakistanis are terrorists or support them, your wrong where fighting a war against them open ur eyes plz.

481. # Ankur on 07 Feb 2010 at 12:26 pm

     i m hardly 18 yrs old and can easily understand that unity is key to sucess j&k or bangladesh wont be a problem if to us if we had never divided ….. we have to understand that not only country , asia wont solve any problem we’ll have to be united as whole world …. there by i storngly support the idea of unification of whole world………. i dnt know whn ppl can understand it

482. # Nofal on 11 Feb 2010 at 7:15 pm

     @Ankur

     If pak did not part we 2 would have to face the Hindu nationalists and some of india’s vicious racists, Indians b4 u get offended i would like to acknowledge that not all but anly some Indians are racist although it is a nice thought.

483. # Arjun on 11 Feb 2010 at 11:49 pm

     India & Pakistan are both great countries, as our Hinduism & Islam great religions. Indians do tend to be more open minded & less radicalized then say pakistani muslims, as can be seen by India’s secular status.

     However we must also remember Pakistani people & muslims in general, are very proud, decent loving people. Pakistani people generally are very sweet natured people, whom deserve better from their weak leaders!

     I’d like to see the Indian government doing more to promote peace & trust with Pakistan. Maybe offering the Pak government India army resource to fight Al qaueida may go someway to distill confidence & trust between these two g8t nations.

     Good luck!

484. # Gaurav on 12 Feb 2010 at 8:44 am

     If you are a so loyal and Peaceful country why you tried to attack on us in 1965 with American support (When we were not in good condition after china attack), why your people tried to capture so many post in Kargil area. You can make fool yourself only that you are not supporting Kashmiris Terrorist.
     I would say in the response of pakistanis statement that Sikhs Christians Muslims are not safe in India, I am Sikh my family living in India since Independence and we feel that we are living in most peaceful and beautiful country in the world.
     Hindu and we are like a family members, we go to the Temple and they go the the Gurudwara.
     You people always try to interfere in our internal matter. Kashmir is our internal matter too and you pakistanis have captured some part of this, If Kashmir is yours why you have given control of some part of this to China. No Country its part to others.
     We always tried to make a friendship with you but what you have done everyone knows.
     Today if we are harsh on you, you people are responsible for that. From last 20 years we are facing problems created by you. Instead of working on progress you people only think how we can destroy are divide our nation.
     Now come on Media i have seen your news channel PTV,
     Reader was lying by telling so many false things about us. I have never seen this kind of news channel (Cheap & Fake).
     Guys My experience says that we should destroy this country very soon otherwise we will be responsible for so many death worldwide.
     What America is doing, doing very good they deserve to this.

485. # sanjay on 16 Feb 2010 at 6:04 pm

     i just can’t understand why the Pakistani government has taken no action against the rally in POK which was clearly threatening to recourse to violent terrorism in the name of jihad and that too for some water dispute which can be solved amicably through talks. These so called jihad-is walk freely in Pakistan and threaten to kill Indians, and Pakistan wants talks. Let them talk to those terrorists first and then with India. Their FM, Mr.Qureshi has lost his brains; it was Pakistan who wanted talks and now saying the Indians went begging for talks with Pakistan. Their ambassador to USA urged the US govt. to ink a nuclear deal with them just as they had one with India and also begged for $100 million worth weapons. This shows that Pakistani army has still lot to get if they want to get even close to India in terms of military strength. All those boasting of Pakistani army power, please realize India cannot be compared with Pakistan. Its just like comparing USA & Cuba.

486. # Ravi Khanna on 18 Feb 2010 at 8:33 am

     Try to Think of Modenising every people. Try to think differently by helping people we all are one… if the earth is destroyed we all will die. Try to save planet. not by war or peace but by making earth green and make people live healthy. go green. world can end any time, earth can shake itself any time. dont fight by getting and wasting time in writing stupid blogs. save your time and help each other. Our Religion is that we all are humans… At Last. Be happy and let others be happy.. you will find hapiness in all of them…

     Bye take care all.

     Note: Think Positive & Be Positive.

487. # david on 20 Feb 2010 at 4:45 am

     Just to remind readers that Kashmir is not an internal matter between Indian and Pakistan but the truth is infact its a United Nation matter and one of the oldest outstanding dispute yet to be resolved. For readers information we are talking about democratic rights of some ten million Kashmiri people having freedom of choice to decide their own destiny. History shows that people can not be controlled with guns for ever, there is a limit how much suffering people can take until they start fighting back and thats the situation in Kashmir at the present time. My suggestion for a way forward and ever last solution is to allow the United Nation to hold a free and open referendum and offer Kashmiri people an opportunity to decide their own future in both sides of Kashmir.

488. # Arvi Dubey on 22 Feb 2010 at 3:14 pm

     As long as Pakistan and it’s people are supporting those bloody terrorist who are killing the innocents people across the world in the name of god, Pakistan can’t be a stable nations. Today the country itself becomes the terror hub of international terrorist organization and its clearly now showing that they are influencing the poetical and social life and economy of the country.
     Every other day in news paper reads this much of people, that no of peoples died in bomb explosion, suicide attack and such type of incidences. I might fear that the Pakistan is in big danger and even may lost is identity in future.. these extremist are not only doing wrong with their on nation but as well harming the other countries.

     They are just cowards people who are killing innocent on the name of god…
     but they will get the return back if god exist somewhere….

489. # Nofal on 23 Feb 2010 at 7:58 pm

     Thank you David,

     Like Mr.David said India cannot keep Kashmir because Kashmiris want their independence.
     Look at history like former ISI chief said when it comes to moral vs material, moral always wins.The Americans learnt this in Vietnam, The Soviets in Afghanistan and we learnt it in Bangladesh.

490. # agree_wid_me?? on 25 Feb 2010 at 2:27 pm

     Even the piss collected from all indians is enough to bring flood in pakistan, no need of a war…

491. # O.o on 02 Mar 2010 at 3:13 pm

     Ah! it is interesting how an article that starts with figures and reference turns into a subjective debate and some thing else.

     Well I’ll just state somethings to bring them in prospective

     Kashmir:
     most hotly debated topic in India-Pak talks, this is the issue that triggered 3 wars between two countries

     Q:
     Most often the question raised is why not let UN conduct a poll in J&K and let the people decide.
     A:
     Because such an act will call for normal conditions in Kashmir for free and fair polls but conditions are far from normal.
     For those of you don’t know about Kashmiri pandit ethnic cleansing look it up
     http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kashmiri_Pandit

     One of the fools above said Britain did the correct thing by partitioning India as the Hindu and Muslim violence going on, well look into history my friend it lead to a blood-bath with number of dead being estimated to be as high as 1000000
     http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Partition_of_India

     on real topic, I don’t see any real numbers, facts, reference . . . from anyone except for the article itself so its just cheap talk

492. # rahrah on 06 Mar 2010 at 10:25 pm

     One thing needs to be clear: when we say “India” we talk about all people who are citizens of India or of Indian origin. Discrimination based on religion is illegal. Yes, such discrimination remains in the extremist that exist in every part of the world: but the point to be noted is that we have 1 official religion (we are Indian.) As for the Mughals that invaded India: they were Indian and in a way Pakistani (since India and Pakistan were not officially created). All generations after Babur were born in India and thus were Indian.Just because they were Muslim, doesn’t mean that the mughals were not Indian.

493. # david on 08 Mar 2010 at 1:01 am

     Its true that there is major conflict taking place in the Indian controlled Kashmir and that gives more reasons for the resolution of this probably longest outstanding issue on the United Nation’s agenda. History shows at the time of India and Pakistan independencies, both countries had major issues particularly the resettlement of millions of newly migrated people but that didn’t not stop their independencies.

     Britain is saddned that two of our ex-colonies are spending billions of pounds each year to maintain their strengths and fight wars over Kashmir, if this issues is resolved then their will no reasons why miltary billions can’t be redirected on fighting poverty, hunger and other development projects.

     Readers, contributors and Aby pl lets campaign for the resolution of this conflict.

494. # friendship on 12 Mar 2010 at 6:36 pm

     Let’s all just be friends India can never destroy Pakistan and Pakistan can never destroy India those are the real facts and if someones failes to believe in them he must be an idiot. We can not destroy each other no matter how much advanced technology we have

495. # vignesh on 17 Mar 2010 at 2:52 am

     India doesn’t want to destroy Pakistan.The fact that Pakistan doesn’t have a “no use first” policy for its nuclear weapons made the Indian govt. spend more on defense systems in the last decade.Tell me even once out of the four wars India has had with Pakistan that we have initiated it.You see UK people,you started the policy of divide and rule and now whatever has happened only you are responsible.”Both should stop spending on defense and start fighting poverty and hunger” seems a totally irrational statement seeing the enmity we have been having since independence.You know the root cause of all this,it was the partition of Bengal which sowed the seeds for this pathetic relationship we are having.
     Pakistani friends,believe it or not,our governments cannot take a friendly stand till our issues like Kashmir and terrorism are resolved.Every time an initiative for bilateral dialogues are bettered, a terrorist attack takes place and everything is shattered.You see there is no difference between us except for our religions.We have evolved from the same culture and share a lot in common.It seems you are more proud of the partition than independence.Please do comment.

496. # vibhor (hindu) on 17 Mar 2010 at 11:09 am

     I am a Hindu and belong to nuclear middle class family in Himachal Pradesh, a small hilly and least urbanized state in India.I have never seen any religious hate around me. Kashmir (Jannat in this world, which i have heard) is nearer to me than delhi. i visited J&K once in my life just for mata vashno devi darshan. I am aware of Kashmir inside problem same way as we all do, through media.

     I have interacted with only 2 person belonging to minority community in india (1 Muslim and 1 christen) in my whole life span of 25 yrs in himachal and believe me friends, After my parents, I respect and faith blindly on these two person in my life and i m ready to die for them. My Sikh roommate treats me like his younger brother and he will do anything for me. I enjoy halal meat with same intensity with which my dear ones enjoy cannabis pakoras during the shivratri festival.

     All I want to say is, “Insaan galat hota hai, majhab nhi (to err is human, not the religion).
     Even on this platform some of the scraps are derogatory to someone else on the other side.

     So how can a middle class person like me can contribute to the solution of the mentioned problems in above scrap, no matter to which nation do we belong or what religion we follow? I would really appreciate if someone tell me the answer. With all my understanding I can say-
     1.) Use our voting power wisely.
     2.) understand the social and moral responsibility.
     3.) perform our duties & acts with some sense of responsibility.
     4.) be aware and use RTI.

     But question is how many of us are doing this? why should we blame corrupt govt and likes of advani, jinaah, modi, koda, thakre or some saint in panjab/Haryana for all of our problems. They all lived and keep on living their lives in all the comforts in the world. And they are not going for warfornts? Its always been the common man like us who has to suffer, hether its a war, riot, a natural calamity, a rise in fuel and commodity prices.

     I wish some day I feel safe to visit natural beauty of Kashmir in my reaming life.

497. # Santy on 18 Mar 2010 at 8:34 am

     Pak lost all three battles against India (1965, 1971 and 1999). Pak always got support from state of the art US technology while India didnt. Still India held Pak’s neck at ethe end of every war. And for the smart guys who think India winning the war is a propaganda, just go through treaties signed by pak in ‘65 and ‘71. both of them are surrender agreements accepted by Pak. And during Kargil, Mr. Sharif ran to US prez Clinton asking to pressure India for a cease fire, which was refused by Us prez and then Sharif ordered UNCONDITIONAL retreat of pak army from Kargil heights. As of now, Indian Army is more modernised than it ever was. Looking at number and weapons it has.. it is clear that in the event of a war. India will again prove itself as a military power.

498. # True Rankings on 18 Mar 2010 at 8:58 am

     http://www.globalfirepower.com/

     Accurate military rankings with statistics to back them up.

     India is 4th and Pakistan 15th. No match.

499. # irfan khan on 18 Mar 2010 at 9:46 pm

     india being better in propaganda might propogate itself as superior but its might was shattered by 10 young boys(mumbai attacks) who parralysed the entire india for few days till they had amunition. just imagine if there are 100,000 such suicide bombers with an open support by the Pakistan, what would happen then?????? No body should dare to think about any adventurism………if they have some common sense.

500. # Saqib Ali on 19 Mar 2010 at 4:38 pm

     This is the past that Pakistan is week against india now Pakistain has batter niucler power and longe range missile and best tanks and lastest aircraft and lastest navey wapons. now pakistan producing in own country aircraft like JF-17 and tanks like Al-khalid and every kind of missile witch is lastest wapons in world. It is true that Pakistan has better missile and nuclear tacnologi and india also acept it. Now all cities and villige of india are in the range of Pakistani missiles. And now Pakistan coming more powerfull with his wapons day by day. there is no value of human power now a days now war will fight with missile and boms and now Pakistan has best missile against india. Now Pakistan is powerfull. Now Pakistan has come Greater Pakistan. Pakistan Zinda abad.

     The uper Data is very old and expired.

501. # sanjay on 19 Mar 2010 at 5:52 pm

     Remember how in 1971, pakistan lost its half and 90000 pak soldiers surrendered. After that the Prime Ministers of both India and pak signed Shimla pact and pak accepted its defeat and its 90000 personnel back. Again in 1999 kargil, Nawaz sharif begged to Mr. Clinton to force a ceasefire on India, which he didn’t accept. Ultimately Sharif had to offer total surrender did the war stop and pak was able to stop it from being divided further. Operation Meghdoot in 1965 when India conquered 80% of Siachen glacier. History is evident Indian army has always outscored their pak counterparts in all the depts. Even the no of men,ammunition that pak lost is greater than India. If a war were to erupt it would mean total annihilation of pakistan.

502. # sanjay on 20 Mar 2010 at 11:17 pm

     let me tell u one thing pakistan only lost one war against india which was 1971. 1965 your generals were saying we gonna have tea in lahore gym khana bt your generals dreams were destroyed when pakistan defended its territory and by defeating the indian army which was far larger than pakistan and u say that 80% siachen glacier take a break u even couldn’t reach one hill and talking abt 80% of glacier in indian hand. kargil war was draw no one won that war and let me tell u one think indian army took heavy casualties then pakistan. if pervaz mushraff haven’t called his army back then we would certainly have won kargil.u people talk shit.

503. # David on 21 Mar 2010 at 6:02 am

     Dear Sanjay

     As we Brits say we will have to agree to disagree. It appears that we have been reading two different histories. Its correct Pakistan did lose East Pakistan in 1971 and its ninty thousand personnel were defeated but what we must remember is that it was their guerrillas who played much bigger role than the Indian army, which has taken the credit ever since.

     Kargil incident participants were civilian guerrillas and remember how many days it took india to recapture the hill top land and how many troops they had to use - who last their planes? Pakistan or India

     Please remember India is a much bigger country than Pakistan both in terms of land and population but it must act more reponsibly with care for other small neighbouring countries to gain more respect to play a key nation rule.

     Please tell aby, readers and contributors when Indian picks on a country of its own size like China then what has been the out come so far.

504. # sanjay on 23 Mar 2010 at 2:57 pm

     David,
     You should please re-check your facts. It clearly says the number of men, ammunitions lost by Pak is far more than that of India. And wars are not won easily, no matter how much time was taken, the truth is that India defended their land and conquered some 10kms of the enemy land. I have personally visited this place of Drass, Kargil and Batalik were the war was at its peak. You should check them yourselves to find out the real truth. What you hear sitting from there in Britain about India and Pakistan is not completely true. 1999 was not history for India and Pakistan. Both had losses and when you say that civilian guerillas were fighting for India, I have to say that the Pak army was using Mujahideens to infiltrate into India. India has so far fought according to the Geneve war conventions, the same cannot be said about India. Well, I’m not saying that the pak army was not brave. They have brave soldiers who fight for their country. But technologically and in terms of manpower India is the superior nation and that is what matters in wars. Record says that after the kargil war, india got some of the pak land . Pakistan had tried to conquer NH-13 to stop the flow of Indian arms and ammunitions. Well the fact is that India is the better nation in terms of everything, bad as well as good.

505. # david on 24 Mar 2010 at 1:58 pm

     Dear Sanjay

     We Britis are fair, honest and open minded people. we do not like taking sides especially between our two close friendly nations, but i am unable to understand as why you say India is a better nation
     in term of everthing, i can understand that more in term of bad than good it has more poverty, more unemployment, more hungry people to feed, bigger population and lots more problems.

     Your comments state that it was India who first started using civilian guerillas in 1971 at East Pakistan to fight the Pakistani government and later Pakistan used Mujahideens at the Kargil and now using in Kashmir. It very much appears they are trying to use similar tactics on you. Now the situation has changed and your on the receiving end why does Indians cry foul at Pakistan when you have clearly started playing dirty on the first place?

     Time after time every Indian contributor mentions about the terrorism being carried out in Kashmir by Pakistan.

     Please read your history and check your facts as explained by Sanjay.

     I was not aware of India capturing some extra land from Pakistan but what the western media showed that Indian army was struggling for many days to defeat few civilan people and it was Indian airforce which had lost planed shot down by Pakistan, if i remember it correctly one pilot was killed and second was captured.

     If this is the assessment of the Indian army againt much smaller country then imagine what would be the result when they take on a country of their own size like China………………

506. # Matt on 24 Mar 2010 at 11:24 pm

     It’s sad to see these nations hate each other so much, it is almost like an indoctrination programme that subtly pervades the very thinking of the peoples of both nations. Out of two, I would have to admit that India has done the right things and is rapidly on the ascendent, recognised as a rising global powerhouse economically and militarily. Pakistan on the other hand, has been cursed with corrupt leaders, puppet governments and a greedy army.

     I lived 3 years in India, and I find the various comments about oppression against Muslims rather exaggerated. Without doubt there is an underlying thread of mistrust between the Hindus and the Muslims, and that is seized upon by unscrupulous and greedy Indian politicians to create what the Indians refer to a ‘vote bank’. But my overall impression is that Indian muslims are amongst the most tolerant in the world and radicalism exists only in small pockets. The rise of Hindu radicalism is a concern, for it can have devastating consequences on the integrity of that country. Again, this appears to me as exploitation of sentiments by power hungry MPs.

     Pakistan I have only visited briefly, so I cannot claim to know its people. My impression though is that it is a nation that shares much with India. It is burdened with the same problems that dog India, but in far greater measure. The Army that was intended to serve and protect them, has become their own nemesis.

     What both probably need to do is look at how similar they are in every aspect of their lives, their thinking, their history, their cultures, their attitudes, their resilience.

507. # sandeep on 25 Mar 2010 at 12:10 pm

     One of my Pakistani friend said what indians are doing in Kashmir. Brother in kashmir election clearly indicates where those people want to stay. Come and have a visit to kashmir and see people staying there in peace atlest not like pakistan. In pakistan 90% people are below poverty line. Education is far away from them . you people are also sufferring from terror strikes which is a back fir for you people. still you dont understand these things. before indipendence we both contries ware together . still there is a relationship alive . we just need to ignite it. we can make this two contries a heaven to live . destroy all terror camps , and work on the development of you country brother.

508. # Ajay on 29 Mar 2010 at 7:56 am

     there is saying “if you keep the Dog tail in a pipe thinking that it would become straight… you are wrong” it won’t. Pakistan is like a Dog with rabies … But the best thing is no matter what they have or not … they are just living on west leftover ,,, i mean a nation who ask for help keeping trigger on their head. their biggest gift to world is terrorism … what kind of clan are pakistanis … i am greatful to my leaders who made a right choice my dividing them from india into a pakistan. we are blessed as an indian, not to have them … they are cancer and should be eliminated from world map

509. # Anuj on 29 Mar 2010 at 10:00 am

     Hey all my Indian brothers and neighbour country guys..
     I would just say one thing to our indian brother that,why we spending talking about a poor,country without law n order and shamless country PAK…we are much and far away from that and they are no where in our standard in any field.
     India can squeez pak in 4 hour of battel…
     they just have to wait and cross the threshold/limitation which indian forces have fixed.
     God bless you pakis,still you have time to become a good country live peacfully.

     JAI HIND,JAI BHARAT

510. # Saran on 29 Mar 2010 at 5:46 pm

     India is an Independent and a country stands on its own. But pakistan has to beg evertime with US and China. Even now the external affairs minister met the US minister to beg . They cannot stand with both India and Taliban. It is since they are not sure on both side. They have no guts to speak with India alone and calls US.

511. # Nofal on 29 Mar 2010 at 9:57 pm

     sandeep on 25 Mar 2010 at 12:10 pm
     “One of my Pakistani friend said what indians are doing in Kashmir. Brother in kashmir election clearly indicates where those people want to stay. Come and have a visit to kashmir and see people staying there in peace atlest not like pakistan. In pakistan 90% people are below poverty line. Education is far away from them . you people are also sufferring from terror strikes which is a back fir for you people. still you dont understand these things. before indipendence we both contries ware together . still there is a relationship alive . we just need to ignite it. we can make this two contries a heaven to live . destroy all terror camps , and work on the development of you country brother.”

     @Sandeep

     I laughed very hard when i saw this, 90% of Pak’s population is under the poverty line???
     Is that a very bad assumption or a result of listening to too much cheap and funny Indian media.
     Indians ask us to destroy terror camps, yet they are funding similar organisations in Baluchistan and a lot of these terrorist attacks have foreign elements including India, therefore i think you’re being very hypocritical.
     And don’t get me started on the Kashmir problem. In J&K 29,000-,100,000 civilians have been killed, most of them Muslims
     nuff said.

512. # MunnuM on 02 Apr 2010 at 4:39 pm

     No one can do better propaganda then India. Do….!
     why just they see under there shirt. Nexalites. Nocking them from below. Mumbai was ranked biggest slum in the world.
     Wikipedia totally Indian writers written Data.
     Indian nuclear Program No where near Pakistan Nuclear Program vastly much enriched.

     It is not India which is powerful. It is Pakistan Which is Powerful which is always ready to fight Against. 5 time bigger Army.
     India is full of HIV AIDS face it.

513. # India Rulz on 03 Apr 2010 at 8:42 am

     India shud ally itself and reposition its alliance with Israel openly. Hindus and Jews have a common enemy which is Islamic terror. Along with the USA, This alliance would make the entire middle east and Pakistan realize that they need to act on fundamentalism and root out safe havens of terror or face certain humiliation and destruction like what the Jews are inflicting on Palestinians daily

514. # Vineed on 04 Apr 2010 at 11:22 pm

     My fellow pakistani friends mentioned that Kashmiri muslims want to be free.Do u have any idea how many muslims were killed by muslim terrorists/ infiltrators in Kashmir from across the border.The muslims who crossed borders in 1947 from India are discriminated as Mujjahirs now.They are treated as aliens.The muslims in pakistan are killing each other on the faith differences ( Sunni -Shia).You speak of Babri Masjid, which ofcourse was an unfortunate event,but the muslim terrorists are bombing many mosques in Pakistan itself.How do u justify that?
     Hindu ladies in pakistan are kidnapped and forcefully converted to Islam.Christian churches are also attacked on a regular basis and bombed
     Inshort, pakistan is a place where it is difficult not only for minorities like christian or muslim, but also for muslims itself.All this happens in an Islamic country.Where Islam preaches peace and prosperity, pakistan army and ISI preaches terrorism.
     Story of pakistan is like the story of the Boy who called “Wolf ..Wolf”.In the process of trying to unstabilze India, Pakistan has got battered qn economy completely shattered.
     Pakistan is such a beautiful country with many resources but it is sadly run by
     Big Time Idiots and terrorists Who fail to understand the meaning of ISLAM.

515. # Abhimanyu on 07 Apr 2010 at 9:50 am

     i’ve read almost all post since 2008 on this forum and what amazes me is how many people are interested in the topic of India vs Pakistan !! so many posts some in favor of India , others in favor of Pakistan. some mindless, some sensible , some amazing distortions of history from either sides. goes to show that there is so much misinformation on both sides which is responsible for hatred in the subcontinent. Its an irony that political leaders used the misinformation to their vested interests hundreds of years ago and in this technologically advanced era still nothing has changed!
     Until the superiority complexes in the minds of Islamic fundamentalists ( that they are a superior race chosen by Allah ) and in the minds of Hindu fundamentalists ( that the Hindu religion is oldest and best ) are not removed ; the conflict will never end.
     The few who want to rule will continue misguiding people on both sides for their own benefit. also distortion of facts or self-taught history cant be used to change minds of the opponenents, as tried by few here above.

     Especially loved M. Robinson (allegedly from Britain but most probably a Pakistani) who claimed that Mohan - jo - Daro was a Buddhist city , Buddha ( born in 563 BC or 623 BCE was not even born then) . In fact the script is yet to be deciphered and has not yet been proved to be connected to any Hindu deity yet either ( although a certain artefact is named Pasupatinath but its not agreed upon), M Robinson says 500 year old history of India was not only Hindus but ” Sikhs ( Guru Nanak Dev founder of Sikh religion was born on 15th April 1469 , Muslims ( Prophet Mohammad ( pbuh) was born in AD 570 and created Islam was in 610 especially Buddhists . Many Indians not knowing what they r talking about , say they will drop 200 nuke bombs and annihilate Pakistan and there was also a small post saying the Indians can only pee and flood Pakistan off!! How insensitive ans stupid and how hollow these guys are not even understanding that human beings are human first and a Muslim or Hindu later !!
     Another post worth mentioning is by Zubair Sikandar who is rightly fed up by hypocrites both Indians and Pakistanis and urges them to follow peace and brotherhood because writing up hate filled comments is another form of terrorism !!! as it multiplies the venom and dilutes the spirit of co-existence

     Dont know when this will end. Really hope it was a united India and Pakistan we no religion superior or inferior. People enjoying each other’s rituals and cultures and helping one another in ther road towards the almighty!!!

516. # search for truth on 07 Apr 2010 at 6:46 pm

     Abhimanyu,

     For India and Pakistan, its not about religion, its about Kashmir. What is your suggestion on Kashmir? Because unless that issue is resolved you will see many such 26/11 attacks on India. If you look at the losses that India suffered in all these years, I sincerely think Kashmir is certainly not worth it. I think Kashmir should be given independence sooner rather than later. If you see the facts you will get what am I saying. Nearly Rs.250 crores spent just on Kashmir every year on security. I mean its illogical. India and Pakistan cannot afford to spend like this for the next 100 years, well it looks like even 100 years is not enough for this. India have plenty of problems in house itself. We home the largest poor people in the world, many of our children are malnourished, you cant risk their lives for the issue of Kashmir. Talking to Pakistan is not the way, they will fight till all their people including civilians die, till their country will be a wasteland. Pakistan will not suffer since their will be no one left their by then. It is India who will win another war, but we would lose everything by then. We would be like England after the WW-II. Its upto us, we have to put an end to all this cause Pakistan is a spoilt brat. The US has fondled it too far for it to improve. Peace between India & Pakistan is like talking of a truce between a snake and a mongoose. So I think Indian government has to take a brave decision and declare Kashmir independent.

517. # NAVEEN MISHRA on 08 Apr 2010 at 8:48 pm

     @ MUNNUM

     My friend i am a new person on this site ..and i believe in good relationship even it is pak or india or anything…
     now see one thing no one is ready to listen some bad words about his/her country even u or me .but whatever u said is just hurting.why becouse ur not looking towords whole picture , u r just watching one side of that if not then give me the answer….
     1) which country is not having slum,even it is also in us.
     (if yes then why dont u see the slum of pak,)

     2) we are not getting milllions of $ from us like pak.
     (just like a few coins 4 a bagger) but still u r country is not clean i am not talking about slum i am talking about terrer.

     3) u know munnum …..u can live in slum if u have some good rollmodels in ur life like (MAHATMA GANGHI….do u have someone is it laden or maulana azahar mahmud)) but u cant lead a good life even having millions of us$ becouse u r living with terrer.

     4) talking on computer is a different thing but give me the ans. do u feel good when pak get money from us or feel shame .

     5)yes we r in slum but u never ask 4 money to some one
     and u r in such a good condition( in dreams ) but still u r open handed towords some one…..u know it hurted to us becouse it is that country which was a part of ours …..

     and say during writing these words i am not happy bcs i am not writing something excellent on a +ve topic but yes still i can say one thing to u thay plz. look in future , get better education ,make a good economy ,creat a peace. ……becouse aids(it killes to those who r resposible) is better than terrer(it kills to those who r not responsible…………………!

518. # Muhammad on 11 Apr 2010 at 9:46 pm

     Okay, i know im not one to judge but just the other day i was sitting with a group of my close friends. All of them were pakistani but i am actually indian but we are all muslim. We were just talking and something about kashmir came up. All of them started bombarding me with statements like oh india is fucking bullshit india sucks and stuff like that, and im like … on what basis are you saying this? is this because india is not a muslim country? i didnt know what to say and i did what my religion taught me to do which is to be patient and not reply, maybe they will humble themselves later. This did make me very curious on how pakistans and indias economy is doing. After lots of research off of online encyclopedias, newspapers, media google, i found a few videos on youtube, showing how many groups in pakistan rob ppl in atms, shoot people on streets, fire shots in the air …. for what reason? i dont know… if pakistans economy is bad, it is because of its own leaders and its own people. im not saying indias economy is much better, but i dont see indians on their rooftops shooting in the air. One of my family friends cousin died becuase of a stray bullet in pakistan. This is wrong. For all you pakistani people out there who believe that you are much better than other countries, first gain knowledge about yourself and who you are, humble yourself before you are humbled. Some people ar esaying “indians are scared, they say that they have all these weapons but they dont attack” … srsly, do yo u want their to be war? didnt islam teach you something? read the quraan with translation, read some of the prophets stories and still if you believe that war is the answser, then pray to god that your beliefs change because islam is the most peaceful religion, and if cant stand by it , we are not muslims and if we want to be muslims at least act like one.

519. # sanjay on 12 Apr 2010 at 2:27 pm

     Muhammad,
     You did the right thing, you simply cannot respond to these people who have been taught right from their childhood that India is their enemy.

520. # Nofal on 13 Apr 2010 at 2:18 pm

     I agree with Muhammad,
     but sir if you read earlier posts from indians such as punjabi soldier, nitin, G.Vinod etc. you will see that Indians are actually more offensive to pakistanis, sure we to have a few nut cases who can’t get their facts right, but most bias and offensive content comes from indians on this page giving their opinions on the topics rather than facts.

521. # Nofal on 15 Apr 2010 at 2:51 pm

     “im not saying indias economy is much better, but i dont see indians on their rooftops shooting in the air. One of my family friends cousin died becuase of a stray bullet in pakistan. This is wrong. ” -Muhammad on 11 Apr 2010 at 9:46 pm

     @Muhammad
     Sir, where in Pak, if you’ve ever been there do you see people firing for no reason????
     STOP assuming things, FYI i just came back from Pakistan is way better than what i expected, I know if an Indian comes to Pak they will be in for a shock because all that they’re media has taught them is WRONG.

522. # Saddam on 19 Apr 2010 at 3:24 pm

     Hello Indians Non Muslims !! All of you are talking opposite to facts ,Islam is a religion of “Peace” , The suicide bombers can never be Muslims bcoz Islam doesn’t allow Suicide . You are comparing India with Pakistan again and again but all of you don’t know even the method of comparison .Comparison is always made on the basis of percentage and ratio. Area of India is about 4 times greater than pakistan and population of india is about 7 times greater than pakistan.. In this way India should be 7 times larger than pakistan in every field but that is not .Indian millitery is 2 or maximum 3 times larger than pakistan ..THIS THING SHOWS THAT PAKISTAN IS STRONGER THAN INDIA. PAF pilot M.M. Alam has the world record to destroy five Indians aircrafts just in one minute then how you can say that Indians pilots are more skilled than those of pakistan.Pakistan is in the list of very few countries producing own fighter aircrafts .Pakistani missiles range larger than India.Pakistan made guns are more dangerous than india.

523. # Prince on 19 Apr 2010 at 3:34 pm

     An Indian said above that “India is world’s largest english speaking country” ! Then Mr Indian listen !You have lost your identity but we don’t…(ghairat mand qaum apni pehchaan nhi bhoolti)

524. # Saddam on 19 Apr 2010 at 3:43 pm

     An Indian above said that “in NASA 3o % Engineers are Indians ” ! He lies , India apna to aek satellite nhi bana saka to NASA mein kia hand Practice ker rahe hein

525. # G.Vinod on 20 Apr 2010 at 12:10 pm

     Nofal

     I have never sent any offensive message against Pakistanis. If you don’t like
     me condemning terror and the irresponsible attitude of the government in Pakistan,
     then it’s not my problem. While pointing fingers on others you should correct
     yourself and I think Islam too preaches that.

     “In J&K 29,000-,100,000 civilians have been killed, most of them Muslims”

     From where you got those false information?? If I say it in your style, is it
     from funny and cheap Pakistani media?? Even if what you had said is correct,
     see the matter which you had highlighted? “most of them Muslims”!!!! What you
     want to convey with your statement?? I can also say that you want to provoke the
     Indian Muslims against non Muslims in this issue. After death where comes the religion???
     If I say that many Kashmiri Pandits (Hindus) were chased away by the terrorists in
     the past (and they live like refugees all over India), then you people would say that
     Iam posting offensive message against Pakistanis or Muslims.

526. # sanjay on 27 Apr 2010 at 1:19 pm

     We Indians always boast of our numbers and maths saying 20% of scientists in NASA are Indians and blah blah blah. But there is one interesting fact about Pakistanis too.
     23% of prisoners in Guantanamo bay are Pakistani nationals.

527. # Sumit on 27 Apr 2010 at 11:40 pm

     I would like to invite everyone for a visit on a link —> http://thepakzone.com/main/indian-support-for-the-terrorism-in-pakistan/

     Check out this link first… If those, who think that Pakistan is supporting Terrorism are still not satisfied… I can provide even more proves…

     *Indian made Explosive chemicals, found from a college in Karachi..

     *Indian Garment Factory made Jackets used in Suicidal attacks…

     *Snapshots of a few places in India, where destructive chemicals are made & kept carelessly, even the pictures of sweepers who are cleaning the place where drums are stored… Ordinary people’s access to those chemicals..

     *Indian Ordinance Factory’s weapons found in Balochistan & Waziristan

     *Pictures of Baitullah Mehsood, coming out of Indian Embassy in Kabul… This is the same picture which Musharraf sent to Indian Embassador in his regime but got no answer..

     *Statement of Ajmal Kassab, who said that I was kidnapped by Indian Agencies and I was forced to say all this…

     You all can search all these things on internet… Just enter these captions and read about the real face of real terrorists… Pakistanis are not at all terrorists… Instead of this, we are facing terrorism… Our children, women, men, people are being killed… No other nation has suffered this much loss, which we have suffered… We are fighting hard against terrorism, still we are blamed for terrorism… Strange :@:@

     If we were supporting terrorism, We would have done all this in India, which India is doing in Pakistan these days, all these attacks & blasts… India will never ever miss a single chance to attack or invade Pakistan but they have kept themselves quite… Just because everything they want to be done in Pakistan is already happening, so why should they do this openely when Indians are supporting everything… Please please please, every please think with your brain, not with your emotions & patriotism… I would like to request all Indian brothers that you all say, your people have done all this progress in India, then please rather than spreading hatred in your people, try to let them know the truth… We Pakistanis are the Victims of Terrorism, We are not supporting or spreading Terrorism at all… Why don’t you all think on all these points :’(

528. # sanjay on 28 Apr 2010 at 1:16 pm

     sumit,
     don’t cry over terrorism. This whole concept of islamic terrorism was started and funded by the pakistani and american govt for their own vested interests against the good old soviet union and for strategic interests against india in the 1980’s and 1990’s. Its only now that they are out of ur cntrl and acting against u . u guys remeber an old saying:
     as u sow so shall u reap

529. # Nofal on 28 Apr 2010 at 6:18 pm

     @G.Vinod

     first of all, i got the 29,000-100,000 figure from wikipedia as the number of civilians killed in Kashmir conflict.

     Did u say that pak media is cheap and funny, take a good look at ur media, channels such as INDIA TV , AAj TAK etc they are crazy, they make me laugh on a regular basis.

     http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gQkEfwefrRs

     http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7R-Yru2yX3s&feature=related

     watch it im sure get a chuckle out of it

     http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9uOjS1Ho3T4

     ohh and this 1 ^^^^^ was made hours after the attack, and i think you’ll realize that it is a fake.

530. # Rokan on 29 Apr 2010 at 12:02 pm

     ^^ pictures of medicines and currency can be downloaded from anywhere. Why dont you zoom into the pictures of actual weapons and zoom on the labels of mortars and bombs.

     Dont try to fool around with non-sense, everyone knows who is terrorist country.

531. # Rokan on 29 Apr 2010 at 12:07 pm

     Infact in one of those pictures you can spot M72 LAW which is US rocket launcher, India only uses Russian slim version SA 18 Igla.

532. # Sami ullah Baig on 29 Apr 2010 at 6:07 pm

     The main problem with Pakistan has been the state patronage given to the fundamentalists. These people do not believe in economic and technological development. They just dream of making Pakistan a puritanical state like Saudi Arabia. India has no such problem. I would like that India and Pakistan help together. Weapons and war will benefit no one.

533. # Tasim on 29 Apr 2010 at 7:32 pm

     Hey Sumit [Pakistan], The Link you show on your comment is from thepakzone so, clearly its pakistani site not International Level. So Finaly, This page contain your thinking about India. And We Indian Muslims are Live much beatter life style then Pakistan. So Please don’t Show this type of funny information.

534. # Shanti Purush on 30 Apr 2010 at 10:23 am

     Dear All lovely people of India and Pakistan,Pls try to understand the gameplan of the west.We will never be a potential power unless peace prevails in our part of the earth.We need to make it Europe-II and give a deserving peace,prosperity and leadership on world platform to us and our future generations.Study wide,discuss long,open up.Lets change the south asia and the world.Jai Hind

535. # Swaroop on 30 Apr 2010 at 12:08 pm

     Hello All,

     First of all we should never talk about any religion. All the religions are great.
     All the indian who were talking wrong about Islam should see that how many muslim friends you have. Do you guys really talk in the same manner to them?
     About India and Pakistan.

     I feel that pakistan’s main problem is that they are giving more priority to their religion but they should give more priority to their own progress.

     For India I am very much heart after seeing so much corruption here.

     Both the countries have to improve a lot.

536. # Harsh on 03 May 2010 at 11:41 am

     I would like to tell all of you is that India is a peaceful country and does not do anything which is against any country unless and until our interests are hampered.Pakistan has been helping large no. of terrorists to cross LOC everyday and disrupt our peace,we try to trace the terrorists and kill thm and also we keep on requesting pakistan to stop terrorist activities from its soil.Relating to wht happened in gujarat the cases are going on and the responsible people will be punished severly.We indians are having large patience quotient but pakistan has played lot many times with our patience,the outcome of which is east pakistan turning into bangladesh,large number of our muslim brothers leave peacefully in india and some of them r best of my friends.ISI has been dreaming of breaking india into pieces but in turn we captured siachen glacier and divided pakistan,now I will like to give suggestion to my pakistani brothers to live in peace with us and make LOC as international border for ever with POK being declared integral part of pakistan and rest of kashmir under indian republic,its no meaning killing lot of people on the name of jihad,Jihad means doing something for the betterment of people and society,how come killing people can be termed into jihad,live in piece with us and if not then wait for the next war and pakistan will not be a part of world map,all will be india .Three wars pakistan has fought with India loosing something or the other,if pakistan has brains it should work for the people in its country without wasting money on terrorists,we indians are never going to attack pakistan unless and untill it does something against us.Kashmiris are our brothers and when i went to kashmir ,i liked the people and the culture there and 90% of them want to be a part of india,so why should we leave our brothers,kashmir is ours,we are not going to give it ever till our last breath,live in peace and let the world live in peace.
     Khuda Hafiz!!!

537. # sanjay on 04 May 2010 at 11:11 am

     sumit,
     i went through the sites you mentioned. Its nothing but a simple site that any person with a basic html knowledge can make one. Its loaded with text that say India is sponsoring terrorism in pakistan. y should we believe that is true, if pakistan always says it has no hand in any sort of terrorist activity in India. well the proofs that were given, we have ten times as much proof as you have and if you think those proofs are farcical then you must know that the same proofs were presented to the USA, UK, Israel and they accepted it as crucial evidence. Its only you guys that are saying its not enough. Well I have to say that its your investigative agencies inadequacy that you are not able to act on such evidence and trying to pass the buck on the Indian authorities.

538. # Steelman on 04 May 2010 at 4:15 pm

     Having trained with a few PAF trainee pilots on the IFF (Introduction to Fighter Fundamentals) on the T-38 Talon, I didn’t find that they were inferior to Indian pilots. In fact they were already on the move, as they knew what to do in their flying course. As for the Indian pilots, I’m with USMC, as an F/A-18 pilot, after my IFF on T-38s I transferred from USAF to USMC for carrier training on the T-45 and my class had 4 Indians. They were more amazed with our level of technology, the flying suits that were given to them, and the thinking that we all could sense from them that they thought they were the best in the world. So comparing Indian and Pakistani aviators I feel from a neutral side that Pakistani pilots are better in flying and ops compared to Indian pilots. As one point should be taken as well I noticed during an exercise I flew against Pakistani AF, they fly regularly, averaging to about 200-220 hours per year. And the Middle East, UK, and the US are full of Pakistani AF pilots mostly on civilian contracts. This is my personal point of view, maybe the Indian Air Force is better than Pakistani AF as I’m comparing Pakistani pilots with the Indian naval aviators.

     Semper Fi
     Steelman

539. # Lt. Talal Ahmed on 06 May 2010 at 7:05 pm

     Indians u r just piece of crap. I must tell u that the men power and the technology is not worth it. It takes a strong millitary training. I have seen some videos made on IMA which not that good, I does’nt has enough quality. Whereas our PMA i.e. PAKISTAN MILLITARY ACADEMY, is well known for it’s quality and millitary training. It’s not the game of guns and soldiers, It takes guts to be in a battle. remember a parrot speaks a lot but can’t fly high where’as an Eagle is silent and has the will to touch the sky..

     2nd Lt. Talal Ahmed…

540. # Sanjay on 09 May 2010 at 10:03 am

     Lt. Talal Ahmed
     We all know what we are capable of doing and we showed it well during the 1947, 1971 and in 1999. I’m not aware of the training that the two sides undertake, so I will not comment on it. Bot one thing I’m sure is that technologically, India is far more advanced than Pakistan, which has no control over its own region. The NWFP is far worse than Afghanistan, its the terrorist hub in the world. With due respect to all the Pakistani soldiers and their people, Pakistan has been producing a lot more terrorists than their army. No matter where, you will see a Pakistani hand behind every terrorist attack. The recent bomb scares in the Times Square is a good evidence of that. Pakistani army is good, but not better than Indian army. The ISI and certain elements in the administration support terrorism and that is the truth you cannot hide from.

541. # david on 09 May 2010 at 4:12 pm

     Its been while since my contribution but there have been many interesting comments by many different nationals. it still appears that many Indian contributors mention about the superior Indian military equipment and training over Pakistan and Pakistani contributors counter attack the Indians.

     The truth is India has only fought one war with another true heavy weight in 1960’s and readers/contributors guess who came second?

     Where as in Europe we are removing our borders to allow free trade and the movement of people, but in the Indian controlled Kashmir they are still erecting border fencing - trying to stop close family members seeing each other and strongly continue to oppose the United Nation involvement to resolve this probably longest outstanding issue.

     Please remember the suffering and the price the ordinary Kashmiri people are paying, but let me tell you its not winning India any friends but creating more hatred towards them.

     Readers/ contributors lets campaign for the resolution of this issue to bring long and ever lasting peace between our two friendly nations.

542. # Sanjay on 10 May 2010 at 12:58 pm

     david,
     Well the British started this whole divide in the first place. They first partitioned Bengal into East and West. This incident sowed the seeds of hatred among the Hindus and the Muslims that ultimately resulted into the partition of India and Pakistan. And if India is doing any such thing that you spoke about is to make sure that infiltration is under control. During the last 2 years infiltration in India has been at its peak. All the security steps are taken to make sure that the nation is safe from terrorists and the West thinks India is a war monger in the region. Yes this action has brought criticism from certain sections, but they do not realize the need behind such an action.

543. # G.Vinod on 10 May 2010 at 1:32 pm

     Nofel

     When American/Pakistan army kill civilians by mistake in Pakistan while fighting the Taliban terrorists
     nobody brings up the issue of religion but when Indian army does the same while fighting the terrorists
     in Kashmir then some people complain that Muslims are being killed in Kashmir. Unnecessarily the
     religious issue is brought here and it only help the terrorists.

     “channels such as INDIA TV , AAj TAK etc they are crazy, they make me laugh on a regular basis”

     The channels which you have mentioned above are all owned by private firm and has
     no links with the Government of India.

     “Did u say that pak media is cheap and funny”

     Please read and understand what I have said. I just repeated the language (against Pak media)
     which you used against India media in your earlier message.

     If India and Pakistan move forward leaving behind all issues then Iam sure that we can see more
     development and a system like European Union can be achieved in the near future. The problem
     is with our system and not between the people of both countries.

544. # Steelman on 10 May 2010 at 2:27 pm

     Yes I agree the NWFP part in Pakistan is like a haven for these “terrorists”. However this also a media problem, talk of terrorists you think of Pakistan. It’s India’s delight that they see Pakistan in these problems, also Indian intelligence are involved big time in this, along with the private military contractor Xe(former Blackwater). As US citizen, I’m defending the “terrorist” that has been accused of the Times Square scandal, because I know his father, he trained with USAF in the early days as a cadet, and met him few times in person, so there is no way that man is linked to these accusations, being from a wealthy family and educated background. One thing I don’t like about Pakistan is that they have the ability to stand up to US in some things. India I like for this reason that they have to listen to our every word, if they are told do this they will do that. Pakistan needs to basically educate themselves(if they need assistance they should ask) and rid its corrupt politicians from the goverment. I’m not pro-Pakistani neither pro-Indian, as both have similar rich cultures with a few differences, but I’m speaking as having good friends both as Pakistanis and Indians. Time to shape up things for the future of our and your children and start co-operating between each other.

     Semper Fi
     Steelman

545. # David on 10 May 2010 at 6:59 pm

     Dear Sanjay

     You have mentioned several wars between India and Pakistan in your previous comments however if i remember correctly there was another war in between the 1947 war and 1971 war and that was the war of 1965. I think its important that the readers are given the correct information. but its making me think why you have ignored that war?

     In your reply to my comments you have blamed the British for your problems, what can i say thats very easy excuse of our ex-colonies to blame us for all their problems, when infact both Indian and Pakistan have been independent countries since 1947. May i ask how come you have failed to resolve the issue of Kashmir during all that time and still continue to blame the British for your poverty, unemployment, inadequate health and education systems and above all the thriving corruption etc.

     Wake up and check the reality where the world is moving away from conflicts and yet India is still erecting more border fencing despertely trying to stop divided families seeing each others.

546. # Hari on 15 May 2010 at 6:01 pm

     Dear all,

     I am an India and a Hindu. Lot of people have talked about killing by our armed forces. Let me tell you India has the best human right activistes in the world who will do any thing to get publicity and our media will just do any thing for business. Please reffer to our phone tapping report recently. If you have any record of any killing by our forces please give that new to CNN IBN, Times Now, NDTV, Head lines today or News X they will take it from there. Dear All some people are commenting like entire Indias are bad people and All Kashmiries want to go away from India. Yes there are some people who want freedom from India but to tell that every body want freedon from India is not correct. Kashmir has been ruled by NAtive Kashmires for a long period now. It is always Vally parties which is ruling J&K. I had a privilage to speak to Kashmires people some time back there is a good sizable number of people who want to be part of India. And number is growing up day by day when they see the mess that Pakistan is going through. Having said this I love Pakistan want to see a stable Pakistan if She is unstable India can never be stable. If religion is take out of the equvation, is there any thing that is dividing us just thing. Sorry for what i am going to say now. All Indias should convert into Islam and that will solve all our problem, then we can even become one country again. My humble request please dont spred hatered through this thread.

547. # steel on 16 May 2010 at 2:43 pm

     It’s funny how the Indian army is based soley on Russian imports. Russia gives one of the best they have to offer for India.

     Pakistan gets the old and unwanted crap from America and China.

     Hardly fair.

     Anyway, I find this review to be biased. It’s so pro-indian….

548. # Jimmy on 16 May 2010 at 6:01 pm

     I think the actual enemy of both India And Pakistan is the US and the British. They are still playing divide and rule with our countries and have done it to such a success that its too difficult for both of the countries to understand this. I would love to see the day India teaches US a lesson and the day is not far. Everything that goes up has to come down someday.

549. # Tausif on 21 May 2010 at 6:12 pm

     Whoever says that Pakistan is a liberator or frnd of muslims in India is a sole liar.
     u ppl r just jealous of India’s advancements and it is always easier to blame the nation
     on other side of the fence.The education system in your country is a joke.Your political system is a joke. And ur country as dishonoured muslim population everywhere.

     Poverty and unemployement has driven pakistani population to pick up arms and march across the border.Your country needs to concentrate its minimum resources in fighting the war inside your own country.

     INCASE india gives u kashmir,hypotheticaly .wat future can ur country provide kashmir?make more terrorists? attack on rest of major cities in a cowardly manner (like mumbai).

     India has got her share of demons,but our demons are very much under control. Even political parties by BJP hu used to boost hindutva are realising now dat indian masses wont b manipulated by age-old hindu-muslim propaganda. The literacy rate of indians is rising .India has a HUGE population and poverty comes along with it.But the important thing is we r STILL moving ahead economically.

     I have known many pakistanis personally and every child born in pakistan is injected with hatred against India.What pakistani people dont realise is you are simply raising a generation which thrives of hatred and even though u love watching bollywood movies or soap-operas,at the end of the day u r going to say shit abt the INDIA.

     If ur people are so keen to do JIHAD and find the easy way to “HEAVEN” by killing innocent people(INDIANS BOTH HINDU AND MUSLIMS) where u will get biryani 24*7,which ur country is not able to feed u , y dont you attack US(ur non muslim ALLY). and the simple reason is INDIA has tolerated ur nuisance so long dat now it has become our weakness.PAKISTAN is the cancer to india and rest of world.
     one day …just pray… dat day never comes,INDIA will say enough and dat will b it.
     war is inevitable and losses r part of war.only we can emerge from the losses and PAKISTAN willl b annialated.

550. # MONAM on 21 May 2010 at 10:15 pm

     both the countries india and pakistan are same both have samr kind of problems so both v peoples try to do somthing for the walfare of each other its not the time of any war its time to become a good frend why our governments make defence budget so large we have to put this money for the betterment of our socities for our educations and for our future generation…..
     take care
     GOD BLESS U ALL……….

551. # david on 23 May 2010 at 3:22 am

     @ Tausif

     Well what can i say about your comments and the kind of language you have used in your comments. We brits call this ‘blow the belt’ language.

     I disagree with your comments apart from one which i totally endorsed and that is the people of Pakistan love bollywood movies. All i will say in my comment is that a large percentage of Pakistani are hooked on bollywood movies and its their nightly bread and butter before they could sleep.

     I will question those double standards time wasters who are hooked on bollywood movies and still critise India. “Shame on you”.

552. # amit on 23 May 2010 at 8:34 am

     Pakistan is a country created out of hatred, refer to the word “direct action day” by jinnah, he indirectly asked for a communal riot to be started to pressurize british government to agree to the demand of pakistan. Following the speech of jinnah the riot stated in kolkata and continued claming life till post independence. Only 2% of pakistan population is hindus and 15% of indian population is muslim and rest 85% comprises many more religious diversity, the data clearly shows that india has always been more tolerance towards religion.

553. # Taimoor on 24 May 2010 at 9:23 pm

     Can’t we just stop fighting friends. i mean i have an indian friend who i consider my brother and to tell u all i am a Pakistani and my father is in da Pak army and yet i still i have an indian vrother named Gaurav.

554. # Taimoor on 24 May 2010 at 9:29 pm

     before i came to U.S i used to hate india and that is becuase of our media propaganda but when i came abroad i was surprises to see how well indian people and Pakistani people behaved with each other and i became the same . u know in U.S most people recognize Indians and Pakistanis as da same people and i am glad they do that because it helps in unity no matter Pakistani or Indian we r all subcontinent people and only our religion divides us i mean we speak da same language but have different religion

555. # Jay on 26 May 2010 at 9:01 pm

     We both were once same country people. We belonged to one country and that is our strength. Britain did this partition for the exact purpose what we are doing now. I know its not possible. But imagine the country in its entirety as it was before britain seperated us. We would have become a superpower or atleast heading towards the position. Where we should buy food for people we both are buying weapons, while the poor struggle. People of Pakistan are not involved in these terror attacks i believe. But they should eradicate the organisations from their country and drive them out. As well India should be more open to talks and resolve our differences. But one thing is clear Britain was very clever and we are doing exactly as they wanted. Please just imagine all of you how our country would have been if not for the partition. These political leaders are bastards.

556. # Indian on 26 May 2010 at 11:45 pm

     Hello Pak friends. gujrat and babri masjit issues were block mark. but Indian population is 120+ crores.( few hundred were involved in this issue). but no comman Indian support this kind of politics. who said muslims are not safe in India.( if you really know any Indian muslims ask them then u know how ur media is doing negative propaganta).
     I ask you one single question . political posting, govt job even participation in game every thing muslim population getting chance may be like u thinking just 4 eye wash for world community. but no one can force anyone to accept the actors as their lovely hero’s unless their heart likes. It is regardless to say muslim hero’s are on top list who has lot of audience.(do u think fan’s of them are only muslims?,).If Indians hate muslims surly it will also reflect in kolywood. but it is not. Top actors belongs to muslim religion has more fans not bcoz of any reason just bcoz of somethink the audience like from them. they dont even consider which religious they are. If u accept my above statement. the situation is acceptable for other field and other social elements.( really that is ture). so understand muslim is also another co Indian. They are living peacefully in India.

557. # Indian on 27 May 2010 at 9:45 am

     Since the fog of war around both of our nations the weapon sellers can survive . ( Bcoz both of us alerting majority of budget for defense. Really that has to be spend for countries basic development. There are several countries don’t have military and some country still don’t barrow money from world bank (ex: norway ) . They also have religion but it is inside their house. They don’t have poor community in their countries.

     But their countries are not compitating world super power or military power ect…But their life is blessed by god ( swish, norway,luxamburg denmark etc…) just because of they don’t have any issue with neibour. so they can live peacefully.(still some countries have no tax on domestic like sale, service, road etc.. )

     Western were divide our kings to rule us. Also they have long vision that is why at the end of their game they start another ( in the name of separation). That is for divide and sell( weapons).

     Just Imagine If we are one or we don’t have serious issues , If our govt spent most of their income for country development since this 60 years after our freedom , what is our economy status.

     We both are misunderstanding about each other.

     Your misunderstanding - Indians and Hindus are against of Muslims

     Our misunderstanding- All the Pakistanis are terrorist.

     the answer is all the Hindus are not babri masjit breakers. and not all the Pakistanis are Abdul kasab.

     But as a Indian my opinion , Our defense is under our govt control but in your country govt is ur defence control.

     apart from that common man is same every country.

     long live humanity

558. # david on 30 May 2010 at 11:22 am

     We can not deny that the biggest cause of conflict between the two nuclear power nations is the issue of Kashmir.

     We can talk about other irrelevant stuff forever but it won’t get us anywhere.

     I simply can not understand historically your same people, similar culture, traditions and why your leaders can not be brave enough to sit down and resolve this issues which is creating enormous tensions and hostilities between the common people.

     Organisations like United Nations are specifically setup to assist with mediation role and forfill the wishes of the concerning people.

     Please do not blame us Brits with this outstanding issue, we gave you independences over sixty years ago and since then nothing has happend apart from fighting wars and killing each others.

     I will conclude my comments on the differences between the developed and developing nations are, you people talk about the problems forever and we tend to fine solutions.

559. # Raj on 30 May 2010 at 3:25 pm

     Luckily I am an Indian. As I’ve seen this site 1 st time & really like your comments. But do u know that who is in profit due to indo-pak tension? Those are weapon dealers. Some countries are selling their weapon or raw materials to both the countries. Do you know that, how much weapons purchased after Mumbai terror attack by both the countries? You cann’t imagine. These thing happened at the peak time of global slowdown. Global slowdown has not affected India or Pak.

560. # Harsh on 31 May 2010 at 9:07 am

     Friends,the conclusion to this debate is that we should not fight for things we are fighting for more than 60 yrs,we should be happy with whatever area of land is currently in our country.India should be happy with the kashmir part which it has and pakistan with POK,now to fight more for this issue will only lead to destruction and poverty in both the countries.
     Before 60 yrs we fought together for independence,now also we can fight for each other in United Nations and help each other in case of severe epidemics.No religion tells us to fight and we should be happy in whatever god has provided us with,there is no point killing innocent people,no issue has been resolved by fight till now and in future also it is not possible,the only way is through dialogue and negotiations,we tried to resolve the kashmir issue using peaceful means in 1999 when our PM was MR. Atal bihari vajpayee ,but what we got was a kargil war,we indians are peaceful people and dont want to fight and want to live peacefully and hope pakistani peolple also think the same way.Its good that the people giving comments are patriots of there country,everybody should be but a real patriot is one who really thinks for the country and its people.I want development in both india and pakistan and want both of them to be a developed nation in days to come.We should spend more on development rather than defence.
     A poor person does not care whether he lives in pak or ind,but what he cares for is that he should get food to survive.There are many non resident people here giving comments for both india and pakistan,have they ever thought to make atleast a single poor child educated and make arrangements for there food in there respective countries,is posting only comments on who is superior and who is not will show that you are patriot,the answer is no,firstly serve the nation the way it wants you to,there are many defence experts in both countries to conclude who is superior and who is not,please do some needful to the biggest thing called humanity ,then only u will get heaven after death and this is what is written in all the religious books including Geeta,Quran and Bibel.

561. # ASGARD on 31 May 2010 at 5:04 pm

     Stop fighting like wild childs, behave maturedly on world stage. Except USA no other country can afford wars right now…….. and that too only until they stop printing fake dollars and world stops using that crappy paper

562. # Indian on 09 Jun 2010 at 1:48 pm

     As a Trader i am telling do you people know lots of trade is happening b/w Indis and Pakistan. we are interchanging lot of agro products, textiles ect. may be some time the sugar or wheat what else you are eating from India is may be from Pakistan. and vise versa ( But most of the people doen’t know ). Traders don’t rejuct the business bcoz that is their enemy conuntry.

     According to the posibility of scaming The trade insurance will increase country to country. International Trade Corporation seperate the world countries in four catagory. ( 1st listed countries are consider as low risk countries (less cheeters) and the 4th list countries are high risk( more cheeters)).

     We both countries are in 2nd . So basically we are not bad peoples.

     May be you think we both are from diffeent ethics. but do you think other forigener can identify us from which country we are? by showing our apperence or other habit. Never.

     If you know anyone who is working as the lobor in gulf countries ask them. how they are treated by arabs or how they are living there.

     Indians, banglaasi or pakistani they live under a small roof. More than 50 peoples live in a small room , which is capable of living 10 persons. They sleep almost hugging each other. There is no special treatment for pakistanies or other peoples just bcoz they are muslims from their woners.

     Most of the Indian labor has pakistani room mate and friends in gulf. Poor peoples are treated same from their woners every were. since we have cultural simularities we treated very much same.

     Let us fight against of our common enemy-trerrerism.

563. # Shah PAKISTANI on 15 Jun 2010 at 12:07 pm

     Salam to all muslims, Being a muslim and pakistani i would like to say that we should united, Before Some years when PERVAIZ MUSHARAF is our Presidentm, there is no many problems like LOAD SHEDING, TERRORISM, etc. This govt. is like a TAIL OF A DOG, Zardari is not able to be a president, he is a THIEF,

564. # Taimoor on 18 Jun 2010 at 11:16 pm

     We should just pray to God that we can become united and live a happy life there’s only bloodshed and death in war and if u wanna die war is da best way to destroy one’s own country which i would not like to be see to happen to Pakistan or India

565. # david on 20 Jun 2010 at 2:56 am

     Dear Shah

     I am amazed to read your comments about your country and your president.

     First of all your comments are irrelevant to the topic we are discussing.

     I have the following views about your country your president and your comments.

     1 Your people were crying for a democratic rights when Musharaf was ruling Pakistan.

     2 The people in Pakistan do not deserve the democracy.

     3 I assume the people of Pakistan are forward thinking intelligent people and they knew the best parties and most capable leaders to rule the country.

     4 Are you expressing your views because of your party politic.

     5 It could be that the people of Pakistan need more party politic awareness.

     6 It could be that your Predident remember the famous American President quote ” its not qustion what he can do for America but what America can do for him”

     Perhaps your president is still waiting what Pakistan can do for him rather then what he can do Pakistan.

566. # The Human on 20 Jun 2010 at 10:49 pm

     We must all understand that all problem that exists today in south asia is due to britain. All of south asia.. India, Pakistan, Bangladesh, etc.. was the richest and most prosperous region in the world. British have destroyed not just asia, but africa, america(by killing the native americans). This country is ultimately responsible for most of the turmoil the world faces today. All the British did with the world was to loot and divide the world for their own gains. They got rich and asia got poor. We Indians and Pakistanis…(and many other countries in the world) must stop fighting each other, wake up and see whos behind all the mess. UK sits hidden showing an innocent image and blames pakistan and many other countries for the worlds problems… it is they who have led to all the chaos and war by looting and diving the world. Ofcourse i support no war and no hatred, but we must keep in mind the real culprit who got away so that we can remain in peace and harmony and work towards the peaceful development of both India and Pakistan… remember we’re ultimately the same people.

567. # Shah on 23 Jun 2010 at 5:31 pm

     @ M Robinson

     I agree with most of the statement you quoted. Seem like there is a white felle who actaully has a brain and not brain washed by media, atleast you seeked for the truth with sincere approach, and god bless you, if only there was more sincere people with true wisdom, then this world will be a better place.

     And now you have an obligation to share this knowledge with the people.

     So come Mr Robinson, expose your knowledge and let hope some of us actually learn something.

568. # Grifter on 24 Jun 2010 at 2:43 am

     Just so you’re clear, David… “6 It could be that your Predident remember the famous American President quote ” its not qustion what he can do for America but what America can do for him” ”

     This quote from President John F. Kennedy should read: “Ask not what your country can do for you, but what you can do for your country.”

     It’s the people that make the country.

     India and Pakistan were one while under British influence. Not until they released you did you split and adopt different ideals. The British are not to blame. The people of India and Pakistan have to show their governments that they want to work together. If that idea spread, and everyone went into the streets, what could the governments do but agree?

569. # raheel on 29 Jun 2010 at 9:50 am

     in my view, i think that pakistani forces are more passionate with their job. they are brave and want to do jahad against any enemy.

570. # c.v.santosh kumar on 29 Jun 2010 at 3:08 pm

     Liaquat Abbas,i guess u dont know about ur army morality,coz they lost thrice to our indian forces,i guess ur history is weak,go and find out about LONGEWALA BATTLE in 1971,100 indian fighting 10,000 pakistanis,u know what u lost it buddy,ur pakistan army retreated and they were scared.

571. # Praneet Bajpaie on 30 Jun 2010 at 10:21 am

     To all my Indian and Pakistani Brothers and Sisters,
     War, conventional or military is not an option for either of us. We have a long way to go in the development front. We are neighbors and have to live in peace. Only then will we become prosperous. I urge for all Indians and Pakistanis to let go of the hatred that we may have for each other. This will not get us anywhere.

572. # MAM on 30 Jun 2010 at 11:52 pm

     I would like to add that terrorist are thr all over the world… for eg. in India Naxal attacks they are all Hindu’s , you have got Cubans & Mexicans attacking in America they are all Christians so all Hindu’s & Christians are not terrorist…. We need to act fast and bring peace in this world.

573. # ProudIndian on 04 Jul 2010 at 7:20 pm

     Please all my pakistani friends get ur facts right…ur saviour Mr jinnah who created pakistan on false pretext of saving the muslims didn’t he know it was not possible to extradite all muslims to pakistan then what was the point in creating a separate country…as to his personal character Mr Jinnah was among the most liberals of muslims he had wine ate pork if you have doubts about my facts you are free to check the internet…I have no prejudice against any religion but it is not right to kill innocent civillians in the name of almighty god…He cries tears of blood when he sees his own creation killing each other in the name of JIHAD you must remmember that you are answerable to him in your afterlife…So just dont even compare to our great nation…and for another fact we have more muslim brothers in our country than yours…

574. # Nofal on 05 Jul 2010 at 6:19 pm

     @MAM

     ty Sir,
     if only more people on this forum would realise.

     @ProudIndian

     Not all Pakistanis commit Jihad, were not all terrorists, you accuse us of being prejudice yet you yourself are prejudice.

     India does not have more Muslims than Pakistan.
     India has 161 million
     Pakistan has 175 million
     ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
     that’[s according to wikipedia.

575. # david on 06 Jul 2010 at 2:03 am

     @ ProudIndian

     Your comments have truly made me laugh.

     Once again another Indian still grieving 60 years later after the creation of Pakistan and blaming it all on their founder leader Mr Jinnah and even more has cheeks to talk about his life style and his eating habits.

     I would not be surprised if comments are received from Pakistan briefing Indians about the selfishness and the greed for power of their Congress leaders like Mr Nehru or could even write on his eating habits including Hindu forbidden meat etc.

     Both nation leaders are intelligent people and must be aware that talking about the problems does not solve anything but seeking solutions are the only way forward on all pending conflict issues and their 1st priority must be to resolve the issues of Kashmir based on the wishes of people living on both side of Kashmir.

     As we Brits would say live and let live……..

576. # Abdurrab on 06 Jul 2010 at 2:41 pm

     Salam,Namasty and goodwishes to everybody particepating in this forum.Well, being a Muslim I would like to say the reality wether it’s going in favour or against us. As u know Islam is a Universal religion.It is for all humanbeings.Islam gives the lesson of peace,justice and equality.But unfortunately todays Muslims have thrownaway everything. They are faraway from the golden principles of Islam.We “Muslims” r just waiting for mericles to be happen.My dears u can’t achieve anything until u are active and follow the true path.You can’t rule over India until u are good and true Muslims.

577. # INDIA SHINING on 07 Jul 2010 at 4:03 pm

     is there any point in fighting over such lame issues…as of i know the prejudice among us has brought nothing but bloodshed…
     @david:-gandhi’s policy was live and let live and as of brits their’s were clearly divide and rule…
     @abdurrab:-stop day dreaming of ruling over india didnt you read the article clearly…

578. # Ateet on 08 Jul 2010 at 11:37 am

     Hello everyone….

     Just going through the comments, I was wondering which one of you is correct about their facts. If I hear a pakistan national, he seems to be right so as an Indian. I think the knowledge that we have is based on what we read and what we hear. And what the people of these two country listen and hear is totally different. Just now I was going through the website of pakistani army where they had summarized about war fought with India which to me seemed totally incorrect since what I had read in indian army site is contrary to what is provided in the pak site. Now since the concepts that we are provided with in our day to day life are contrary, there will be altercations whenever these two nations talk. Being an Indian, I would believe that what is written in Indian army website is correct and what is written in Pak army is incorrect and the same will happen to any pakistan national for that case.

     I think now is the time that both the nations stop pointing fingers at each other and forget the past and start some work to redefine their present which will lead to a better future. And as far as the power of both the nations in military context is concerned its not worth discussing since neither of the two nations can go for war since both are nuclear powers and waging the war and using nuclear power simply means END OF THE BOTH NATIONS.

579. # Self Relisation on 09 Jul 2010 at 8:47 am

     Jinnah’s father, Jinnahbhai was a prosperous Gujarati merchant who had moved to Sindh from Kathiawar. His grandfather was Poonja Gokuldas Meghji, a Hindu Bhatia Rajput from Paneli village in Gondal state in Kathiawar. His family had moved there from Sahiwal, near Multan. Jinnah’s ancestors were Hindu Rajputs from Sahiwal in Punjab that had converted to Islam.

     http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muhammad_Ali_Jinnah

580. # Indian Muslim on 12 Jul 2010 at 7:18 pm

     Friends, if you don’t realise, the main article was at the top of the page. Look at the Comments that have been added. Look at how many of these comments are rasist.

     I’m an Indian Muslim. I personally feel that the west has always been dividing poor African and Asian people to rule over them. In pre-independence India, Britishers divided the country into Hindus and Muslims. Even today, they’re doing the same.

     Open your eyes. We’re not enemies friends. We’ve been friends since ages, before Britishers set foot on our land. Before leaving, they divided us into two so that we keep fighting and never reach the status of the British.

     Let’s de-emotionalize the situation for some time. Let’s concentrate on our domestic problems for a dicade or two and develop friendly relations. Once the relations are friendly, let’s rehabilitate the 400,000 Hindu Kashmiri Pandits which fled from Kashmir to Jammu during the Ethnic Clensing carried our during early 1990s. Then let’s take a plebicide in Pak Occupied Kashmir as well as India Occupied Kashmir.

     Everyone of us knows that this is the only solution over this problem. But, hatered has blurred our vision. Let’s stop looking at the differences. Similarities will automatically catch our eyes.

     May Kashmir see peace. Amin.

581. # True Ogre on 13 Jul 2010 at 12:16 pm

     I agree with indian muslim. Pakistan and India are not two but one. We speak same language, are of same colour, same mentality. Why dont we realize that had there been no wars we would could invest all that money for the upheavel of mankind. Both countries have corrupt politicians.We share the same culture. US and UK are following their DIVIDE AND RULE policy only.

     Come on, we can live with peace and prosperity as we have benn doing so in the past (Before Britishers Arrive).

     I know several refugees from sialkot, and they told me that before partition all of them used to live like brothers. It was Britishers who Divided the land so that we may never flourish.

     All over terrorism, hunger, electricity deficit, poors are becoming poorer and still we try not to progress but to indulge in politics.

582. # addi on 14 Jul 2010 at 12:56 am

     well if all could be settled between both countries. I strongly reject the comment that before partitions only some Muslims decided to make Pakistan. Facts are very different. Hindu extremists themselves forced the Muslims for a separate land. Muslims were treated ruthlessly by Hindus under the umbrella of Britain. 1937 election won by congress and then what they did to the muslims. Enormous killing of muslims and no one were allowed to cover or take away dead bodies. During 1000 years muslim rule this what we did with hindus? who demolished Babri mosque? When anyone (Muslim or Sikh or Christian) in India raised for its rights against the they were labeled as terrorists. Is this secularism ? Is this sign of tolerance? Who is doing all this? Pakistan? What you think whats the basis of hatred b/w two countries India and Pakistan..? Its Hindu Extremism!

583. # Sanjeev on 14 Jul 2010 at 2:20 pm

     Compairing the size of the country, i believe pakistan is far better equiped as a country than India. But this is really pathetic that, nearly half of the population of the Countries are living bellow poverty line, still we are talking about misiles. Never the people talked about agriculture, medicine, education. we never been compaired on the basis of education. I dont kno who is doing that. But i personally dont like the governments to spend so much money on defence to protect people. When people will die in hunger, who u r going to protect? The religion of the people may be different, but the DNA of the people in both countries are same. We are from the same fore fathers. But we still fighting. Its not like all the faults are by pakistan government, but Indian govt too not doing enough to pave a way for a peaceful dialogue. I urge all the people of both countires, please dont make our peaceful subcontinent a desert. The afganistan is always been a desert and tried to make the indian subcontinent a war field n we always succeed to save our country from being a desert. now the time has come to forget about the past and live peacefully

584. # siddharth on 18 Jul 2010 at 2:33 pm

     now after the lewd remark pak leader realising that they go wrong as result they now want talk with india. this show that country is not in their hand they just copy what their army & their mean intelligence ISI says . one thing is clearly pak may go for talk or for war that can’t take j&k because it is integral part of india, and remain

585. # Bhupesh on 18 Jul 2010 at 10:29 pm

     @ david on 30 May 2010 at 11:22 am -
     Hey David, first of all, Britishers didn’t free us rather it was Indian freedom fighters and their work which made us a free nation. Secondly, you can’t just give a statement that we are still developing nation because we cannot resolve our issues. There are 100s of other issues which our country has resolved/resolving and growing. Anyways this is not the point of discussion on this forum.
     To the topic, I just want to say that war is not at all a solution to anything. I read today in an article that this month highest number of US soldiers (32) did suicide because of immense pressure at war place. I just want to mention that there is no country who actually can handle these types of wars for long. And at the end there will be no solution.

586. # Zishan Khan on 23 Jul 2010 at 12:24 am

     Since the independence of Pakistna, we fought 4 wars, Despite of bieng less number of army and tech, we won the most of wars, which proves that war can not be fought on the bases of technology alone, but with the strong idea and strong belief can achieve the gole in the war, and Pakistan army possese strong idea, professionalism and beliefs, that’s why our enemy has been afraid since Creation of Pakistan’s Power. indian’s don’t have people to fight volunteerly, but Pakistan has 1-2 Million people who can fight volunteerly, for the Pakistan. indians must understand there is no way except the relolution of desputes, your cold start docrtine can not resolve issues but it can increase in the problems of india, india should focus on Economic, rather than weapons race. According to survey, india has 2800 million people who live under the poverty line, which is larger in numbers than 8 states of Africa.

587. # hisham on 23 Jul 2010 at 10:30 pm

     @Abdurrab, Well said. I would urge all Muslims especially Indians and Pakistan to ban watching Bollywood movies. Some Muslims tend tend to go and watch films of Bollywood khans becoz they are Muslims. Wallah, they are not Muslims but are the friends of satan. They are all sponsored by rich hindu businessman who make money out of muslim pockets. These bloody filthy Khans instill fawahish in the minds of muslims and that is why there are so many Muslim who say that howmuch ever they earn, there is no barakath in the money. How can we rule India when we ourself indulge in immorality and filth. Remember, these film actors has no concern for Ummah except money, this is what enemy wants.

588. # Nofal on 24 Jul 2010 at 9:39 am

     @ Zishan

     Sir, before i begin I would just like to say…
     firstly-We haven’t won most of the 4 wars, we have gained territory i 1947 (if you call that a win) and we have defended our country from an invasion in 65. But we lost in 71 but I’d say it was a political defeat not a military one and as for Kargil, we won on the ground but lost on the table.

     secondly-India’s population of people living under the poverty line is about 456 million according to the world bank.

     Apart from that I agree with what your saying, despite being low in numbers, low funding, older tech we have managed fight 4 wars with India.

589. # siddharth solanki on 25 Jul 2010 at 9:44 am

     to zishan,
     its a totally joke he say that pak won all the war. first remember one thing war is war it can’t differentiate ur are posing less technology or not . i know in pak school in history book this thing were taught that india attack on our back, but we still able to win.take the example of kargil ,in which we defeat u without crossing the LOC , ur pakistan army were refused to take the body of ur own soliders who shame is this for any army in this world.now u say india doesn’t posing men to fight aganist pak voluntary ,that is again a joke . we r secular but when it comes to nation we all unit for it eg u have seen in kargil war. another about poverty u said it can be remove by development but look to ur country who is giving a birthto terrorism that reason nobody wants to visit ur country.

590. # Nofal on 26 Jul 2010 at 12:20 am

     @siddharth solanki

     I could say the same about India.
     As for Kargil, if our leaders refused to give into the Americans (which they never do) the outcome of the Kargil war would have been different.

     “another about poverty u said it can be remove by development but look to ur country who is giving a birthto terrorism that reason nobody wants to visit ur country.”

     Sir, poverty is in India too, in fact in greater numbers.
     We did not give birth to terrorists.
     You think we like having them on our soil? THEY ARE TERRORISTS! No1 wants them.
     besides it’s not like India never helped any terrorist organisations in the past; remember the mukti bahini. Who armed them?

591. # Indian on 26 Jul 2010 at 10:20 am

     Hey guys I just have a few points to make after reading numerous comments:

     1) To punjabi Soldier: Yaara I am seriously very impressed with your knowledge on Islamic History, culture and the Quran. However I have to say that all your comments on Islamic culture and history are ill-minded. Please do not pick up bits and pieces from particular events rather view these events in their entirety. What you have done is pick up only some statements made by individuals rather than all of them, some description of events but not all and interpret those pieces of literature to support your argument only. Please do not follow this method of preaching as it never reveals the real picture. I am a student of History and Theology, hence I very well know how much of the truth you have omiited in your statements.

     Furthermore please do not interpret the Quran in view of your biased opinion. Given my background in Theology I have carried out extensive research on various Holy Books including scriptures from your religion. I too can twist the sayings from your holy book to further an ill conceived argument.
     All the literal quotations from the Quran done by Punjabi Soldier if interpreted correctly are very different from how he has presented them. Please do contact me if you have any queries yaara.

     2) To Literate People: Religion and Education both have been created to make us better as individuals. No major religion or educational system has any other aim. Please utilise whatever you can from the religion you follow and education received by you to make this world a better place, where everyone from diverse backgrounds can survive peacefully. Judge a man by his deeds and not by his community, nationality or religion. In law or religion the person is held accountable for his own deeds and not his family members or countrymen. Please do not point fingers at many for the crimes of a few.
     3) To Indians and Pakistanis: I am a very proud Indian because of the many glorious achievements of my fellow Indians. But I am also an honest one and I do have to say that Indians do not know the clear picture when it comes to Pakistan. It is a country where 25,000 people have died since 9/11 due to terrorism. So just like India it too suffers. Please my fellow Indians and my Pakistani brothers have some sympathy for the innocent lives lost in both our countries. Leave the finger pointing and blame game to the illiterates as educated people it is our paramount duty to find a solution come what may. I haven’t seen one Indian or Pakistani talk about what they can do in their own country for starters to improve dialogue and relationships with the other. Indians or Pakistanis have not done enough on in their own country to resolve the differences, irrespective of past precedents innocent lives are still lost, which means there is still a lot to be done. Please be sensible and change yourself and the circumstances prevailing around you and in your country if peace is to be established. Do this not for anyone else but for the innocents people be they Hindus, Sikhs, Christians, Muslims, Indians or Pakistanis who have lost their lives and who could in very high probability lose their lives in the future if things do not change.
     Let Peace and Brotherhood Prevail.

592. # gston on 27 Jul 2010 at 2:58 pm

     I just have a few things to say after reading a few comments:
     War is never the answer. It just leads to more pain and sorrow. Both Indians and Pakistanis have come from the same ancestry and so, lets try not to forget that. We are supposed to be closer than any other nation in the world yet, we are enemies. Lets just forgive and forget. Now lets try concentrating more on improving our economies, agriculture,medicine,etc rather than trying to find whos building a better missile.

593. # Shalimar on 30 Jul 2010 at 3:51 am

     To Mr Indian theologian ?

     “I haven’t seen one Indian or Pakistani talk about what they can do in their own country for starters to improve dialogue and relationships with the other”

     Charity begins at home ? And you are so called Indian or Pakistani what have you done in your country so far for starters ? Do not preach us as we have plenty of preachers than executors.

594. # mudit jain on 30 Jul 2010 at 4:43 pm

     i can bet no civilian family man would ever like war this are all polotical…

595. # Tayyab Manzoor on 31 Jul 2010 at 4:46 pm

     I think this was written by some one who knew only the Indian Arsenal & based his reports on that

     Pilots training, Superior ballistic missile technology, Brahamous to be fully operational & Full command of Indian Army(equipped with those Ballistic Missile) is a big question mark, I think as it was written in 2007 So there are no prior knowledge about the UAV’s which are owned by Pakistan.

     In fact the main thing is that Indian Army is not that much superior than the Pakistan Army in manpower or ground technology that it is sufficient enough for Indian army now to overthrow & win a decisive conventional war against Pak Army, Because defensive strategy is always a better option looking at the ground realities, as we can see very recent ground fighting that super power was powerless against a guerilla war, So that can be option as well.
     But I don’t think so Guerilla war will ever come on that side, because Both are nuclear powers & nobody wants a full fledge conventional which will transform into a non conventional.

     War is not a good thing so take it just only a report..

596. # david on 05 Aug 2010 at 12:34 am

     The truth is that India and Pakistan have very similar cultures, traditions, languages and they have lived as one country for thousands of years.

     The problems started when Pakistan decided to go its own independent way, even now a large number of Indians still finds difficult to accept Pakistan as an independent nation.

     The issue of Kashmir is life or death for Pakistan. For readers information we are talking about democratic rights of some ten million Kashmiri people having freedom of choice to decide their own destiny.

     If the issue of Kashmir is resolved then there will be no cause for conflict between the two nuclear nations.

     Sadly where European countries are removing their borders and becoming much more integrated and some residents of the Indian controlled Kashmir are waiting to see their love ones living in the Pakistani controlled Kashmir for forty or even fifty years.

     My suggestion for a way forward and ever last solution is to allow the United Nation to hold a free and open referendum and offer Kashmiri people an opportunity to decide their own future in both sides of Kashmir.

     India claims to be the worlds biggest democracy and it must act responsibly with care for other smaller neighboring countries to gain more respect and to be play a key nation role

597. # Muhammedon 11 Aug 2010 at 8:09 pm

     Salaam/Nameste/Hello To my Indian/Pakistani and European brothers

     We should all forget about war,violence etc, even if somebody else perpetrates it against us as all our religions whether it be Islam/Hinduism or Christianity, all preach peace

     India and Pakistan has great capabilities of working together , but unfortunately it is not happening.India prospered under the Moghul Empire , and was at its strongest during the middle ages of the Moghuls rule, but you ask yourself why?

     I agree to David on the fact that Kashmirs should be given a choice , as they have faced the worst brunt during the India-Pakistan wars , and they is still major violence happening there with the death of 47 people in the last month , many of them in their youth , (9 year old boy was killed by Indian Police) about 2 weeks ago

     India and Pakistan should both invest their money into solving unemployment and helping the poor instead of spending it on the military , Gandhi should be a role model for these corrupt Pakistani and Indian Government officials

     Hindus and Muslims lived in peace for over 500 years under the rule of the Moghul Empire until the British invaded the beautiful Indian subcontinent, the British were the ones who caused the major conflict between Muslims and Hindus as they wanted to knock india into chaos and then have an excuse to devide India , in order to cripple it and maintain the tensions between Hindus and Muslims across the border

     I am an Indian myself and I wish one day that all the tensions between india and Pakistan is wiped out for ever , and India and Pakistan should unite against the Imperialist dogs- Britain , who brought death,poverty and misery to our people! , don’t forget about the great autrosaties that they did to us Indians , don’t forget about all the riches that they stole from India , which is still fueling their economy

     PROUD TO BE INDIAN!!
     JAI INDIA!
     LET US ALL WALK IN THE FOOTSTEPS OF MAHATMA GANDHI!

598. # Badmassh on 13 Aug 2010 at 8:27 am

     Pakistan cannot beat india at all. We indian people are not afraid of pakistani missiles. We have the capability to destroy pakistan from space. There is no need to use missiles for pakistan we can target pakistan from space and can destroy the whole pakistan. But we indian people are not so brutal to kill innocent pakistanis. The war is political and should remain political. Both sides have got corrupted leaders and both sides are unfortunate in this matter.

599. # Chandra sekar on 15 Aug 2010 at 6:18 pm

     Happy Independence Day to both Indians and Pakistanis

600. # adnan on 20 Aug 2010 at 5:02 pm

     Pakistan has Afghanis/Taliban on their side. This force has defeated all the great empires in its history right from alexandar to American forces now. Taliban in Afghanistan is winning now once again against the invading american forces. So, it will not be difficult for pakistan to defeat india by using these Talibans in the war. My question is, Do India have any such passionate fighters ?

601. # MMS on 25 Aug 2010 at 12:35 pm

     Hi Everybody,

     If military power is the only matter we should think of, wait for just another 9-12 years - India is going to be the next master to US, Russia, and China. But One can never imagine the present Pakistan to be.

     Next, if economy is an important factor, India’s fast growing economic policies and results are already evident to that. India will soon become the greatest economy next to China. But it’s almost impossible to Pakistan.

     Halt for a minute, Am I over looking India’s capabilities and under estimating Pakistan?, No, not at all. It’s the fact that entire world accedes. But, as an individual from both the nations, what would we achieve from these nasty competition?
     Nothing more than threatening to day-to-day life, or in worst case, both will hide behing the sands as victims of this competition.
     That’s not the purpose of human life. And, it cannot be mitigated, may be our fate is that.

     But in the mean time, let’s not strain our brains into this matter and try to live a peaceful life by forgetting the imbalances.

602. # karan on 28 Aug 2010 at 11:20 pm

     My dear friend in Pakistan both of us have many problems in our country, so its better we take care of them in place of fighting with each other. on the other hand we dont want to have another war but if we are forced to attack we will hit first & we will hit hard. And all of you people please dont bring religion in between when we talk about our countries. I am a Hindu Brahmin But i went to Deva sharif too to gives me peace to be there. In india muslims, Hindu, sikhs, Chrischans, budhist , jaines and all other religious people live together eat same food , and they got education in same colleges. thats the beauty of india.

603. # Qaiser Fayyaz on 04 Sep 2010 at 11:37 am

     Now doubt India has stored large number of weapons and now she is quite well on technical and quantity basis, but one thing we shouldn’t ignore is that Pakistan is a Muslim country and their soldiers are very brave and trained. Above all fighting against terror since 2001 has developed Pakistan Army well and now they have good experience to fight in all difficult circumstances.

604. # Steve on 14 Sep 2010 at 12:13 am

     India is a country of Christians/Hindus/Muslims/Sikhs/Parsis/Jains/Buddhists.
     A Democracy thats sucessfull & a Growing Economy.
     Its because all communities live together.

605. # Sanskar on 15 Sep 2010 at 7:33 pm

     Apart from all the weapons and resources Pakistan has, Pakistan has a special strategic and economical asset, Taliban. Strategic because it helps Pakistan maintain influence in Afghanistan, and sometimes to launch covert operations in India. Economical because Pakistan gets huge economical and military aids from various country to crush them which it actually doesn’t. Pakistan has been successful in carrying Taliban with it without letting any one know. Pakistan has been time to time protecting taliban, During the US war against terrorism pakistan wanted US to realize that its main enemy is Al Qaeda and not Taliban as the whole. Pakistan supported the classification of good and bad taliban, and supported the formation of govt in Afghanistan with good taliban after the exit of US. After the Mumbai attacks Taliban warned India of waging war against Pakistan, and supported Pakistan army.

     Pakistan and Taliban, are they brother or rivals? http://www.theworldreporter.com/2010/09/pakistan-taliban-brothers-and-rivals.html

606. # ravi on 16 Sep 2010 at 8:04 am

     hi guys!!!

     I am happy to see so many people discussing on this page.How many of you were there when these things happened. Be it about kashmir, babri masjid, ind-pak war. We are just common men. We stick to the facts we get through some bull shit sources. Nobody knows the truth. Who are we to draw lines and say that this part belongs to pakistan or this part belongs to india. I do not live in kashmir and if I am right nobody who is discussing here is from kashmir. Who are we decide the fate of people living in kashmir. Let us suppose pakistan gets kashmir. Would there be any difference in your daily life??? would you loose your job? would you stop breathing, would you stop having food. Nothing changes… everything just goes fine. Just to prove our capabilities I do not wish to go for a war with pakistan and kill the innocent there. They did nothing to us. Before we are indians or pakistanis we are human beings…. people who speak of war send ur family members to the war and enjoy loosing them….

607. # Auspicious 786 on 19 Sep 2010 at 3:20 am

     British ruled India by separation, while they leave subcontinent implanted that separativeness in our mind permanently. We are all stupidly continuing that mental concept still in our mind and all we are wasting our time, money, energy, and souls. Westeners know the human mind very well that mind concepts will live for thousands of years, so they did this trick and implanted permanent problem onto us. Now China also pouring oil onto that our burning wrong mind concept. We are the most stupid people (subcontinent dwellers), that’s why others easily play game on us.

608. # Indian liberal on 01 Oct 2010 at 8:51 pm

     @ Mr. Robinson…

     Dude …. I have gone through most of the article written by you… It’s nice to see that a British’s know this much about hindu rituals (Though it was not about any religion in particular) so first I would like to say something about India then will come on topic…

     As here we are talking about countries then please let us stick to that else if we will keep discussing about Hinduism then it will take ages for you to understand the meaning of Hinduism(all who believe in humanity and this nation are hindus only) that you seems to be a history student or could be a journalist who probably have read much but have taken it in unidirectional way this shows how narrow your thoughts are… See dude I am not saying so as I am a hindu but indeed I am owning secular thoughts….

     All the facts you raised are right but do you really how old these events are I believe a long back…. And such thing would have happened in knowledge any time soon it would have happened in some tribes….though its not my knowledge I beg a sorry for not knowing such things happening around in my countries…

     You kept talking about poverty in our nation just see how many reach people you can find here I am pretty sure that would be more then your nation (talking about counts and I think you can see the same in your nation how prosperous Indians are.) and also it’s a gift of English people to India and many other countries… so please stop barking such rubbish things as its been only 60 yrs for India to be independent and see what we have done 3rd largest economy and sooner or later we will rectify the remaining problems as well so please stop giving your fucking information as no one has clean history (we know everything comes out of cow is not milk ) you should first look at your own religion see what happened your god only forget about others and racisms started by you people only now GIVEN A CHANCE YOU GUYS KEEP THROWING SUGGESTION AS YOU ARE TOTALLY FARE AT YOUR END AND EVERYTHING WRONG IS AT OTHER SIDE….. So dude accept the fact….

     Sorry If look like being personal but its matter of My nation and its in our blood to fight for nation…. And somewhere you said that you saw it on BBC and if you really want to know then come to India and face the truth as it’s easy to criticize and tough to face the reality …………

     I agree that there are some pros and cons for everything but you need see it, As just reading the articles and books wont give you the real picture………….

     So its matter or indo pak and let it be limited to that and don’t incept you fucking thoughts here and try to create a gap in Indians…….its better to look at your own deeds rather than poking some one else I know it’s in your blood……………….

609. # Rizwan on 18 Oct 2010 at 11:31 am

     @ badmashh
     please fire one extra missile on Mumbai slums as well
     if u have tiny bit of live for mother INDIA
     destroy all your slums by firing missile from space which your mama sluty sonia placed after giving blow job to ISRAEL
     becuase these slums are causing major environmental problems in World

610. # indian_forever on 23 Oct 2010 at 4:36 pm

     how can someone say that just because a country is muslim their soldiers will be braver than any other country…lets see u guys go against america..they arent muslims!! and there are more muslims in india than in pakistan..so we win on that front too…why do i think that the pakis dont have the balls to fight against america because pakis wont dare go against their masters will they..just because the americans believe that pakistan is a strategic ally u guys get a lot of aid..(which frankly i think is money down the drain from the US perspective)..and now the americans also realize that the government is not in power and the army are de facto rulers..and the continuous tension between india and pakistan is frankly pretty stupid..the pakis are up in arms for “the cause of the kashmiris” in jammu and kashmir..not because they care about the kashmiris..(check out videos of the pak occupied kashmir on youtube)..but becuase they realize that if kashmir is granted freedom it will give rise to freedom movements across india…pak wants to divide india..revenge for 1971..as far as kashmir is concerned..azad kashmir is a safe haven for the militants..if remaining kashmir is separated from india..what is the guarantee that then pakistan will stop infiltration into states like punjab and himachal pradesh..

611. # Neo-Nostradamus on 27 Oct 2010 at 5:02 pm

     Now China is so friendly to Pak and lending lot of money, weapon, technology, etc, etc to threaten India . By the pressure of China & Pak joint hand, India is being forced to develop its defence enormously and need to succeed in inventing new defence technologies. Pak inviting & welcoming China and giving space for them to stay, live, invest and built lot of things in their land. One day in the future history a situation arises that Pak can’t payback its debt to China and financially bounds to Chinese. Inflation, political instability, civil unrest & terrorism getting uncontrolled, consequently Pak loses its military control. China then starts teasing India very badly. India looses its softness & patience and prepares for the war. India & China enters into final war on border issue to seek permanent solution. God favors India and victory follows after lot of human & wealth losses, consequently India decides to invade Pak and retreat all Chinese from there, and destroys all the Islamic terrorist networks completely and brings down political & social unrest there. Pakistan people start realizing the stupidity of their separatedness from India. The old blood of Indian origin will wave up in them and dare to rise their voice to join back India.

     After all some big loses, Indians thanking China for helping Indo-Pak reunion.

612. # kumar on 02 Nov 2010 at 12:10 pm

     sumit,
     don’t cry over terrorism. This whole concept of islamic terrorism was started and funded by the pakistani and american govt for their own vested interests against the good old soviet union and for strategic interests against india in the 1980’s and 1990’s. Its only now that they are out of ur cntrl and acting against u . u guys remeber an old saying:
     as u sow so shall u reap

613. # jackie on 03 Nov 2010 at 11:55 am

     If pak required kashmir, let them have it additional give them u. p bihar as bonus. But still after another 60 yrs they will be begging for M.P.

614. # kfffff on 03 Nov 2010 at 1:33 pm

     Hello, I am from India. India is far more powerful than Pakistan. Indian economy is far more larger than pakistani economy. Indian Defence Budget is far more higher than pakistan. I have seen many posts from pakistan which tell that there are millions of people in india under poverty line. But, you should knowthat China also has millions of people under poverty line. You cannot judge a country’s progress just on the basis of number of people under poverty line. India has more advanced air force. Do you know that? Your F-16 cannot counter our Mirage-2000 and mig-29’s. Mirage 2000 has encountered many F-16’s till now (from history). Mig-29’s are also 4th generation fighters and F-16 too. Su-30 mki is of 4.5 generation and F-16’s do not stand in front of them. You know that in quantity Indian air Force is far more larger than Pakistani Air Force. So, our airforce is better than yours. India has also more powerful navy. Your airforce has transport aircrafts like c-130 j but ouir il-78 is more developed than c-130. We have also our own UCAv’s and you do not have.Our navy has advanced stealth ships, electronic warfare systems etc. We have also an air-craft carrier. We have also built our nuclear submarine. I have found these informations on internet and also in pakistani newspapers!. We often build our ships at our dockyards. We have also a larger navy. We have more nukes than you. We have more developed land forces. We have advanced T-90 tanks. We have our own ballistic missile defence system. So, we have more nukes. We have more soldiers. Also, the site says that India is more powerful than Pakistan. Come to nuclear point. I know that both countries have enough capability to strike each other but we have the capability to intercept them. Also, nuclear weapons are rarely used. Smaller countries shall not allow you to use them . So, little hope.

     This proves that India is far more powerful than Pakistan Militarily, Economically. But, I want friendly relation ships between both the countries-India and Pakistan.

615. # Kumar on 05 Nov 2010 at 4:21 am

     Jai Hind

     And happy Diwali

616. # Mushtaqon 09 Nov 2010 at 11:22 pm

     India will perish… India will disintegrate very soon because it has Hindu extremists,, terrorists who suppress Muslims, Christians and low cast Hindus. There is no justice in India, it has fake democracy,,, totally failed democracy based on Hindus domination. There are so many separatist movements in India, which will bring fruit soon. I am sure India will have to give Independence to all not only to Kashmir. I think all the marginalized people in India should start fighting against India and get their freedom from Hindu banya. more than 80% people in India are living under poverty line while India is boasting to spend 20 billion dollars on defense. India should care about the poor people who are still sleeping in streets, than building bombs and missiles.

617. # A Muslim on 10 Nov 2010 at 8:25 pm

     HInduism is deceiving religion. Tell what is definition of hinduism? it has no even pet definition. A indian Raja embraced Islam on Holy Hands of Holy Prophet Muhammad PBUH by seeing miracle of cutting into two pieces of moon and then reuniting, which has been proved by astronauts who came to moon. Our Holy Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) are last OOTAAR which was mentioned in your books. May Allah Almighty give us the right path. Ameen

618. # A Muslim on 10 Nov 2010 at 8:35 pm

     Gandhi had a dual personality. people say non violence, his own nation did not abide by him. in 1947 hindues and sikhs started killing innocent muslims more tha a million. where was gandhi,s india. gandhi also started civil disobedience movement in india which led to violence. many hindu terrorists organizations like RSS was in close relation with Patel. a right hand of gandhi. then gandhi,s own camoflauged RSS kill him. This is lesson of history.

619. # sandeep toor on 11 Nov 2010 at 6:08 am

     well for me it troubles to see this, just think, if pakistan, india, bangledash were to unite, how powerful and prosperous our country would be, but unfortenutly the british didn’t think that was more important, god bless them, but still a unified country would make our india a force to be reckoned with, espaicsally since therefor our border would be with afgahnastahn and iran, meaning two of our great allies would be next to us, furthering our power, but it is what it is, i hope for the day when this will be true.

620. # david on 11 Nov 2010 at 10:35 pm

     I have been reading some interesting and others misleading comments from both countries for example there are more Muslims in India then Pakistan that’s not factual

     I must emphasise that Kashmir is on the United Nation agenda as a disputed conflict and it’s the biggest cause of conflict between the two nuclear nations.

     Please remember we are talking about democratic rights of more than ten million Kashmiri people having freedom of choice.

     Where as the European countries are becoming more integrated and removing their borders to benefit their citizens, increasing trade, allow free movement of people, India is erecting more border fencing desperately trying to keep the Kashmir families apart and quite honestly they are succeeding but it’s not winning them any friends.

     The way forward for an ever last solution is to allow free and open referendum for all Kashmiri people under the supervision of the United Nation to decide their own future.

621. # ahmet on 12 Nov 2010 at 7:47 pm

     Pakistan is one of the failed states it is 10th currently.
     Source:http://www.fundforpeace.org/web/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=452&Itemid=900

     I know your going to ignore this because you can’t reply, or prove it wrong. Even if u reply you’re going to talk about something completley diffrent that is not true.

622. # ahmet on 12 Nov 2010 at 8:01 pm

     Gandhi was a very great leader like Ataturk, Pakistani stamps have Ataturk’s picture on them. Gandhi’s way of resisting was very noble and great he used a non-violent resiistence he could have wped out the British if he wnated to but he didn’t. Because he wanted a NON-VIOLENT, ife he didn’t bring the idea of dividing India Pakistan woudn’t EXIST, but India would have been very unstable due to inner conflicts that would occur.

623. # ahmet on 12 Nov 2010 at 8:03 pm

     Turkey is one of Pakistan’s allies but I still want to point out some of it’s flaws. Pakistan needs a great leader now, if not they might fail to turn their economy stable again.

624. # Auspicious 786 on 14 Nov 2010 at 3:50 pm

     @A Muslim
     Christians & Muslims came from the same monotheism concept. They are seeds of same tree with little difference. Due to this difference they can’t accept each other and their high religious intolerance will cause them to destroy each other over the time. Hindus no need to worry about these two religions. Hinduism is a ocean of philosophy suitable for all the time, and contains very strong religious tolerence. By virtue of its features, history, and values it will sustain for hundreds of millennium.

625. # i love my country on 16 Nov 2010 at 8:41 pm

     I am wondering most of the Pakistani friends are thinking they are brave just bcoz they are Muslims and “their soldiers will dye for their countries but Indian soldiers working only for money” hello Pakistani friend who teach this kind of rubbish stories to you. we are more patriotic than you. why u easily forgot u lose war before. do u think it is just bcoz of technology?. it is just bcoz of our bravest soldiers. first understand one thing weather it is smallest country in the world they love their country and their soilder like to dye for their country, it doesn’t matter which country that is.

626. # Auspicious 786 on 18 Nov 2010 at 5:36 pm

     To: every religious people who read this blog.

     All the religions are not false, but only one religion is true. To understand this statement, please read my above argument.

     Pakistan friends: Please don’t think simply Islam is the only best under the Sun, India has deeply gone through the philosophy of God many thousand years even before any other part of the human mind in the world start searching for the God.

627. # TeeJay on 20 Nov 2010 at 3:42 am

     To all friends in India and around the world who had been participating here, this thread is about military strength of Pakistan and India, and reading the stats we can see clearly the intentions of the two nations. India is dreaming about attaining status of a super power, on the other hand Pakistan is trying really hard to keep up with minimal deterrence. And I would say Pakistan is doing a great job in that regard, or otherwise they were overrun by their Indian friends long ago, as it is so much evident every Indian has a dream of uniting the sub-continent back again. Indians may need to look in this matter again, they will find out that the Sub-Continent was never in the history one country before the British, and it can never become one country. At-least not after the partition and creation of Pakistan. Pakistan was created out of ideology, it is not just a mass of land. I will refer to Mr. Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto’s speech in Security Council, when he said to you (Indians) and the rest of world. “Alright so, what if Dhaka falls? So what if the whole of East Pakistan falls? So what if the whole of West Pakistan falls? So what if we are being obliterated? We will build a new Pakistan. We will build a better Pakistan. We will build a greater Pakistan.” And I tell you today, this dream of yours will never become reality. Ever.

     Let’s look back and see, what makes Pakistan economically not stable today, that my friends is also because of you. India had been trying to disunite the provinces of Pakistan all along, So tell me how does that work, disuniting and then uniting the whole Sub-Continent back again? I fail to understand that. Yes we also had our own causes too, but we also are forced to keep a large military just because, your shortsighted pseudo intellectuals, can not accept Pakistan as a sovereign country.

     You want to legalize aggression, just because you have one of the world’s largest military? What you are talking about here, and in most threads is hatred towards Muslims, and still you want the world to believe that Muslims living in India are happier than the Muslims in Pakistan? We did not let you rape our women, and kill hundreds and thousands of people migrating from India to Pakistan at the time of partition just because we become India again. We never will become India. Time to wake-up!?!?

628. # TeeJay on 20 Nov 2010 at 3:57 am

     I would just like to add one more point, that may open your eyes, India and Pakistan don’t even share common heros. What are heros to us are villains to you and visa-versa. And oh yeah, WE LOVE JINNAH. I know you can’t take that, so same last message again, WAKEUP INDIA!!

629. # TeeJay on 20 Nov 2010 at 4:12 am

     Indian liberal on 01 Oct 2010 at 8:51 pm
     “As here we are talking about countries then please let us stick to that else if we will keep discussing about Hinduism then it will take ages for you to understand the meaning of Hinduism.”

     @ Mr. Robinson
     He’s right about that, it took them thousands of years and still it’s a mess for them. How could you understand Hinduism.

     @ Indian liberal
     Truth is different from your perception and aspirations. What you call hinduism was never a faith, I suggest you read few books on the history of this land. The word Hindu is derived from the river Indu/Indus (meaning the land of the people of Indus). That name was given by the Arabs and it’s not a religion. By the way which hindu are you?

630. # Auspicious 786 on 21 Nov 2010 at 4:29 pm

     @ A Muslim

     In Hinduism, Lord Shiva is Ultimate God who has the power to destroy the whole Universe just by opening his third eye. Lord Vishnu is a Protector or Savior of all creations, and Lord Brahma is a Creator. Both Gods are originated from Lord Shiva.

     Muslims want to believe only in Ultimate God, so all your Mosque are nothing but temple of Shiva.
     Christians want to believe in Christ as a savior, so all Churches are nothing but temple of Vishnu.
     Buddhism want to believe in Spirituality & co-creation, so all Buddist temples are nothing but temple of Brahma.

     Hinduism is a ocean, and it can take any number of rivers in it.

631. # david on 24 Nov 2010 at 1:29 am

     @ Ahmet

     I find your comments fascinating about India and Pakistan.

     Let’s look at your country Turkey where military was the most powerful and dictatorship institution as long as I could remember and the democratic change has only recently happened.

     Turkey truly has identity crisis it’s confused as it considers it self to be European but the Europe has firmly closing its doors and considered Turkey as an Asian country. Europe can not forget the Turkish history and the problems it created for eastern European countries.

     Turkey was the only Islamic country with diplomatic ties with Israel which cut the country off from the Islamic countries and no Islamic country respected her.

     So what do you say to that?……………….

632. # Praneeth on 24 Nov 2010 at 11:05 am

     Hi every one!!!

     @ A muslim

     Dude, i request you you to respect other religions. Who cares what religion we follows? Afterall every religion good words in itz own holy books. But how many of us are really following it? And yeah about Hinduism, have you ever heard about NAV GRAH? means 9 planets.. thiz word was bieng used since many centuries. How you think it was know long ago when there is no technology? Mathematics is born from Indian VEDAS. Einstein revealed this.

     I can say am proud to be HINDU because many hindus believe in all gods, AS I DO. I respect all religions.thats the speciality of INDIA.

     JAIHIND!!!!

633. # Aryan- The Natives on 27 Nov 2010 at 11:08 pm

     I’m gonna talk about 2 issues.
     First, we separated into 2 different countries, India & Pakistan. Is there anybody tell me how much we differ from each-other by our ancestry. If we open the pages of history, we can see, the Aryans came to this land about some 6k-5k years ago. Then came others, say the mughals (about 500 yrs ago). Then, they became an integral part of India. If we proud to have The Taj Mahal, we must remember, that it was the mughals who built this. But after separation, we are just quarreling. And, look at the british, they’ld still be thinking to acquire India/Pakistan some-day. USA is helping so much Pakistan, think why. It is using Pakistan for it’s own cause/purpose. What’s verby is verby. We should start behaving like neighbors now. If both these countries would have helped each-other in past, then the future would have been different. Remember, we even share same language(i.e Hindi & Urdu are quite similar). Why can’t we share the same fate.

     Second, there had been much discussion about religion, especially Hinduism. What I understand about Hinduism is that, It’s not much a religion but much like a way of life. The holy Bhagavad Gita even talks about purpose of life, a-lot about karma, yoga.
     They never talked about castes or some rituals that are even practiced today. Better, u people can refer to Swami Vivekananda’s speech at Chicago, The World Parliament of Religions. Our Vedas tell us to be like human. How could we forget what our ancestor showed us. Gandhiji has showed us the way of truth and non-violence. Buddha has taught us about truths of life. They taught us about forgiveness, ahimsa and other-things. These learning that we inherit by birth are jewel for our life. So, I’ld request every-one who want to learn more about Hinduism should learn these sacred scriptures.
     Thanks all

634. # Auspicious 786 on 29 Nov 2010 at 6:37 pm

     All Muslims in this world boasting that they are not adoring any idol but only one God Allah.

     If you study how human mind is working, then you can understand that our mind always try to picturize things which we hear, study, imagine, and visualize or eager to see.

     Now 1.5 billion Muslims around the world living today and every Muslims has got some picturization of their Almighty Allah in their mind after reading Quran which describes about the only God and from there everyone has got their own rough picturization of the loving God in their mind.

     So there are 1.5 billion virtual mental pictures of Allah is currently existing on the earth. It is literally equal to 1.5 billion virtual mental idols of Allah.

     How Muslims can argue that it is nothing wrong how individual want to visualize Almighty Allah, similarly in Hinduism we have carved our Gods out of gold, copper, bronze, iron, stone, wood as idols from our own mental picture to show our love has got nothing wrong in that.

635. # vipul on 01 Dec 2010 at 1:32 am

     Hi all,

     Lots of discussion on india pakistan, ISLAM and HINDUISM. Lets talk about the military aspect of both the countries.
     First of all I dont see pakistan any threat to india anymore and india is looking forward to compete china at the moment as pakistan itself is in the process of self destruction and thats a fact. If you want to compare the two militaries then pakistan dont stand anywhere near to india so even if war happns then pakistan’s defeat is for sure. In case of nuke strike which is unlikely to happen then it wud be the complete destruction of pakistan. but being india’s neighbour its not in our favour. but the fact is that india has already started its war with pakistan by exposing its intentions to the whole world. Infact we are on the brink of winning this war. Few years from now we will be surpassing china and to achieve this usa and other european countries will help india to become a super power and that process has already been initiated.The whole developed world is seeking business opportunies in india as it being an exciting market not in terms of arms but other business opportunies. So India’s future is bright.

636. # Auspicious 786 on 06 Dec 2010 at 6:58 pm

     @ A Muslim

     Muslim’s sacred Kaba was a Shiva temple once upon the history during King Vikramaditya time at which Arabia was under his reign. It could be called kabalishwar temple during that time. Now Kaba is central to Islam (submission), Hindus can call it with a new name “Islameshwar” temple, means submit to eternal God Parameshwar (Shiva). The Muslim’s eternal God Allah is none but Lord Shiva who is omni-scient/potent/present and no one is equal or above him. He was neither begotten nor created, and existing all the time.

637. # salman on 11 Dec 2010 at 6:35 pm

     whoever you are vipul i hope u read this we have the support the of our GOD and through this no power what so ever can defeat this and as for your intentions for planning against pakistan you guys have been against pakistan for decades but still u have not been able to defeat us do you think we as a nation are idiots and dont understand that you are prospering but pls dont think that way we are going ahaed as a nation are nuclear arms are far more advanced than yours but they are mere in number and if u have the balls step on pakistan soil

638. # Ritz on 12 Dec 2010 at 12:30 am

     @Aus[icious 786….
     Well said.

     This is to all the readers that plz when you are passing your comments request you to do some home work and be advised that what you are posting here shows your personality and faith in your culture/country. Be optimist and be matured enough to accept facts.

     Good Luck to poor people for their poor personalities and for their thinking hats.

     Cheers!!!

639. # Auspicious 786 on 17 Dec 2010 at 4:47 pm

     @ All

     Pakistan was formed purely based on their religion and current problems are also related to same issue. That’s why we need to talk little bit about religion in this blog. It may look like religion is out of topic, but that is the factor behind all the problems between these two countries. Strength of Military, Navy, and Airforce are interesting to discuss, but the God’s force is invisible and beyond to the humand mind’s comprehension. God favours which country may be sometime looks like no meaning, but overall human efforts will influence God’s view. In general, God is interested in uplifting of individual soul, and country is immaterial for him.

640. # Auspicious 786 on 25 Dec 2010 at 6:31 am

     Every mosque’s dome and its crescent looks like top portion of Shiva Lingam which is symbol of Hindu’s Ultimate God Iswar who is wearing crescent on his head. Every religion in this world were formed to show the path of life to reach God’s paradigm. Devil is in everybody’s mind in the form of ego which is the major cause of all the problems of humanity.

     Shiva is the most sacred picture I ever seen in my life which symbolizes the whole Universe and life.

     *His deep mediation state represents the “Silent Space” exists both inside & outside Universe.
     *Ganges (water) flowing from his head represents the life (water is life) which is needed for the fulfillment of Consciousness.
     *Woman’s face on his head represents the Shakthi (energy field of whole Universe). In Hinduism, female is linked to Sakthi.
     *Crescent represents “The Mind” which is amazing product of this Universe. Moon always linked to human mind which is not stable always.
     *Third eye represents black hole(s) of the Universe which is used to revert back matter into anti-matter (silent space). It is commonly said that if he opens his third whatever or whoever exists in front of him will be destroyed without any question.
     *Slightly opened two eyes represents he is not darkening the whole Universe, but allowing some light into him since he himself is the Universe and life which needed light.
     *Snake around his neck is the vector force needed to initiate the matter of energy from emptiness of the space to form the Universe. A single small minute vector force initiated in the endless empty space starts to inflate and creates tremendous amount of central compressive force over the billion years of time which leads to a big bang to form the matters.

     So the representation of Lord Shiva provides understanding of the whole Universe and beyond. Every matter, knowledge, and consciousness are within him. He is the only one God has the rights to hold the status of Omnipotent, Omnipresent, and Omniscient.

641. # SINGH UNITED on 26 Dec 2010 at 6:10 am

     Good day fellows,, some people were saying too much crap. The real deal is >>India with a Muslim president( ATOMIC GURU) , SIKH Prime Minister( ECONOMIC GURU) & christian women President of india’s most influential CONGRESS party, who have run a HINDU country to its prime, this is called secularism. & this happens only in India. Little mishaps happend in past among different religions, but still they all are serving in best interest of INDIA. Remember PARAMVIR CHAKKAR Shri ABDUL HAMEED, Sardar Nirmal jeet SINGH SEKHON & Shri MAjor Vikaram Batra respective a Muslim, a SIKH & a HINDU who sacrify their lives to SAVE their motherland that is INDIA. the people who say India gonna parish someday, are day dreaming & stupid. India is a Supreme force dominating & conquering all over the world. The only country that could become a chapter in HISTORY books will be PAKISTAN, if It continues having ill feelings toward INDIA & supporting terrorism.

642. # Mridul Singh Shekhawat on 29 Dec 2010 at 10:31 pm

     Forgot to add….

     @ to all Indian and Pakistani supporters and foreign nationals supporting either of the countries.

     As far as the armed forces are concerned and the comparison between India and Pakistan; all about which this blog is been created. Speaking the truth….. rather I should ask you all….. first put your hand on your heart and think of the God you believe in and then answer the questions below:

     If the nuclear weapon war gets triggered between India and Pakistan then -

     1. What do you think who will loose ? To make it easy for you who will have to suffer the bigger loss ?
     2. Which religion is going to be proved superior ?
     3. Who will be held responsible for the destruction ? Options are A. Muslims B. Hindus C. Indians D. Pakistan E. Britishers F. Extremists

     I am sure you all know the answers… the only purpose of asking above is to show you whether or not - you have the right to participate in this debate ? Be ready with your answers and than scroll down.

     If your answers matches (Your answers must be the one which is deep inside your heart) the answers below you have the right to think, speak and do something at least for your religion and country. If you can’t do that you can’t help on Indo-Pak issue either and its better to mind you your own business, avoid participating in such debates because it will make things worse and try to keep your ears and mouth shut in such issue because if that’s the case you need to grow up mentally, learn again what your religion teaches and understand the beautiful earth and wonderful humans are not your belonging which you can spoil or destroy with your hatredful thoughts and deeds. So the correct answers are as below (MODERATORS ARE REQUESTED TO NOT TO REMOVE THE BLANK LINES IN BETWEEN, doing so will defeat the whole purpose of putting them…Thank You to Moderators for not removing them):
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     1. Neither Pakistan nor India but the Humanity will loose. It will be a loss of entire human society, our religions which have institutionalized in thousands of year just to preach the lesson of love, brotherhood, humanity, peace and faith in the almighty god (Allah or Ishwar). It will be a defeat of us, our countries, religions and humanity as a whole. To add to your curiosity - No one will win even if just Pakistan or just India gets destroyed which is not going to happen in any case because the way defense systems work both side would have already ensured to put auto triggers in case of emergencies.

     2. I can assure you the heaviest loss will be suffered by the common masses of both country (as it has occured at the time of partition and following wars between India and Pakistan). Whether it be men or material loss it will be related just to common masses, the innocent people. People whom neither their religion fed ever nor their country could provide shelter. The powerful and wealthy leader of this common mass will surely manage to escape before all that is going to happen and even after decades people like them will not let the people live with peace. It will kill millions of children who don’t even understand what armed forces, nuclear weapon, Hindu-Muslim or India Pakistan means.

     3. If that happens….It will prove that our religions were based on completely wrong fundamentals, beliefs and philosophies. It will be addressed in human history as dogmatic, orthodoxy, and ill fated extremism which never brought the human close to his god but goaded it towards destruction and devastation. In that event.. it will be called that the message which holy saints and there disciples gave to the people was to follow evil and that was done deliberately to finish the existence of life from earth which God has gifted to us with no right to take one in his name. None of Hindus, Muslims, Indians or Pakistanis will be held responsible nor it will be Britishers who sowed the seed of separatism between India and Pakistan. Because its been more than 60 years now since Independence and it is 3rd generation of leaders and 4th generation of common masses in both countries which is fueling the urge to kill each other. So the ultimate responsibility for that will be “YOURS” & “MINE” because we have worsened the situation. Whenever it came to peace and mutual co-operation we never stepped forward to help we never stood by each others side when we were in distress. Instead of not repeating the mistakes of our father and forefathers we kept on repeating them even more intensely.

     Believe me all !!! talking about India and Pakistan’s military capabilities, merits, demerits, good and bad will neither solve the problem of terrorism in India or Pakistan nor it will give hungry, poor and illiterate masses food, shelter and education. If you really want to show the pride you have as a Hindu, Muslim, Indian or Pakistani try to do something constructive…. something which can improve our countries. Both countries and religion need tremendous reformation… a kind of renaissance… to do something remarkable about Indo-Pak issue. This life is just for once it is completely upto us to make it beautiful…. the current scenario is the result of blunders our previous generation has done. Is it what we want to pass on to our next generation ? World’s two nations with richest cultures and the oldest two religions which have so much similar in them and despite of that we are always ready to kill and die just for what ? I couldn’t even understand… its not religion, its not Kashmir, its not britisher’s misdeeds to separate India and Pakistan and its not nuclear weapons or our efforts to prove supremacy over each other.. It is we ourselves, our ill mentality, unnecessary hatred and resultant competition in warheads, growing tension cross borders and stubbornness to be ignorant towards the ground realities on both sides.

     Come on let give it all a new start…lets aim for a better future for us and our counterparts all over the world. Stop writing all these shit…. we ain’t want to do this. We deserve better than what we are today. India and Pakistan can become “Missal” (a contemporary Urdu word meaning - good example) for others instead of making “Missile” (a filthy word sounds like Devil’s Dick) for one another.

     I keep on searching for blogs and article like this and I try to convince people that we are going in wrong direction. In India as far as I believe more than 90% people don’t want any tension with Pakistan because we understand people over there are just like us. Its just a very small percentage of total population in India who is ill minded. And I am sure same is with Pakistan.. and unfortunately people who are active in debates like these are generally out of the remaining 10% from both India and Pakistan.
     I have generally read over here that Indian media is showing everything manipulatory and its all propagandistic media..well I that’s completely false.. People wouldn’t have said that if they have watched programme like “Chottey Ustaad” where you get to see that how much a ordinary Indian would like to see an Indian and Pakistani standing side by side for noble causes. Indian media has played an important role in the political, social, and economical development of India and it has eminently acted to show the ground realities in India and Pakistan to encourage the Political cooperation. It has increased transparency in the democracy and bureaucracy manifolds. An Indian citizen has now “Right to Information” to know what he/she is ought to know and media has played a great role in getting that…many big government and corporate scams were made public by media. Media in India never tries to portray false image of Pakistan as well… It is as good as it is with Indian matters…right as right…and wrong as wrong. At times media has criticized Indian government for increased spending on defense (however as a democratic country it is quite necessary to keep the public assured that the country is progressing well on all fronts…so I wouldn’t completely blame the govt.) but media is not manipulative at all. (Well a few exceptions are everywhere…they may exist..but not to my knowledge). I don’t know much about Pakistani media and don’t want to comment based on assumptions but to the extent of my knowledge it was influenced by military run government a lot. It is quite possible due to that influence it has depicted wrong picture of Indian government and the democratic strategies of the government (I am writing all this stuff just to tell what are the possible causes of tension between India and Pakistan. My intention is neither to boast about India & Indian media nor it is to defame Pakistani govt agencies and media) Not all fingures are equal like I have said it earlier both India and Pakistan got certain internal issues of their own which they need to commensurate with accordingly. And all we can do is encouraging co-operation and non-violence…. Though commenting on blogs like these is not going to change the government and decision is both countries but its us who together are called a nation on both sides. We can do our bit and encourage others to do there… that’s all.

     Thank you for reading this! Please don’t bother to write any comment for me because I ain’t going to visit this blog again. My task here is done… looking for a new blogs and articles where people come and debate. I need to pour some acid on those seedlings so that the plant of hatred never becomes tree. Wish you all the best and Luck for you and your nations !! and please whenever you see blogs and threads like this PLEASE!! try to do something constructive… a request…. Bye!!!

643. # Religion Of Peace my Ass on 30 Dec 2010 at 11:15 am

     Pakistanis are always ready to fight, i dnt know why the hell they are so aggressive, god give then some peace, fucking bastards always support terrorists

644. # indian on 30 Dec 2010 at 8:34 pm

     @Saddam An Indian above said that “in NASA 3o % Engineers are Indians ” ! He lies , India apna to aek satellite nhi bana saka to NASA mein kia hand Practice ker rahe hein………………

     abe jaa na did ur father or mother make aryabhatta…and insat…………..

645. # diplomatic friend from india on 03 Jan 2011 at 11:00 am

     Dear Brothers from India & Pakistan,

     I have been browsing through some of the blogs and all I can find out is whether the person blogging is a Hindu or Muslin (Majority blogs) Indian or Pakistani (Majority blogs) want peace and a solution.
     OR some comments from Englishmen etc (few, some sensible, many not required) as they are responsible for the great divide in S.E Asia mainly Indo-Pak.
     We in India whether Hindu , Muslim, Sikh, Christian, etc are born to believe we have one major enemy. Which is Pakistan.
     I too was of the same opinion but when I was in London for my graduation there were students from Pakistan as well. Strangely we shared many things in common.

     1. Passion for country
     2. Passion for cricked
     3. Legacy of blaming each others country (who is stronger)
     4. Many more

     But our cultures are bounded in ways that are unbreakable. Islamic marriages in Pak are done the Hindu style with band baaja as normally done in Islam. As for me kurta pajama is a life line would not be possible without islam.

     The problem is far from resolved by just cussing on a blog.

     There are places where even India has gone wrong. People of Kashmir (Main issue of conflict) are oppressed and the Indian army has killed many civilians which is in-humane and not justified but what have the people of Kashmir who are suffering done to get back the Hindu Kashmiri Pandits nothing till now. They are just revolting against the army, efforts should be made to restore normalcy to the valley, give living rights to the Hindu Pandits (a community that has been a long resident of the valley). Acts of terrorism should be blocked whether arising from India or infiltrating from Pak. About the army one more thing, the situation for them is bullet, blood and threat to their individual lives without a choice as they wear the olive green (frustration and psycoligical problems are faced by all the armies of the world - agitation is the outcome) Equality for the all religions in Kashmir - diffusion of terrorism and you will see the role of the army reduce. If it dosen’t it is a pity.

     Second issue is religion. There are fanatics in every religion, india has the same but the administration has control. Where as in Pak it is a lawless country at lease the NWFP and Balochistan. Administration in Pak is a puppet and if any one of our Pak brothers denies it is definitely not honest. Hindu radicals exist and harm the integrity of our nation too but as compared to Pak I suppose the situation is a 100% better. The fact is the Islamis radicalism is affecting the world and Hindu radicalism only India. If feel Muslim countries all over the world should give equal rights to all religions. The world is a global village. Even today in UAE they dont allow to build a community worship temple for Hindus. There are lacks of Hindus living and doing business in UAE. All I think we need to focus is on equality towards humanity and religion. One more thing the Babri mosque demolition was wrong and the only solution is to build both temple and mosque and close the chapter.

     People of Pak are fun, great in humour, and good friends to have but trust world peace can only be achieved by Pak getting to destroy safe heavens of terror on their soil and India doing its little bit required as compared.

     Hope our Future Generations get to see peace.

     You might not see me again on this site or may not here from me again. Just pray some sense prevails.

     Question for all?

     Why do Hindus and Muslims fight over religion when you find Ali in (Diwali) and Ram in (Ramzan)

     Sincere apologies if I have hurt anyone. Jaado ki Jappi for all, Lets hope things at lease improve for a starter.

646. # Ari on 03 Jan 2011 at 1:31 pm

     I agree with this dude named Rajesh… great comments… Pakistanis, you feel bad about 1971 you say? you lost your ‘eastern wing’ you say… DO YOU KNOW NOW HOW WE FELT WHEN YOU IDIOTS WERE JUMPING DEMANDING YOUR OWN COUNTRY? We felt, who the hell are these people who come here and demand a part of our land as if it was their birthright. So forget 1971, Hinduism teaches Karma, everything you do, comes back to you. Don’t forget that ever, may it be a lesson to you. Why are you saying Hindu extremism?! They never killed anyone. They are not extremists, they are only traditional people who criticize Islam, critizing doesn’t make you an extremist. But plotting terror strikes like 9/11 and 26/11 does. So it’s best you shut up and leave this place to the Indians to celebrate (because this webpage shows India is better than you guys…)

     I know for a fact, from Youtube, that you people think India is the poorest country in the world… teach your countrymen, or you will be illiterate… and in bliss…

647. # vijay malothra on 04 Jan 2011 at 9:30 am

     @ A Muslim
     Honestly I am not against Islam - I don’t understand Pak.

     But as you spoke of religion - let me try to enlighten you.

     You luckey number 786 which no one know where it came from is actually the oam in the hindu religion.

     plz refer to web site: http://www.ceveni.com/2010/01/number-786-in-islam-and-hinduism.html

     If you dont believe this please explain how it came / beides saying god gave it

     about the kabba in arabia: the black stone is a shiv lingham

     Please refer: Haram Al Haram Kaaba-Hindu Shiva Temple Garbhagriha Black Stone Shivalinga More similarities (on you tube)

     All I know there is one God who we call Bhagwan and you Allah.

     Accept it.

     You religion is deceptive not Hinduism. You say islam cant harm anyone but islam is responsible for terror activities all over the world. India, US , UK, etc in the name of holy war. Your religion is deceptive and you chaps are deceived by it.

     Accept this and reduce the pain to prove you right cause you definitely not.